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Post by darkpast on Jul 13, 2018 21:34:00 GMT
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Post by politicidal on Jul 14, 2018 14:00:04 GMT
Beauty and the Beast...
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Post by amyghost on Jul 14, 2018 14:23:41 GMT
Somehow, I see very few people keeling over dead from shock at the revelation that film producers swap roles for sexual favors. The point is, did Weinstein physically force any woman into a sexual encounter? If he coerced them with promises of stardom in exchange for doing the nasty, then, regrettable as it is that this sort of behavior occurs, the fact remains that the women had agency--they could have said no and walked away. If they agreed to it, but felt poorly about themselves afterwards, again, unfortunate, but not criminal. If Weinstein is a rapist in the legal, as opposed to moral, sense of the word, he should get the book thrown at him; and I don't have a lot of doubt that he may be. But it needs to be proven in a court of law for him to be imprisoned. How he fares at the hands of his peers' judgement and the public's is another matter, and one he'll be stuck with no matter which way a legal verdict goes, however. |
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Post by faustus5 on Jul 14, 2018 14:33:45 GMT
Excuse me, jackass, but Lawrence wasn't one of the women involved with him. She worked in exactly one movie with him and did so because the director wanted her in the movie after watching a Skype audition. Plus, Weinstein's MO was to prey on vulnerable, up and coming actresses who needed a boost to their careers. When she was signed for Silver Linings, she was already a famous Oscar nominee and signed for two different high profile franchises.
But you're nothing but a mindless troll, so facts are probably not much of a concern for the likes of you.
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Post by amyghost on Jul 14, 2018 14:41:23 GMT
I've run hot and cold on Taki for years--he can be very funny and on point about some of the celebrity world he inhabits and reports on--but I don't think I'd ever turn to him for hard news on any story, and have my doubts he's all that reliable as a journalist in any meaningful sense of the word.
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jul 14, 2018 17:50:43 GMT
There's nothing shocking in that statement.
It's obvious.
Call me naive though-I actually thought his wife married him because of affection/respect.
Kind of sad it was all a business arrangement.
The crime here is the extent of what he did, and the cover up(aided by others).
This is what it not being addressed.
Everyone knew what he was doing but didnt stop it.
WHY?
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Post by deembastille on Jul 15, 2018 0:40:05 GMT
But they also accepted his offer/ 'contract'.
At what point will people take responsibility for their own part of things?
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Post by kleinreturns on Jul 15, 2018 11:16:29 GMT
Harvey is an idiotic scumbag.
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Post by politicidal on Jul 16, 2018 19:04:04 GMT
Harvey is an idiotic scumbag. Which means he'll probably be the focus of one of those Oscar bait true-life crime stories. Maybe Jonah Hill can play him in ten years. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 16, 2018 19:23:24 GMT
If they accepted his offer and had consensual sex with him its not rape
If they refused his offer and he forced himself on them than its rape.
If this opinion offends you lets me just say that i don`t care if it offends you.
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Post by deembastille on Jul 16, 2018 21:03:25 GMT
If they accepted his offer and had consensual sex with him its not rape If they refused his offer and he forced himself on them than its rape. If this opinion offends you lets me just say that i don`t care if it offends you. Exactly. Just because he propositioned something doesn't mean they must accept. He promised them a job in exchange for sex... it was their decision to make. Not rape, girls! #takeresponsibility. |
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Post by faustus5 on Jul 18, 2018 16:51:35 GMT
If they accepted his offer and had consensual sex with him its not rape If they refused his offer and he forced himself on them than its rape. If this opinion offends you lets me just say that i don`t care if it offends you. You're leaving out the part where he actively attempted to destroy careers if his propositions weren't accepted, and also sprung surprises on unsuspecting actresses by changing meeting venues to his room and then showing up naked. Doesn't count as rape, does count as sexual harassment. Regardless, he's an evil creep. |
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Post by deembastille on Jul 18, 2018 17:55:51 GMT
If they accepted his offer and had consensual sex with him its not rape If they refused his offer and he forced himself on them than its rape. If this opinion offends you lets me just say that i don`t care if it offends you. You're leaving out the part where he actively attempted to destroy careers if his propositions weren't accepted, and also sprung surprises on unsuspecting actresses by changing meeting venues to his room and then showing up naked. Doesn't count as rape, does count as sexual harassment. Regardless, he's an evil creep. How many times has that NOT happened irl with many people? That happens more often than most. The male ap at my school has been in and is again in hot water for doing just that. That being said... If they DID take him up on his demand, it is still up to them to follow through. They should not be hashtagging anything or anyone because the ball was in their court regardless. |
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Post by faustus5 on Jul 18, 2018 18:29:50 GMT
That being said... If they DID take him up on his demand, it is still up to them to follow through. They should not be hashtagging anything or anyone because the ball was in their court regardless. So easy to write this when you aren't in their situation feeling the pressure they were under, and not prepared for. |
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Post by deembastille on Jul 18, 2018 19:30:43 GMT
That being said... If they DID take him up on his demand, it is still up to them to follow through. They should not be hashtagging anything or anyone because the ball was in their court regardless. So easy to write this when you aren't in their situation feeling the pressure they were under, and not prepared for. So easy to miss: "MY MALE AP has gotten caught pulling this shit". He still does it. I have been there. I stuck to my guns and dealt with it appropriately. With a colleague I just stayed away from him. With the AP I went to the union. |
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Post by transfuged on Jul 18, 2018 22:45:14 GMT
Somehow, I see very few people keeling over dead from shock at the revelation that film producers swap roles for sexual favors. The point is, did Weinstein physically force any woman into a sexual encounter? If he coerced them with promises of stardom in exchange for doing the nasty, then, regrettable as it is that this sort of behavior occurs, the fact remains that the women had agency--they could have said no and walked away. If they agreed to it, but felt poorly about themselves afterwards, again, unfortunate, but not criminal. If Weinstein is a rapist in the legal, as opposed to moral, sense of the word, he should get the book thrown at him; and I don't have a lot of doubt that he may be. But it needs to be proven in a court of law for him to be imprisoned. How he fares at the hands of his peers' judgement and the public's is another matter, and one he'll be stuck with no matter which way a legal verdict goes, however. Hello, I'd say it depends on how rape is defined in the States. Considering he has lawyers and he is admitting this, it must be different than in countries where rape is defined with the reference to surprise. (Eg : Sexual aggression is any sexual assault committed with violence, constraint, threat or surprise. In this occurence, when someone goes for a business meeting and her partner wants sex, that can be an element of surprise. The elements are alternative, not cumulative. Surprise is enough, it does not call for violence. Someone could have the sex under the impression that when they don't, they won't get a job. Which means they are not willing to, they consent is not free.) Till later, T And that definition is out of the official translation of the -not american- penal code. 'sexual assault' is used when the native tongue says 'rape'. |
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Post by amyghost on Jul 18, 2018 22:51:52 GMT
This is given online by the US DOJ archives as the 'updated' legal definition of rape: www.justice.gov/archives/opa/blog/updated-definition-rape'Element of surprise' does not seem to enter into this definition, if I'm reading it correctly; only the inability to give consent due to incapacity, or where the victim is a minor. I suspect the North American legal definition is probably less nuanced than what appertains in some European nations' legal codes. |
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Post by deembastille on Jul 18, 2018 22:53:52 GMT
transfuged it got nothing to do with law in US. His lawyers are paid to find loophole after loophole after loophole. It's not about right or wrong it's about how smooth a talker your lawyer is and how strong "the force" is ( think Jedi mind tricks) with them. Guilty as sin people have gotten off or a "slap on the wrist (considering)". It kinda pays to live in the states, have $$$ and be an asshole, it looks like. 😊
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Post by transfuged on Jul 18, 2018 23:10:13 GMT
transfuged it got nothing to do with law in US. His lawyers are paid to find loophole after loophole after loophole. It's not about right or wrong it's about how smooth a talker your lawyer is and how strong "the force" is ( think Jedi mind tricks) with them. Guilty as sin people have gotten off or a "slap on the wrist (considering)". It kinda pays to live in the states, have $$$ and be an asshole, it looks like. 😊 Sight, When in law school, we were constantly told justice was not about good or evil... I trusted them. They were my teachers. I'm not so sure, after all those years. They might have been hum, lying. The talking thing, yes, sure. When you go into court with only the truth on your side and no rhetorics, you'll met a judge who will tell you to get out of her court and come back with a lawyer. (Her chambers, for UK users, my bad). But that's not a matter of justice, strictly speaking. It reflects the society men who juges others live in... Till later, T |
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Post by transfuged on Jul 18, 2018 23:59:14 GMT
This is given online by the US DOJ archives as the 'updated' legal definition of rape: www.justice.gov/archives/opa/blog/updated-definition-rape'Element of surprise' does not seem to enter into this definition, if I'm reading it correctly; only the inability to give consent due to incapacity, or where the victim is a minor. I suspect the North American legal definition is probably less nuanced than what appertains in some European nations' legal codes. I found that definition on the United States department of justice website. The element of surprise in the definition is, as a matter of fact, an element of the 'consent'. Force is although about consent but the effect on will is different . When there is surprise, will is not free. When there is force, there is no will. They say that force destroys will. The enumeration is made so that each separate occurence is enough to qualify the offense as rape. Now, about practical fact, about consent, the justice that applies that definition considers that any kind of intercourse can turn into rape. When one partner says no, but the other does not take it as a no, what has began willingly can be brought into justice as rape. So, well, I suppose when someone wants to know, all they need is to go to a library and search all the american jurisprudence about consent. Good day, and good luck. Till later, T |
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