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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 17, 2019 21:31:13 GMT
You fail to distinguish facts from opinions and wild guesses. Your faith is blind, the most dangerous kind. Since you never offer up any corroboration or link to authorities for your various opinions on this board, and then either leave the thread or obfuscate when such things are asked for, I think it is easy to distinguish between wild guesses and inconvenient facts quite well enough. But thank you anyway. And I still wait to be told what 'my atheism' is. You appear to have the advantage in that you tend to arrive at conclusions with nothing more than orders from what you imagine is authority. I usually have no conclusions and therefore no authority to challenge you. I have no conclusion what the temperature of the "planet" is, nor whether it changed by a degree. My only point in that argument is that you have no reason to conclude anything either. A conclusion requires an argument. The ball is in your court. No, there is no authoritative source that has "proved" what the temperature of the "planet" is, especially to within a degree, at least none that I am aware. I have no conclusion whether the eustatic sea level rises one-eighth inch per year. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You have again failed to understand the concept of precision. Again there is no authority that does conclude anything. Your tendency to jump to conclusions is probably the result of having to believe that your authority has given you sufficient answers to carry out your orders from them. In other words it is your total dependence on authority that requires conclusions. You are obviously not fit to be the "boss" yourself so you have imagined some "authority" that you serve should be the boss. I have no conclusion about the age of the Earth. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You believe you have enough information for a conclusion because having conclusions is necessary for you to follow orders. You have the mind of a small child that can do nothing without detailed orders. You create details and conclusions that do not exist to justify yourself. I have no conclusions on relativity, progress against cancer, heart or now hand transplants, and many other supposed "facts." If you have enough evidence to believe in those things then you really are special. It is obvious however that you are not well equipped to educate anyone on them. I will not leave the thread on orders from you. If you continually fail to provide any evidence other than links to "authorities" you fail to understand, then perhaps you should leave, as I explained here. Your atheism, and I do mean you specifically here, is a blind faith in science, and a blind faith that there is no god. It appears you still fail to see when yours are just as much opinions as any raving fundamentalist. There is one conclusion I am prepared to make and that is intelligent design has educational value. It is only by brute force of the courts that its educational value is forbidden in public school classrooms. Again we see how you work, by blind acceptance of authority. It is your incorrect conclusion that an intelligent designer is not required that is the problem.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Mar 17, 2019 22:12:03 GMT
Since you never offer up any corroboration or link to authorities for your various opinions on this board, and then either leave the thread or obfuscate when such things are asked for, I think it is easy to distinguish between wild guesses and inconvenient facts quite well enough. But thank you anyway. And I still wait to be told what 'my atheism' is. You appear to have the advantage in that you tend to arrive at conclusions with nothing more than orders from what you imagine is authority. I usually have no conclusions and therefore no authority to challenge you. I have no conclusion what the temperature of the "planet" is, nor whether it changed by a degree. My only point in that argument is that you have no reason to conclude anything either. A conclusion requires an argument. The ball is in your court. No, there is no authoritative source that has "proved" what the temperature of the "planet" is, especially to within a degree, at least none that I am aware. I have no conclusion whether the eustatic sea level rises one-eighth inch per year. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You have again failed to understand the concept of precision. Again there is no authority that does conclude anything. Your tendency to jump to conclusions is probably the result of having to believe that your authority has given you sufficient answers to carry out your orders from them. In other words it is your total dependence on authority that requires conclusions. You are obviously not fit to be the "boss" yourself so you have imagined some "authority" that you serve should be the boss. I have no conclusion about the age of the Earth. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You believe you have enough information for a conclusion because having conclusions is necessary for you to follow orders. You have the mind of a small child that can do nothing without detailed orders. You create details and conclusions that do not exist to justify yourself. I have no conclusions on relativity, progress against cancer, heart or now hand transplants, and many other supposed "facts." If you have enough evidence to believe in those things then you really are special. It is obvious however that you are not well equipped to educate anyone on them. I will not leave the thread on orders from you. If you continually fail to provide any evidence other than links to "authorities" you fail to understand, then perhaps you should leave, as I explained here. Your atheism, and I do mean you specifically here, is a blind faith in science, and a blind faith that there is no god. It appears you still fail to see when yours are just as much opinions as any raving fundamentalist. There is one conclusion I am prepared to make and that is intelligent design has educational value. It is only by brute force of the courts that its educational value is forbidden in public school classrooms. Again we see how you work, by blind acceptance of authority. It is your incorrect conclusion that an intelligent designer is not required that is the problem. My opinion, which carries exactly the same weight, is that most of your opinions expressed above are wrong or wrong-headed and, worse, now you are dissembling. To suggest that science cannot reach or has not really reached a consensus or conclusion on the topics you mention since you do not agree with it is peculiar. But, sadly, as expected.
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Post by goz on Mar 17, 2019 22:15:58 GMT
Since you never offer up any corroboration or link to authorities for your various opinions on this board, and then either leave the thread or obfuscate when such things are asked for, I think it is easy to distinguish between wild guesses and inconvenient facts quite well enough. But thank you anyway. And I still wait to be told what 'my atheism' is. You appear to have the advantage in that you tend to arrive at conclusions with nothing more than orders from what you imagine is authority. I usually have no conclusions and therefore no authority to challenge you. I have no conclusion what the temperature of the "planet" is, nor whether it changed by a degree. My only point in that argument is that you have no reason to conclude anything either. A conclusion requires an argument. The ball is in your court. No, there is no authoritative source that has "proved" what the temperature of the "planet" is, especially to within a degree, at least none that I am aware. I have no conclusion whether the eustatic sea level rises one-eighth inch per year. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You have again failed to understand the concept of precision. Again there is no authority that does conclude anything. Your tendency to jump to conclusions is probably the result of having to believe that your authority has given you sufficient answers to carry out your orders from them. In other words it is your total dependence on authority that requires conclusions. You are obviously not fit to be the "boss" yourself so you have imagined some "authority" that you serve should be the boss. I have no conclusion about the age of the Earth. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You believe you have enough information for a conclusion because having conclusions is necessary for you to follow orders. You have the mind of a small child that can do nothing without detailed orders. You create details and conclusions that do not exist to justify yourself. I have no conclusions on relativity, progress against cancer, heart or now hand transplants, and many other supposed "facts." If you have enough evidence to believe in those things then you really are special. It is obvious however that you are not well equipped to educate anyone on them. I will not leave the thread on orders from you. If you continually fail to provide any evidence other than links to "authorities" you fail to understand, then perhaps you should leave, as I explained here. Your atheism, and I do mean you specifically here, is a blind faith in science, and a blind faith that there is no god. It appears you still fail to see when yours are just as much opinions as any raving fundamentalist. There is one conclusion I am prepared to make and that is intelligent design has educational value. It is only by brute force of the courts that its educational value is forbidden in public school classrooms. Again we see how you work, by blind acceptance of authority. It is your incorrect conclusion that an intelligent designer is not required that is the problem. What a load of bollocks. The whole lot of this pathetic diatribe. I had this conversation with you before when you told me that there is no such thing as heart transplants for instance and in your terms of what constitutes a fact ( unlike the rest of us who adhere to fact based scientific principles) seeing for oneself... I told you that a friend of mine had a heart lung transplant due to Cystic Fibrosis. After knowing him for 25 years and seeing him sick, after visiting him in the hospital, after seeing his wound where the surgery took place, after seeing him recover thanks to this science and medical techniques, I came to the conclusion that he had had a successful heart lung transplant and now lives an improved life including being the father to a young baby. You really are a delusional stupid arrogant old man! Of course there is no intelligent designer or god, because there is no evidence for one...at all, and conclusive evidence for evolution the Big Bang Theory and a general understanding of how things work built up over time with knowledge built on knowledge to a point where we can fly astronauts in space, have sophisticated communications globally and have advanced medical technologies to cure people with disease. To claim otherwise, as you do, is just abject nonsense.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 17, 2019 22:21:30 GMT
You appear to have the advantage in that you tend to arrive at conclusions with nothing more than orders from what you imagine is authority. I usually have no conclusions and therefore no authority to challenge you. I have no conclusion what the temperature of the "planet" is, nor whether it changed by a degree. My only point in that argument is that you have no reason to conclude anything either. A conclusion requires an argument. The ball is in your court. No, there is no authoritative source that has "proved" what the temperature of the "planet" is, especially to within a degree, at least none that I am aware. I have no conclusion whether the eustatic sea level rises one-eighth inch per year. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You have again failed to understand the concept of precision. Again there is no authority that does conclude anything. Your tendency to jump to conclusions is probably the result of having to believe that your authority has given you sufficient answers to carry out your orders from them. In other words it is your total dependence on authority that requires conclusions. You are obviously not fit to be the "boss" yourself so you have imagined some "authority" that you serve should be the boss. I have no conclusion about the age of the Earth. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You believe you have enough information for a conclusion because having conclusions is necessary for you to follow orders. You have the mind of a small child that can do nothing without detailed orders. You create details and conclusions that do not exist to justify yourself. I have no conclusions on relativity, progress against cancer, heart or now hand transplants, and many other supposed "facts." If you have enough evidence to believe in those things then you really are special. It is obvious however that you are not well equipped to educate anyone on them. I will not leave the thread on orders from you. If you continually fail to provide any evidence other than links to "authorities" you fail to understand, then perhaps you should leave, as I explained here. Your atheism, and I do mean you specifically here, is a blind faith in science, and a blind faith that there is no god. It appears you still fail to see when yours are just as much opinions as any raving fundamentalist. There is one conclusion I am prepared to make and that is intelligent design has educational value. It is only by brute force of the courts that its educational value is forbidden in public school classrooms. Again we see how you work, by blind acceptance of authority. It is your incorrect conclusion that an intelligent designer is not required that is the problem. My opinion, which carries exactly the same weight, is that most of your opinions expressed above are wrong or wrong-headed and, worse, now you are dissembling. You appear confused about who's dismissing whom here. If you now recognize that yours are merely opinions then indeed you need no further data or arguments from any authority any more than I do. Any "resolution" you hoped to obtain is readily dismissed though.
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Post by gadreel on Mar 17, 2019 22:24:52 GMT
I heard about it just as we went to the Slayer concert.
Very sobering and a little bit strange to go to the concert afterwards. This is a huge attack in reference to NZ, it's affected pretty much everyone here, on the brightside it has ousted a couple of racists on facebook.
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Post by gadreel on Mar 17, 2019 22:26:17 GMT
Kia kaha Aotearoa. This senseless act of terrorism is not us. We are whānau. Kia kotaku rā. Tātou tātou e. "We are a proud nation of more than 200 ethnicities, 160 languages. And amongst that diversity we share common values. And the one that we place the currency on right now is our compassion and support for the community of those directly affected by this tragedy. And secondly, the strongest possible condemnation of the ideology of the people who did this. You may have chosen us – we utterly reject and condemn you." - Jacinda Ardern
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Mar 17, 2019 22:31:17 GMT
My opinion, which carries exactly the same weight, is that most of your opinions expressed above are wrong or wrong-headed and, worse, now you are dissembling. You appear confused about who's dismissing whom here. If you now recognize that yours are merely opinions then indeed you need no further data or arguments from any authority any more than I do. Any "resolution" you hoped to obtain is readily dismissed though. That's your opinion and the same applies. I hope that helps.
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Post by goz on Mar 17, 2019 22:48:08 GMT
Kia kaha Aotearoa. This senseless act of terrorism is not us. We are whānau. Kia kotaku rā. Tātou tātou e. "We are a proud nation of more than 200 ethnicities, 160 languages. And amongst that diversity we share common values. And the one that we place the currency on right now is our compassion and support for the community of those directly affected by this tragedy. And secondly, the strongest possible condemnation of the ideology of the people who did this. You may have chosen us – we utterly reject and condemn you." - Jacinda Ardern I want to kidnap her and bring her here to Australia to replace the current set of arse clowns we have here purporting to be a government! I will mind the baby!
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Post by gadreel on Mar 17, 2019 23:48:47 GMT
Kia kaha Aotearoa. This senseless act of terrorism is not us. We are whānau. Kia kotaku rā. Tātou tātou e. "We are a proud nation of more than 200 ethnicities, 160 languages. And amongst that diversity we share common values. And the one that we place the currency on right now is our compassion and support for the community of those directly affected by this tragedy. And secondly, the strongest possible condemnation of the ideology of the people who did this. You may have chosen us – we utterly reject and condemn you." - Jacinda Ardern I want to kidnap her and bring her here to Australia to replace the current set of arse clowns we have here purporting to be a government! I will mind the baby! Yeah, right wing rhetoric aside, she is a good leader.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 9:04:51 GMT
You appear to have the advantage in that you tend to arrive at conclusions with nothing more than orders from what you imagine is authority. I usually have no conclusions and therefore no authority to challenge you. I have no conclusion what the temperature of the "planet" is, nor whether it changed by a degree. My only point in that argument is that you have no reason to conclude anything either. A conclusion requires an argument. The ball is in your court. No, there is no authoritative source that has "proved" what the temperature of the "planet" is, especially to within a degree, at least none that I am aware. I have no conclusion whether the eustatic sea level rises one-eighth inch per year. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You have again failed to understand the concept of precision. Again there is no authority that does conclude anything. Your tendency to jump to conclusions is probably the result of having to believe that your authority has given you sufficient answers to carry out your orders from them. In other words it is your total dependence on authority that requires conclusions. You are obviously not fit to be the "boss" yourself so you have imagined some "authority" that you serve should be the boss. I have no conclusion about the age of the Earth. My only point in that argument is that you shouldn't either. You believe you have enough information for a conclusion because having conclusions is necessary for you to follow orders. You have the mind of a small child that can do nothing without detailed orders. You create details and conclusions that do not exist to justify yourself. I have no conclusions on relativity, progress against cancer, heart or now hand transplants, and many other supposed "facts." If you have enough evidence to believe in those things then you really are special. It is obvious however that you are not well equipped to educate anyone on them. I will not leave the thread on orders from you. If you continually fail to provide any evidence other than links to "authorities" you fail to understand, then perhaps you should leave, as I explained here. Your atheism, and I do mean you specifically here, is a blind faith in science, and a blind faith that there is no god. It appears you still fail to see when yours are just as much opinions as any raving fundamentalist. There is one conclusion I am prepared to make and that is intelligent design has educational value. It is only by brute force of the courts that its educational value is forbidden in public school classrooms. Again we see how you work, by blind acceptance of authority. It is your incorrect conclusion that an intelligent designer is not required that is the problem. What a load of bollocks. The whole lot of this pathetic diatribe. I had this conversation with you before when you told me that there is no such thing as heart transplants for instance and in your terms of what constitutes a fact ( unlike the rest of us who adhere to fact based scientific principles) seeing for oneself... I told you that a friend of mine had a heart lung transplant due to Cystic Fibrosis. After knowing him for 25 years and seeing him sick, after visiting him in the hospital, after seeing his wound where the surgery took place, after seeing him recover thanks to this science and medical techniques, I came to the conclusion that he had had a successful heart lung transplant and now lives an improved life including being the father to a young baby. You really are a delusional stupid arrogant old man! Of course there is no intelligent designer or god, because there is no evidence for one...at all, and conclusive evidence for evolution the Big Bang Theory and a general understanding of how things work built up over time with knowledge built on knowledge to a point where we can fly astronauts in space, have sophisticated communications globally and have advanced medical technologies to cure people with disease. To claim otherwise, as you do, is just abject nonsense. People claim healing day in and day out for all sorts of reasons. I don't believe many of the faith healing claims, especially those that go beyond what OTC pain relievers can do. Do you? If we both don't believe them, why should I believe you? If I do believe you, why shouldn't we both believe the faith healers? You are certain you have more evidence, yet you provide the same amount of evidence. I tend to believe people more if I've known them 25 years and I suppose you should too, but I haven't known you or your friend 25 years. You aren't even real life people I've known five minutes. Even if I did believe your friend was sick, got better, and there is a scar, which I don't, that isn't proof of any transplant. This is a perfectly logical attitude. People with extraordinary evidence are special. Maybe you do have extraordinary evidence and are special. I'm special too, I just don't claim it. I don't expect you to believe I'm special, that is. I wouldn't even attempt to prove it. I've known people 25 years who have had extraordinary evidence, but they have enough sense not to expect anyone to believe them unless those others can see the same evidence themselves, which they cannot. So I don't ask anyone else to believe them. Why do you expect me to believe your extraordinary evidence? You must not understand how this works at all, speaking of your abject nonsense. It is also a perfectly logical attitude to dismiss your claims. Yes, there is proof that the designer of the first life on Earth is not found in nature. You know this much yourself, no such designer has been found in nature yet. Where we differ is your expectation that it can be found, which is nonsense since every possible combination of primordial conditions has been tried without success. In your blind allegiance to authority you forbid even the discussion of this obvious truth in schools.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 10:09:27 GMT
People claim healing day in and day out for all sorts of reasons. I don't believe many of the faith healing claims, especially those that go beyond what OTC pain relievers can do. Do you? If we both don't believe them, why should I believe you? If I do believe you, why shouldn't we both believe the faith healers? You are certain you have more evidence, yet you provide the same amount of evidence. I tend to believe people more if I've known them 25 years and I suppose you should too, but I haven't known you or your friend 25 years. You aren't even real life people I've known five minutes. Even if I did believe your friend was sick, got better, and there is a scar, which I don't, that isn't proof of any transplant. This is a perfectly logical attitude. People with extraordinary evidence are special. Maybe you do have extraordinary evidence and are special. I'm special too, I just don't claim it. I don't expect you to believe I'm special, that is. I wouldn't even attempt to prove it. I've known people 25 years who have had extraordinary evidence, but they have enough sense not to expect anyone to believe them unless those others can see the same evidence themselves, which they cannot. So I don't ask anyone else to believe them. Why do you expect me to believe your extraordinary evidence? You must not understand how this works at all, speaking of your abject nonsense. It is also a perfectly logical attitude to dismiss your claims. Yes, there is proof that the designer of the first life on Earth is not found in nature. You know this much yourself, no such designer has been found in nature yet. Where we differ is your expectation that it can be found, which is nonsense since every possible combination of primordial conditions has been tried without success. In your blind allegiance to authority you forbid even the discussion of this obvious truth in schools. Others do it for you Arlon... Humor, it is to laugh.
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Post by goz on Mar 18, 2019 19:51:59 GMT
What a load of bollocks. The whole lot of this pathetic diatribe. I had this conversation with you before when you told me that there is no such thing as heart transplants for instance and in your terms of what constitutes a fact ( unlike the rest of us who adhere to fact based scientific principles) seeing for oneself... I told you that a friend of mine had a heart lung transplant due to Cystic Fibrosis. After knowing him for 25 years and seeing him sick, after visiting him in the hospital, after seeing his wound where the surgery took place, after seeing him recover thanks to this science and medical techniques, I came to the conclusion that he had had a successful heart lung transplant and now lives an improved life including being the father to a young baby. You really are a delusional stupid arrogant old man! Of course there is no intelligent designer or god, because there is no evidence for one...at all, and conclusive evidence for evolution the Big Bang Theory and a general understanding of how things work built up over time with knowledge built on knowledge to a point where we can fly astronauts in space, have sophisticated communications globally and have advanced medical technologies to cure people with disease. To claim otherwise, as you do, is just abject nonsense. People claim healing day in and day out for all sorts of reasons. I don't believe many of the faith healing claims, especially those that go beyond what OTC pain relievers can do. Do you? If we both don't believe them, why should I believe you? If I do believe you, why shouldn't we both believe the faith healers? You are certain you have more evidence, yet you provide the same amount of evidence. I tend to believe people more if I've known them 25 years and I suppose you should too, but I haven't known you or your friend 25 years. You aren't even real life people I've known five minutes. Even if I did believe your friend was sick, got better, and there is a scar, which I don't, that isn't proof of any transplant. This is a perfectly logical attitude. People with extraordinary evidence are special. Maybe you do have extraordinary evidence and are special. I'm special too, I just don't claim it. I don't expect you to believe I'm special, that is. I wouldn't even attempt to prove it. I've known people 25 years who have had extraordinary evidence, but they have enough sense not to expect anyone to believe them unless those others can see the same evidence themselves, which they cannot. So I don't ask anyone else to believe them. Why do you expect me to believe your extraordinary evidence? You must not understand how this works at all, speaking of your abject nonsense. It is also a perfectly logical attitude to dismiss your claims. Yes, there is proof that the designer of the first life on Earth is not found in nature. You know this much yourself, no such designer has been found in nature yet. Where we differ is your expectation that it can be found, which is nonsense since every possible combination of primordial conditions has been tried without success. In your blind allegiance to authority you forbid even the discussion of this obvious truth in schools. So, if you don't believe someone you have posted with for over a decade due to you knowing everything better than anyone else and you haven't seen it for yourself, is crazily almost logical. Does this mean that because you haven't been to a hospital and witnessed a heart transplant operation, that they don't exist? Are you seriously saying that transplants don't happen because Planet Arlon doesn't witness them all? By this contorted and fallacious logic, I do indeed wonder why you are so insistent that there was an intelligent designer since you weren't there to witness it.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 21:46:08 GMT
People claim healing day in and day out for all sorts of reasons. I don't believe many of the faith healing claims, especially those that go beyond what OTC pain relievers can do. Do you? If we both don't believe them, why should I believe you? If I do believe you, why shouldn't we both believe the faith healers? You are certain you have more evidence, yet you provide the same amount of evidence. I tend to believe people more if I've known them 25 years and I suppose you should too, but I haven't known you or your friend 25 years. You aren't even real life people I've known five minutes. Even if I did believe your friend was sick, got better, and there is a scar, which I don't, that isn't proof of any transplant. This is a perfectly logical attitude. People with extraordinary evidence are special. Maybe you do have extraordinary evidence and are special. I'm special too, I just don't claim it. I don't expect you to believe I'm special, that is. I wouldn't even attempt to prove it. I've known people 25 years who have had extraordinary evidence, but they have enough sense not to expect anyone to believe them unless those others can see the same evidence themselves, which they cannot. So I don't ask anyone else to believe them. Why do you expect me to believe your extraordinary evidence? You must not understand how this works at all, speaking of your abject nonsense. It is also a perfectly logical attitude to dismiss your claims. Yes, there is proof that the designer of the first life on Earth is not found in nature. You know this much yourself, no such designer has been found in nature yet. Where we differ is your expectation that it can be found, which is nonsense since every possible combination of primordial conditions has been tried without success. In your blind allegiance to authority you forbid even the discussion of this obvious truth in schools. So, if you don't believe someone you have posted with for over a decade due to you knowing everything better than anyone else and you haven't seen it for yourself, is crazily almost logical. Does this mean that because you haven't been to a hospital and witnessed a heart transplant operation, that they don't exist? Are you seriously saying that transplants don't happen because Planet Arlon doesn't witness them all? By this contorted and fallacious logic, I do indeed wonder why you are so insistent that there was an intelligent designer since you weren't there to witness it. For a person so determined to be logical, you really aren't very good at it are you? If I haven't seen something that means I haven't seen it, that's all. It doesn't necessarily mean it's a fraud. It simply means I don't know and can't tell you whether it's a fraud. It might be happening for real all over the place, just not where I can see it. I did see a documentary on PBS about hip replacement surgery. It was very complete with varied camera angles, and little editing cuts, and not likely faked. Then too, there is no reason to doubt such basic construction techniques that require no splicing of nerves. Ever since then I have wanted to see a similar documentary of a heart transplant, but the only videos are not complete and not convincing. Again, that doesn't necessarily mean there isn't a great video out there somewhere that is very convincing, it just means I haven't seen it yet. If you were really as logical as you hope to be, I wouldn't have to explain all that. The situation with an intelligent designer is similar to the situation with gravity. There is no certain method that can defy gravity in repeated trials. In a similar way there is no method, certain or otherwise, by which RNA chains can be coaxed to build chains of any considerable length. One day a way to defy gravity might be discovered. I doubt it since there isn't anything left to try that might work. One day RNA chains might build longer and longer and longer chains, however there is nothing left to try that might work. There are only so many elements and only so many scenarios where the RNA chains might build that way. They have all already been tried. Believing they might originate life unaided is no longer logical. Your attitude is that anything can happen as long as it is not connected to any religion, which is obviously a psychotic reaction to the truth that no. anything cannot happen in nature.
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Post by gadreel on Mar 18, 2019 22:00:14 GMT
Kia kaha Aotearoa. This senseless act of terrorism is not us. We are whānau. Kia kotaku rā. Tātou tātou e. "We are a proud nation of more than 200 ethnicities, 160 languages. And amongst that diversity we share common values. And the one that we place the currency on right now is our compassion and support for the community of those directly affected by this tragedy. And secondly, the strongest possible condemnation of the ideology of the people who did this. You may have chosen us – we utterly reject and condemn you."- Jacinda Ardern Wrong call with condemn I feel. Rejecting the attitude of the perpetrators actions is understandable, but to condemn is very harsh and heavy and can come across as an ideology that just as hateful as the actions that are being abhorred. No condemn is the correct word. This is a lesson in the paradox of the tolerance of intolerance. As long as someone holds a view that is intolerant to the degree of White Supremacy, they must be condemned and rejected from society until they can fit in again, we ARE hateful of these people, we DO want them rejected from our society, keeping them in society while they continue to hold these views is abhorrent. If anything Jacinda's words are not harsh enough.
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Post by goz on Mar 18, 2019 22:29:13 GMT
So, if you don't believe someone you have posted with for over a decade due to you knowing everything better than anyone else and you haven't seen it for yourself, is crazily almost logical. Does this mean that because you haven't been to a hospital and witnessed a heart transplant operation, that they don't exist? Are you seriously saying that transplants don't happen because Planet Arlon doesn't witness them all? By this contorted and fallacious logic, I do indeed wonder why you are so insistent that there was an intelligent designer since you weren't there to witness it. For a person so determined to be logical, you really aren't very good at it are you? If I haven't seen something that means I haven't seen it, that's all. It doesn't necessarily mean it's a fraud. It simply means I don't know and can't tell you whether it's a fraud. It might be happening for real all over the place, just not where I can see it. I did see a documentary on PBS about hip replacement surgery. It was very complete with varied camera angles, and little editing cuts, and not likely faked. Then too, there is no reason to doubt such basic construction techniques that require no splicing of nerves. Ever since then I have wanted to see a similar documentary of a heart transplant, but the only videos are not complete and not convincing. Again, that doesn't necessarily mean there isn't a great video out there somewhere that is very convincing, it just means I haven't seen it yet. If you were really as logical as you hope to be, I wouldn't have to explain all that. The situation with an intelligent designer is similar to the situation with gravity. There is no certain method that can defy gravity in repeated trials. In a similar way there is no method, certain or otherwise, by which RNA chains can be coaxed to build chains of any considerable length. One day a way to defy gravity might be discovered. I doubt it since there isn't anything left to try that might work. One day RNA chains might build longer and longer and longer chains, however there is nothing left to try that might work. There are only so many elements and only so many scenarios where the RNA chains might build that way. They have all already been tried. Believing they might originate life unaided is no longer logical. Your attitude is that anything can happen as long as it is not connected to any religion, which is obviously a psychotic reaction to the truth that no. anything cannot happen in nature. Now you are dissembling. Having the totally illogical nature of your argument that there is no such thing as heart transplant surgery because you haven't seen it, pointed out to you, you are backing off and changing the goalposts. See the bolded parts. I didn't think that EVEN you could be quite this stupid, and your projection is epic. Seriously? Because you haven't seen a heart transplant live or a good video, they don't happen? BTW I must remember to tell my husband that he didn't actually have dual knee replacements 16 years ago, they were fake, because some small time small town idiot in USA hadn't seen a good enough video!!!!!!!!!. I can't even be bothered with your last paragraph as it is patently obvious that you are either a scientific illiterate or worse A Dunning Kruger effect exponent and an example of the concept that 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing'.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 22:54:27 GMT
For a person so determined to be logical, you really aren't very good at it are you? If I haven't seen something that means I haven't seen it, that's all. It doesn't necessarily mean it's a fraud. It simply means I don't know and can't tell you whether it's a fraud. It might be happening for real all over the place, just not where I can see it. I did see a documentary on PBS about hip replacement surgery. It was very complete with varied camera angles, and little editing cuts, and not likely faked. Then too, there is no reason to doubt such basic construction techniques that require no splicing of nerves. Ever since then I have wanted to see a similar documentary of a heart transplant, but the only videos are not complete and not convincing. Again, that doesn't necessarily mean there isn't a great video out there somewhere that is very convincing, it just means I haven't seen it yet. If you were really as logical as you hope to be, I wouldn't have to explain all that. The situation with an intelligent designer is similar to the situation with gravity. There is no certain method that can defy gravity in repeated trials. In a similar way there is no method, certain or otherwise, by which RNA chains can be coaxed to build chains of any considerable length. One day a way to defy gravity might be discovered. I doubt it since there isn't anything left to try that might work. One day RNA chains might build longer and longer and longer chains, however there is nothing left to try that might work. There are only so many elements and only so many scenarios where the RNA chains might build that way. They have all already been tried. Believing they might originate life unaided is no longer logical. Your attitude is that anything can happen as long as it is not connected to any religion, which is obviously a psychotic reaction to the truth that no. anything cannot happen in nature. Now you are dissembling. Having the totally illogical nature of your argument that there is no such thing as heart transplant surgery because you haven't seen it, pointed out to you, you are backing off and changing the goalposts. See the bolded parts. I didn't think that EVEN you could be quite this stupid, and your projection is epic. Seriously? Because you haven't seen a heart transplant live or a good video, they don't happen? BTW I must remember to tell my husband that he didn't actually have dual knee replacements 16 years ago, they were fake, because some small time small town idiot in USA hadn't seen a good enough video!!!!!!!!!. I can't even be bothered with your last paragraph as it is patently obvious that you are either a scientific illiterate or worse A Dunning Kruger effect exponent and an example of the concept that 'a little knowledge is a dangerous thing'. Suppose for the purposes of discussion you have no idea how to make chicken marsala and that someone asks you about how to make it. You can't use the internet that day because there is a technical problem with it. What do you say or do? You say you can't help with that. It doesn't mean you believe there is no such thing as chicken marsala. It just means you can't be of any help with it if there is such a thing. Now suppose for the purposes of discussion that there is no such thing as whipping cream. Now someone asks you to make chicken marsala. What can you say or do? You tell them it isn't possible because there is no whipping cream. This is really very easy. Your attitude is totally what I called it, childish denial, and dependence on your "authorities."
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Post by goz on Mar 18, 2019 23:21:45 GMT
Suppose for the purposes of discussion you have no idea how to make chicken marsala and that someone asks you about how to make it. You can't use the internet that day because there is a technical problem with it. What do you say or do? You say you can't help with that. It doesn't mean you believe there is no such thing as chicken marsala. It just means you can't be of any help with it if there is such a thing. Now suppose for the purposes of discussion that there is no such thing as whipping cream. Now someone asks you to make chicken marsala. What can you say or do? You tell them it isn't possible because there is no whipping cream. This is really very easy. Your attitude is totally what I called it, childish denial, and dependence on your "authorities." No, Planet Arlon. You are just plain crazy. Just because someone does not know how to make chicken marsala DOES NOT mean that others who DO, are not making chicken marsala all around the world. The internet is now facilitating this because it gives people of all abilities information they is easy to access. Whether your recipe is the same doesn't matter. Similarly, JUST because you personally don't have access to view a heart transplant nor even find a video of it that satisfies your unusual verification requirements, doesn't mean that people are not having and doing heart transplants all around the world. ...and they have and are...just as people are making chicken marsala. BTW I don't need whipping cream for my recipe.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 23:27:45 GMT
Suppose for the purposes of discussion you have no idea how to make chicken marsala and that someone asks you about how to make it. You can't use the internet that day because there is a technical problem with it. What do you say or do? You say you can't help with that. It doesn't mean you believe there is no such thing as chicken marsala. It just means you can't be of any help with it if there is such a thing. Now suppose for the purposes of discussion that there is no such thing as whipping cream. Now someone asks you to make chicken marsala. What can you say or do? You tell them it isn't possible because there is no whipping cream. This is really very easy. Your attitude is totally what I called it, childish denial, and dependence on your "authorities." No, Planet Arlon. You are just plain crazy. Just because someone does not know how to make chicken marsala DOES NOT mean that others who DO, are not making chicken marsala all around the world. The internet is now facilitating this because it gives people of all abilities information they is easy to access. Whether your recipe is the same doesn't matter. Similarly, JUST because you personally don't have access to view a heart transplant nor even find a video of it that satisfies your unusual verification requirements, doesn't mean that people are not having and doing heart transplants all around the world. ...and they have and are...just as people are making chicken marsala. BTW I don't need whipping cream for my recipe. Aha, here's the problem, you can't read what I said. I never said it means no one is making it. I said the person who does not know how to make can be no help. I didn't say no one can be any help.
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Post by goz on Mar 18, 2019 23:33:05 GMT
No, Planet Arlon. You are just plain crazy. Just because someone does not know how to make chicken marsala DOES NOT mean that others who DO, are not making chicken marsala all around the world. The internet is now facilitating this because it gives people of all abilities information they is easy to access. Whether your recipe is the same doesn't matter. Similarly, JUST because you personally don't have access to view a heart transplant nor even find a video of it that satisfies your unusual verification requirements, doesn't mean that people are not having and doing heart transplants all around the world. ...and they have and are...just as people are making chicken marsala. BTW I don't need whipping cream for my recipe. Aha, here's the problem, you can't read what I said. I never said it means no one is making it. I said the person who does not know how to make can be no help. I didn't say no one can be any help. No, again. In the real example not the chicken marsala, you said that heart transplants had not taken place ( ie no-one knew how to do them or had had one) You said that they were fake as there was no evidence you had seen to prove that they had happened, real or video, according to your evidence requirements. You just totally contradicted yourself if you NOW say that just as people can make chicken marsala around the world with the correct training and or /experience, then doctors can and do and have done heart transplants,whilst you claim that they haven't.
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 18, 2019 23:43:25 GMT
Aha, here's the problem, you can't read what I said. I never said it means no one is making it. I said the person who does not know how to make can be no help. I didn't say no one can be any help. No, again. In the real example not the chicken marsala, you said that heart transplants had not taken place ( ie no-one knew how to do them or had had one) You said that they were fake as there was no evidence you had seen to prove that they had happened, real or video, according to your evidence requirements. You just totally contradicted yourself if you NOW say that just as people can make chicken marsala around the world with the correct training and or /experience, then doctors can and do and have done heart transplants,whilst you claim that they haven't. URL or it didn't happen.
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