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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:07:42 GMT
Just one of the countless chapters of horrible antisemitic incidents in Europe. Compared to that when Jews arrived in India, they were given Jew Town and promise was made to let them follow their religion freely for as long as the moon and sun exists.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:11:40 GMT
If it's any consolation to the Jews, he abused the Muslims rather badly too.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:15:03 GMT
If it's any consolation to the Jews, he abused the Muslims rather badly too. The Muslims were relatively better for Jews than Christians of his time.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:20:23 GMT
If it's any consolation to the Jews, he abused the Muslims rather badly too. The Muslims were relatively better for Jews than Christians of his time. Perhaps so. Should Christians of this time apologize for him?
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:21:14 GMT
If it's any consolation to the Jews, he abused the Muslims rather badly too. So as a Christian are you neutral about the crusaders or do you take pride in warriors like Richard I? To the best of my knowledge Richard I's army was defeated by Saladin, isn't it?
Edit: I was wrong in my second statement. Richard I had a marginal victory but Saladin still got a pact in his favour.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:28:28 GMT
If it's any consolation to the Jews, he abused the Muslims rather badly too. So as a Christian are you neutral about the crusaders or do you take pride in warriors like Richard I? To the best of my knowledge Richard I's army was defeated by Saladin, isn't it? My understanding is that Richard and Saladin came to an understanding. Richard was a brutal man. I don't take pride in him. I only want the truth, even if it hurts.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:29:04 GMT
The Muslims were relatively better for Jews than Christians of his time. Perhaps so. Should Christians of this time apologize for him? They should apologise for carrying out 1000s of years of horrible atrocity on a group. If I were a Christian I will accept that many people of my religion were horrible human beings and did things that no decent humans will do and I will pledge that I won't carry the same thoughts and actions. If one takes pride in good things about one's community then she/he should also accept mistakes and condemn those mistakes made by followers of their religion.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:31:58 GMT
So as a Christian are you neutral about the crusaders or do you take pride in warriors like Richard I? To the best of my knowledge Richard I's army was defeated by Saladin, isn't it? My understanding is that Richard and Saladin came to an understanding. Richard was a brutal man. I don't take pride in him. I only want the truth, even if it hurts. Cool. Thanks for that info and I like and respect your stance on the brutal man Richard I.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:37:26 GMT
Perhaps so. Should Christians of this time apologize for him? They should apologise for carrying out 1000s of years of horrible atrocity on a group. If I were a Christian I will accept that many people of my religion were horrible human beings and did things that no decent humans will do and I will pledge that I won't carry the same thoughts and actions. If one takes pride in good things about one's community then she/he should also accept mistakes and condemn those mistakes made by followers of their religion. And when everyone has apologized to everyone else, what then? Are we all going to get together and join hands and sing Kumbaya?
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:38:46 GMT
My understanding is that Richard and Saladin came to an understanding. Richard was a brutal man. I don't take pride in him. I only want the truth, even if it hurts. Cool. Thanks for that info and I like and respect your stance on the brutal man Richard I. What about Saladin? Was he a good man?
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:45:19 GMT
They should apologise for carrying out 1000s of years of horrible atrocity on a group. If I were a Christian I will accept that many people of my religion were horrible human beings and did things that no decent humans will do and I will pledge that I won't carry the same thoughts and actions. If one takes pride in good things about one's community then she/he should also accept mistakes and condemn those mistakes made by followers of their religion. And when everyone has apologized to everyone else, what then? Are we all going to get together and join hands and sing Kumbaya? Well then nothing or something depending on your mood. If I take pride in my people/community then I also have guts to apologise for them. I don't need to do anything more than apologise. It's not something that costs money.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 4:46:29 GMT
Cool. Thanks for that info and I like and respect your stance on the brutal man Richard I. What about Saladin? Was he a good man? Another warrior who indulged in blood bath. Although many Muslims see him as a hero. Not a hero for me.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 4:59:57 GMT
And when everyone has apologized to everyone else, what then? Are we all going to get together and join hands and sing Kumbaya? Well then nothing or something depending on your mood. If I take pride in my people/community then I also have guts to apologise for them. I don't need to do anything more than apologise. It's not something that costs money. You remind me of an Indian doctor who treated me once.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 11, 2019 5:05:39 GMT
Perhaps so. Should Christians of this time apologize for him? They should apologise for carrying out 1000s of years of horrible atrocity on a group. If I were a Christian I will accept that many people of my religion were horrible human beings and did things that no decent humans will do and I will pledge that I won't carry the same thoughts and actions. If one takes pride in good things about one's community then she/he should also accept mistakes and condemn those mistakes made by followers of their religion. I don;t even take responsibility for my parents past actions, I certainly have no intention of apologizing for a bunch of ancient white dudes who simply claimed to be what I am now. If they were like me they would have never persecuted anyone.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 5:08:15 GMT
They should apologise for carrying out 1000s of years of horrible atrocity on a group. If I were a Christian I will accept that many people of my religion were horrible human beings and did things that no decent humans will do and I will pledge that I won't carry the same thoughts and actions. If one takes pride in good things about one's community then she/he should also accept mistakes and condemn those mistakes made by followers of their religion. I don;t even take responsibility for my parents past actions, I certainly have no intention of apologizing for a bunch of ancient white dudes who simply claimed to be what I am now. If they were like me they would have never persecuted anyone. I don't know what is "claimed to be". They were Christians and not just people who claimed to be Christians. Sure, you are an example of a better Christian than they were.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 11, 2019 5:16:45 GMT
I don;t even take responsibility for my parents past actions, I certainly have no intention of apologizing for a bunch of ancient white dudes who simply claimed to be what I am now. If they were like me they would have never persecuted anyone. I don't know what is "claimed to be". They were Christians and not just people who claimed to be Christians. Sure, you are an example of a better Christian than they were. An atheist could call themselves a Christian, does that mean I have to take responsibility for whatever whacky thing they say? They didn't worship the way I worship and I worship according to scripture. If they're killing Jews they are doing that on whatever basis they view as Christian outside of scripture. So I have no idea why I would feel even an ounce of responsibility for their actions. Oh that's right, I wouldn't.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 5:22:42 GMT
I don't know what is "claimed to be". They were Christians and not just people who claimed to be Christians. Sure, you are an example of a better Christian than they were. An atheist could call themselves a Christian, does that mean I have to take responsibility for whatever whacky thing they say? They didn't worship the way I worship and I worship according to scripture. If they're killing Jews they are doing that on whatever basis they view as Christian outside of scripture. So I have no idea why I would feel even an ounce of responsibility for their actions. Oh that's right, I wouldn't. Richard I wasn't someone who just called himself a Christian. He was a Christian and as were the crusaders. Yeah, not the good examples of Christians.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 11, 2019 5:26:27 GMT
An atheist could call themselves a Christian, does that mean I have to take responsibility for whatever whacky thing they say? They didn't worship the way I worship and I worship according to scripture. If they're killing Jews they are doing that on whatever basis they view as Christian outside of scripture. So I have no idea why I would feel even an ounce of responsibility for their actions. Oh that's right, I wouldn't. Richard I wasn't someone who just called himself a Christian. He was a Christian and as were the crusaders. Yeah, not the good examples of Christians. I'm not arguing he wasn;t a Christian, I'm arguing he wasn't my version of it and mine is the more accurate one. As you say he was not the good example of one which means it's ok to use adjectives with the term Christian. Not apologizing.
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Post by Aj_June on May 11, 2019 6:08:59 GMT
I'm frankly more concerned now about the treatment of the Palestinians by the Jews. And I'm not defending Richard, but the fact he barred the Jews from investiture says something about the hoarding of wealth by the Jewish minority. That was the usual line of argument of antisemites. A good movie to understand the propaganda is right here:
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Post by The Herald Erjen on May 11, 2019 6:14:18 GMT
I'm frankly more concerned now about the treatment of the Palestinians by the Jews. And I'm not defending Richard, but the fact he barred the Jews from investiture says something about the hoarding of wealth by the Jewish minority. That was the usual line of argument of antisemites. A good movie to understand the propaganda is right here:
Aj, do you think this Jewish Third Temple bullshit is going to bring the whole world together? I do. And I want none of it.
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