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Post by Aj_June on Jan 17, 2019 4:27:44 GMT
Meli had a strange interest and fascination with Jon. You could tell by the importance she was giving him. I wonder if she would have that much interest in a Stark bastard. Accepted even as a bastard one might have the royal blood that could be of importance to Meli (ex - Gendry) but her treatment to Jon was slightly different. Meli subplot is quite interesting. I do wonder what role she has to play in season8 if any.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jan 17, 2019 5:57:29 GMT
The look she gave him over the pyre in the S4 finale was the first confirmation of Jon's parentage I can remember.
She will say in S6E01 that she saw him in the flames, explaining why she cared that way. As ever, she doesn't have the full picture, only hints. She sees Jon, so she must assume he is special but she doesn't know more.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jan 17, 2019 7:41:42 GMT
I must add this whole business is by far the least interesting part of the story.
It looks like some juvenile fantasy fool has grafted a fully unrelated fake technological enigma onto a study of human psychology to make it interesting to people who like to discuss magic swords or the running speed of unicorns,
In addition, it is a cop out from the author(s) using that for "ex machina" resolutions.
Have a priestess convince people of following some predictions for various reasons and we have an adult theme. Have them rooted in some unexplained but allegedly real phenomena in a fantasy world and we're back to children's fare. GRRM's a hack.
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Seto
Sophomore
@seto
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Post by Seto on Jan 17, 2019 10:28:56 GMT
Meli had a strange interest and fascination with Jon. Yes she does. In 'A Dance with Dragons' we find out that Mel isn't as sure of her visions as she lets on. She still believes that Stannis is Azor Ahai, but she also thinks Jon is important somehow. Ultimately she's mainly in there to foreshadow Jon's stabbing. D&D expanded on this, making her the one to raise Jon from the dead and transferring Azor Ahai over to him in her eyes after Stannis' death. Hard to say if this will go down the same way in the book. So what does that mean for Season 8?? Well I think Carice Van Houten will return, as D&D absolutely love her. As to what capacity is less certain. Preston Jacobs theorised she may return with an army from Asshai, although I'm not convinced on that.
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Post by Aj_June on Jan 18, 2019 0:20:00 GMT
Meli had a strange interest and fascination with Jon. Yes she does. In 'A Dance with Dragons' we find out that Mel isn't as sure of her visions as she lets on. She still believes that Stannis is Azor Ahai, but she also thinks Jon is important somehow. Ultimately she's mainly in there to foreshadow Jon's stabbing. D&D expanded on this, making her the one to raise Jon from the dead and transferring Azor Ahai over to him in her eyes after Stannis' death. Hard to say if this will go down the same way in the book. So what does that mean for Season 8?? Well I think Carice Van Houten will return, as D&D absolutely love her. As to what capacity is less certain. Preston Jacobs theorised she may return with an army from Asshai, although I'm not convinced on that. Although it could be a mere co-incidence she also said that "You don't know nothing, Jon Snow" line.
Yeah, I am also not sure about bringing an army from Asshai prediction. IMO, there's no time for all that and it would look strange to suddenly bring Asshai people in it.
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Post by Aj_June on Jan 18, 2019 0:21:36 GMT
I must add this whole business is by far the least interesting part of the story. It looks like some juvenile fantasy fool has grafted a fully unrelated fake technological enigma onto a study of human psychology to make it interesting to people who like to discuss magic swords or the running speed of unicorns, In addition, it is a cop out from the author(s) using that for "ex machina" resolutions. Have a priestess convince people of following some predictions for various reasons and we have an adult theme. Have them rooted in some unexplained but allegedly real phenomena in a fantasy world and we're back to children's fare. GRRM's a hack. I am not too fond of magic elements, especially warging abilities of Starks, though I find Meli character fairly interesting. If they could have only let the magic part be less explicit.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jan 18, 2019 0:55:24 GMT
Yeah, I am also not sure about bringing an army from Asshai prediction. IMO, there's no time for all that and it would look strange to suddenly bring Asshai people in it. There are no armies in Asshai.
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Seto
Sophomore
@seto
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Post by Seto on Jan 18, 2019 3:19:00 GMT
I am not too fond of magic elements, especially warging abilities of Starks, though I find Meli character fairly interesting. If they could have only let the magic part be less explicit. Fair enough if your against it, but the series is actually pretty low on the magic side compared to many other fantasy stories. Actually in the books, Martin tries to subtly give a more scientific explanation for a lot of the magical elements in the story. Before 'Ice and Fire' he was a big Sci-Fi writer, and one of the things he often incorporated into his stories was characters with the ability to project their consciousness outside of their bodies into other people or things via telekinesis. So Mel's shadow baby, is likely a projection of Stannis' consciousness. Beric and Catelyn's resurrection could just be their consciousness returning to their body. Warging and Skinchanging, same thing, they are sending their minds telekinetically into other animals. When it comes to visions and prophecy, they are likely telekinetically sent by characters like the Three Eye Crow. So yeah, I think Martin does a really great job of walking that line of magic and Sci-Fi, making the series a lot more grounded.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jan 18, 2019 4:39:39 GMT
I am not too fond of magic elements, especially warging abilities of Starks, though I find Meli character fairly interesting. If they could have only let the magic part be less explicit. Fair enough if your against it, but the series is actually pretty low on the magic side compared to many other fantasy stories. Actually in the books, Martin tries to subtly give a more scientific explanation for a lot of the magical elements in the story. Before 'Ice and Fire' he was a big Sci-Fi writer… This is correct and while it appears more interesting at first, it still is a focus on how things work. I prefer the aspects of the story which deal with how people think. I must say I never cared for sci-fi either. Maybe having studied physics in all its scope makes me terribly unimpressed to annoyed at what authors come up with.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jan 18, 2019 6:28:04 GMT
So Mel's shadow baby, is likely a projection of Stannis' consciousness. Beric and Catelyn's resurrection could just be their consciousness returning to their body. Warging and Skinchanging, same thing, they are sending their minds telekinetically into other animals. When it comes to visions and prophecy, they are likely telekinetically sent by characters like the Three Eye Crow. Stannis is definitely "warging" outside in the open to kill Renly in the book, while being in a deep sleep in the very morning of the expected battle. The hints are clear. Visions are very likely sent through some communication backbone and there is a moment in which Melisandre sees Bran and the Three-Eyed Raven in the fire. Of course, she does not know them. Prophecies are not directly related to this. They are stories people agree to believe in, like Cersei does, but then, if someone is going to manipulate people, why not refer to the stories they already heard for better effect? The show did well to do away will all that crap and concentrate on realistic psychology as much as it could. It makes the characters better. They are not as crazed or sexually driven either. |
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