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Post by stargazer1682 on Apr 25, 2019 4:18:38 GMT
 Gee I wonder if this "previously on..." showing scenes with Caitlyn's dad means he's going to be in this episode? Probably a coincidence. "Because I'm right this time!" - What, in all of your years of experience, Barry, would lead you to think you would be right this time? I mean, it's bound to happen eventually, sure, and probability gives it a high than zero chance that it could happen, but the law of averages should tell you how unlikely that this is the time you're right. Okay, Barry was probably not right this time, but I'm not sure I'm any more behind Iris in this argument than I am Barry. For starters, it arguably would be harder for Barry to leave Nora in the future, presumably for good, because by all accounts that could be the last time he see her at a stage in life where she's not a baby. Iris on the other hand will get to see that Nora again; she'll have to wait 30 years, but she'll get there; to say nothing of the experiences she'll get to share with Nora in the interim. I can appreciate her wanting to be able to say goodbye, but at the same time, it's "goodbye for now" for Iris. Plus, it seems like the relationship she's cultivated with Nora is more of a novelty; because in this instance she gets all the perks of having a daughter without virtually any of the downside of being her parent. It's a different Iris, a future Iris, who has had make the tough calls with raising Nora and discipline her. She gets to be the buddy with her daughter that most parents don't have the luxury to have; she's Nora's contemporary right now. And that's certainly unique, and maybe is something to want to be able to hold on to, but Nora had to go back eventually - arguably she should have gone back the instant they knew she was there - mostly I'm just not sure Iris is any more objective about this than Barry is. But also, Iris has got to be kidding thinking Thawne can't be manipulating Nora from death row. Seriously? I've never actually seen Silence of the Lambs - is that not the entire premise of the movie? Or the book, for that matter? Nora's going to tap into the negative-Speed Force? What's the worse that can happen? Ralph really does look like a baby giraffe... So what, Sherloque took Barry's statement that he's "done enough," to mean he's fulfilled his contractual obligations to them and was going to leave? So they're definitely saying that Caitlyn's split personality is biological/genetic, instead of psychological. Oh My God, Nora accessed the negative-Speed Force; I can believe it....  Barry: "I'm going to warm her up."  Awe, Caitlyn's dad finally fights back in time to save her from...himself... I guess.... Oh, yeah, other Cicada, I sort of forgot about you. Wait, I had something for this... Iceman Go-eth Was anyone actually surprised they didn't wait long enough to see the solution turn white? Anyone? Anyone? Oh no, Nora's eyes are glowing! ...It's probably fine....
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Post by dazz on Apr 25, 2019 5:07:53 GMT
I actually think Barry was right for once, like how he handled it was off but ultimately he was right, I mean his daughter has been going behind his back plotting with the man that murdered his mother, which btw lets not forget he did so only because he couldn't murder 10 year old Barry, and like I think he said last week she did this AFTER finding out about what he did, knowingly choosing to study from and work with her fathers mortal enemy, Barry in the state he was in could not have Nora around, Iris just wants Nora around and I think Barry was dead on why, because Nora no longer hates her so Iris wants that, but it is want vs. need, Barry needed her gone and he can always change his mind, and as we have been seeing he can do so 6 months from now and go to her the second he left her in the future, it's all just fucking so daft.
Also HOW in the fuck are they going to Nora's future? a future sure, but Nora's? her very meddling would make it impossible for them to do so, I mean fuck sake Barry changed the past by making it so he had to watch Thawne murder his mother rather than not, yet he changed a shit load of things, or is this now a perpetual loop thing, in Nora's future she had gone to the past, so this is just part of a cycle? but if so why the fuck was Iris the way she was or is it all an act? being the mother Nora described even if she doesn't want to be and enduring the bad relationship and hate from Nora for years because she knows where it leads?...AAAAH I HATE THIS SHOW!!!
Always knew Nora was a stupid shit, yeah Negative Speedforce what could go wrong, hey look mom's here and she's telling me not to trust Thawne, but I wanna see my daddy waaa it's been 3 whole minutes...fuck you Nora, I hope they kill you, and replace you with Dawn which should still be played by the same actress because it isn't here I have an issue with but the fucking character, how could he stop loving you? you betrayed him for months you stupid shit, I mean he told you how he feels and yet you are feeling slighted so you go running back to Thawne, gee wonder why your dad maybe having an issue with you.
Also how fucking long is this 10 minutes Thawne has left? how is Thawne imparting so much wisdom to her in such a short amount of time, sure she can move is flash time but he cant with his powers dampened, bloody nitwits.
Just how coincidental is the timing of everything in this show? serum turns white just after Catling & Momma Snow leave, despite it being in a shut box for minutes where no one can see it so it could have changed at any time and not be noticed, also what it has no reaction at all for minutes but instantly turns white like that? Iris & Ralph get back just in time to help out with the computers, but they don't call a head saying they are back they just stay radio silent until they walk into flash control HQ? and how the fuck did they know something was going on? Come to think about it how did KF get out of her locked room without making a sound?
Ok on a more serious query didn't Sherlock try raising the Nora issue with Iris earlier in the season? I could have sworn he did and she instantly shut him down, if so shouldn't he bring this up? or did I misremember things? or was that during the groundhogs day sort of episode? Oh shit I just realised how lazy these cunts are, they did a groundhogs day episode last year on Legends then they do another one this year on Flash, I mean for god sake space it out a little bit more for Christ sake, atleast they didn't do the lets not give a shit this round montage like they did on Legends.
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Post by stargazer1682 on Apr 25, 2019 6:36:07 GMT
I actually think Barry was right for once, like how he handled it was off but ultimately he was right, I mean his daughter has been going behind his back plotting with the man that murdered his mother, which btw lets not forget he did so only because he couldn't murder 10 year old Barry, and like I think he said last week she did this AFTER finding out about what he did, knowingly choosing to study from and work with her fathers mortal enemy, Barry in the state he was in could not have Nora around, Iris just wants Nora around and I think Barry was dead on why, because Nora no longer hates her so Iris wants that, but it is want vs. need, Barry needed her gone and he can always change his mind, and as we have been seeing he can do so 6 months from now and go to her the second he left her in the future, it's all just fucking so daft. Also HOW in the fuck are they going to Nora's future? a future sure, but Nora's? her very meddling would make it impossible for them to do so, I mean fuck sake Barry changed the past by making it so he had to watch Thawne murder his mother rather than not, yet he changed a shit load of things, or is this now a perpetual loop thing, in Nora's future she had gone to the past, so this is just part of a cycle? but if so why the fuck was Iris the way she was or is it all an act? being the mother Nora described even if she doesn't want to be and enduring the bad relationship and hate from Nora for years because she knows where it leads?...AAAAH I HATE THIS SHOW!!! Always knew Nora was a stupid shit, yeah Negative Speedforce what could go wrong, hey look mom's here and she's telling me not to trust Thawne, but I wanna see my daddy waaa it's been 3 whole minutes...fuck you Nora, I hope they kill you, and replace you with Dawn which should still be played by the same actress because it isn't here I have an issue with but the fucking character, how could he stop loving you? you betrayed him for months you stupid shit, I mean he told you how he feels and yet you are feeling slighted so you go running back to Thawne, gee wonder why your dad maybe having an issue with you. Also how fucking long is this 10 minutes Thawne has left? how is Thawne imparting so much wisdom to her in such a short amount of time, sure she can move is flash time but he cant with his powers dampened, bloody nitwits. Just how coincidental is the timing of everything in this show? serum turns white just after Catling & Momma Snow leave, despite it being in a shut box for minutes where no one can see it so it could have changed at any time and not be noticed, also what it has no reaction at all for minutes but instantly turns white like that? Iris & Ralph get back just in time to help out with the computers, but they don't call a head saying they are back they just stay radio silent until they walk into flash control HQ? and how the fuck did they know something was going on? Come to think about it how did KF get out of her locked room without making a sound? Ok on a more serious query didn't Sherlock try raising the Nora issue with Iris earlier in the season? I could have sworn he did and she instantly shut him down, if so shouldn't he bring this up? or did I misremember things? or was that during the groundhogs day sort of episode? Oh shit I just realised how lazy these WAFFLEs are, they did a groundhogs day episode last year on Legends then they do another one this year on Flash, I mean for god sake space it out a little bit more for Christ sake, atleast they didn't do the lets not give a shit this round montage like they did on Legends. I think the core concept behind why Nora can travel to the past and make changes at all, much less stick around as long as she has, are the notes Thawne wrote in the journal about time being malleable, or at least key segments of it are. It's kind of a bullshit excuse, but considering what they've done with the "legends", it at least fits. If anything, Flashpoint is the outlier where they fucked up; which doesn't excuse this other crap, but it's true. They could have avoided that issue at least with a little more thought and drawing a bit more from the comics. In the comics it wasn't just the act of Barry going back to save his mother, it was the fact that it required him to draw the entire speed force into himself in order to do. That caused a major cosmic blowback that resulted in the alternate Flashpoint timeline (that, and possibly Doctor Manhattan...). They had the perfect opportunity to set up something similar at the end of season 2, with Barry stopping Zoom. He saves the day, but there's still instability and all hell breaks loose when it blows. Barry disappears and it's up to Team Flash, who were at ground zero and the only people unaffected, to find the way to put things right. I have a theory about Thawne, but I don't have enough faith in the writers to try and be so clever. Last week we saw the guard go in and seem to electrocute Thawne, with what looked like Speed Force lightning. What Thawne gets an hour, gets electrocuted/executed, but then something results in him coming back to life and essentially living his death watch all over? I'm not talking about a Groundhog Day type thing where everyone relives the day over; and Thawne would maintain his memory, but it's like his timeline is so messed up, time won't let him die, because he shouldn't be alive in the first place; so he just keeps dying over and over. Or something to that effect. Because just by virtue of the journal, Nora would ostensibly need to be studying with him for a while, to learn not only the speedster language, but the concepts he shares through those notes. I think they established in the episode where they went into Nora's mind that Iris wasn't quite the monster Nora made her out to be; and it was colored by the perception of a child who had her own hang-ups and biased opinions about how she was being raised by her mom. |
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Post by dazz on Apr 25, 2019 7:44:26 GMT
I actually think Barry was right for once, like how he handled it was off but ultimately he was right, I mean his daughter has been going behind his back plotting with the man that murdered his mother, which btw lets not forget he did so only because he couldn't murder 10 year old Barry, and like I think he said last week she did this AFTER finding out about what he did, knowingly choosing to study from and work with her fathers mortal enemy, Barry in the state he was in could not have Nora around, Iris just wants Nora around and I think Barry was dead on why, because Nora no longer hates her so Iris wants that, but it is want vs. need, Barry needed her gone and he can always change his mind, and as we have been seeing he can do so 6 months from now and go to her the second he left her in the future, it's all just fucking so daft. Also HOW in the fuck are they going to Nora's future? a future sure, but Nora's? her very meddling would make it impossible for them to do so, I mean fuck sake Barry changed the past by making it so he had to watch Thawne murder his mother rather than not, yet he changed a shit load of things, or is this now a perpetual loop thing, in Nora's future she had gone to the past, so this is just part of a cycle? but if so why the fuck was Iris the way she was or is it all an act? being the mother Nora described even if she doesn't want to be and enduring the bad relationship and hate from Nora for years because she knows where it leads?...AAAAH I HATE THIS SHOW!!! Always knew Nora was a stupid shit, yeah Negative Speedforce what could go wrong, hey look mom's here and she's telling me not to trust Thawne, but I wanna see my daddy waaa it's been 3 whole minutes...fuck you Nora, I hope they kill you, and replace you with Dawn which should still be played by the same actress because it isn't here I have an issue with but the fucking character, how could he stop loving you? you betrayed him for months you stupid shit, I mean he told you how he feels and yet you are feeling slighted so you go running back to Thawne, gee wonder why your dad maybe having an issue with you. Also how fucking long is this 10 minutes Thawne has left? how is Thawne imparting so much wisdom to her in such a short amount of time, sure she can move is flash time but he cant with his powers dampened, bloody nitwits. Just how coincidental is the timing of everything in this show? serum turns white just after Catling & Momma Snow leave, despite it being in a shut box for minutes where no one can see it so it could have changed at any time and not be noticed, also what it has no reaction at all for minutes but instantly turns white like that? Iris & Ralph get back just in time to help out with the computers, but they don't call a head saying they are back they just stay radio silent until they walk into flash control HQ? and how the fuck did they know something was going on? Come to think about it how did KF get out of her locked room without making a sound? Ok on a more serious query didn't Sherlock try raising the Nora issue with Iris earlier in the season? I could have sworn he did and she instantly shut him down, if so shouldn't he bring this up? or did I misremember things? or was that during the groundhogs day sort of episode? Oh shit I just realised how lazy these WAFFLEs are, they did a groundhogs day episode last year on Legends then they do another one this year on Flash, I mean for god sake space it out a little bit more for Christ sake, atleast they didn't do the lets not give a shit this round montage like they did on Legends. I think the core concept behind why Nora can travel to the past and make changes at all, much less stick around as long as she has, are the notes Thawne wrote in the journal about time being malleable, or at least key segments of it are. It's kind of a bullshit excuse, but considering what they've done with the "legends", it at least fits. If anything, Flashpoint is the outlier where they fucked up; which doesn't excuse this other crap, but it's true. They could have avoided that issue at least with a little more thought and drawing a bit more from the comics. In the comics it wasn't just the act of Barry going back to save his mother, it was the fact that it required him to draw the entire speed force into himself in order to do. That caused a major cosmic blowback that resulted in the alternate Flashpoint timeline (that, and possibly Doctor Manhattan...). They had the perfect opportunity to set up something similar at the end of season 2, with Barry stopping Zoom. He saves the day, but there's still instability and all hell breaks loose when it blows. Barry disappears and it's up to Team Flash, who were at ground zero and the only people unaffected, to find the way to put things right. I have a theory about Thawne, but I don't have enough faith in the writers to try and be so clever. Last week we saw the guard go in and seem to electrocute Thawne, with what looked like Speed Force lightning. What Thawne gets an hour, gets electrocuted/executed, but then something results in him coming back to life and essentially living his death watch all over? I'm not talking about a Groundhog Day type thing where everyone relives the day over; and Thawne would maintain his memory, but it's like his timeline is so messed up, time won't let him die, because he shouldn't be alive in the first place; so he just keeps dying over and over. Or something to that effect. Because just by virtue of the journal, Nora would ostensibly need to be studying with him for a while, to learn not only the speedster language, but the concepts he shares through those notes. I think they established in the episode where they went into Nora's mind that Iris wasn't quite the monster Nora made her out to be; and it was colored by the perception of a child who had her own hang-ups and biased opinions about how she was being raised by her mom. I do love the he cannot die idea, but problem is if that's the case what was up with the I have run out of time or whatever thing he said to Nora before, if the countdown isn't for his death but just another attempt it's a silly and hollow pile of crap, and Nora should have figured it out, what if it's not a countdown to his execution but his death? something which is being tracked, but isn't being caused by anyone, like it's the impact of the negative speedforce, where unlike normal speedsters and the normal Speedforce where a speedster doesn't need to use their powers, those who use the negative speedforce need to use their speed or else the energy from the NSF builds up and will kill them, the guard torturing him causes a release, as it's not zapping RF with the lightning but forcibly drawing it out of him, and doing so painfully, but doing this drains the energy enough to prolong Thawnes life just a little bit each time.
As for Iris I know she wasn't the monster Nora thought but still she knows specifics which create a huge chasm between the two of them, so seems odd Iris knowingly does so, doesn't matter if Nora is justified in how she felt about Iris but that she did which is what I would think would alter Iris's behaviour, they should have given Nora a device which was RF's which allows a speedster to run not just to the future and past but back to a prior past & future they already visited, where instead of running to the future of the world they live in now or the past of that world Nora would always return to her future and the last past she visited instead whilst the device was active.
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Post by BexxyJ on May 1, 2019 15:31:30 GMT
Not sayin' it was a great episode Starzy but that was the first time Killer Frost has not been made to look a joke in a long time. Gotta give the writers credit for that one. If they wrote her like that all the time she'd be a better character.
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