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Post by gadreel on Oct 9, 2019 19:27:06 GMT
Tell me why are they pushing an Islamic agenda? Firstly evidence has to be provided that they actually are.
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 20:04:29 GMT
Oh the agony, that an American schoolchild should be required to learn about cultures and customs outside of the US and Christian-centric. There is a difference between learning about other religions & cultures, & being coerced into taking part in them. Otherwise, all the times non-christian kids have expressed feelings of coercion by their school boards, for being made to pray the Lord's Prayer, and/or other things that have to do with Christianity, were making a huge deal over nothing. I'd agree with he poster above who said children are seldom 'coerced' into learning anything in public schools. They're exposed to ideas and cultures that may not jibe with some parents' own, and those same parents choose to make an almighty stink about it. I can believe that children from a minority background may sometimes feel more pressured in the US to participate in Christ-centered observances, but even there I suspect that some of the claims of pressuring originate more from the parents (and their legal advisors) than from the actual school activities being practiced. My feeling is that school is a primary place to begin learning respect and gaining knowledge about all cultures and peoples, and private, individual religious bias shouldn't be allowed a place at the table.
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Post by clusium on Oct 9, 2019 20:40:10 GMT
There is a difference between learning about other religions & cultures, & being coerced into taking part in them. Indeed there is. Maybe someone should have explained that to the plaintiff in the case. Back when I was in high school, before the Lord's Prayer was banned in the public school board, what my high school used to do was: one day read from the New Testament, & then pray the Lord's Prayer; another day, read from the Old Testament & then pray the Jewish prayer of Thanks; Then another day, read from the Quran, & then pray the Muslim prayer; another day, from the Hindu scriptures followed by the Hindu prayer; then another day, from the Buddhist scripture followed by Buddhist prayer. Pretty fair, I would say.
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Post by clusium on Oct 9, 2019 20:41:58 GMT
There is a difference between learning about other religions & cultures, & being coerced into taking part in them. Otherwise, all the times non-christian kids have expressed feelings of coercion by their school boards, for being made to pray the Lord's Prayer, and/or other things that have to do with Christianity, were making a huge deal over nothing. I'd agree with he poster above who said children are seldom 'coerced' into learning anything in public schools. They're exposed to ideas and cultures that may not jibe with some parents' own, and those same parents choose to make an almighty stink about it. I can believe that children from a minority background may sometimes feel more pressured in the US to participate in Christ-centered observances, but even there I suspect that some of the claims of pressuring originate more from the parents (and their legal advisors) than from the actual school activities being practiced. My feeling is that school is a primary place to begin learning respect and gaining knowledge about all cultures and peoples, and private, individual religious bias shouldn't be allowed a place at the table. In that case, they should be teaching about world religions IN GENERAL, not just Islam.
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 20:44:23 GMT
I'd agree with he poster above who said children are seldom 'coerced' into learning anything in public schools. They're exposed to ideas and cultures that may not jibe with some parents' own, and those same parents choose to make an almighty stink about it. I can believe that children from a minority background may sometimes feel more pressured in the US to participate in Christ-centered observances, but even there I suspect that some of the claims of pressuring originate more from the parents (and their legal advisors) than from the actual school activities being practiced. My feeling is that school is a primary place to begin learning respect and gaining knowledge about all cultures and peoples, and private, individual religious bias shouldn't be allowed a place at the table. In that case, they should be teaching about world religions IN GENERAL, not just Islam. I see no problem with a class teaching about a specific religion. And we don't know if this school was teaching only about Islam, or covering other religions as well. At any rate, Islam is becoming more and more of a fact in the West today, and it does no harm to become better acquainted with it on a knowledgeable footing.
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Post by clusium on Oct 9, 2019 20:57:00 GMT
In that case, they should be teaching about world religions IN GENERAL, not just Islam. I see no problem with a class teaching about a specific religion. And we don't know if this school was teaching only about Islam, or covering other religions as well. At any rate, Islam is becoming more and more of a fact in the West today, and it does no harm to become better acquainted with it on a knowledgeable footing. Yes, it is becoming more & more of a fact in the West today. So are Hinduism, Buddhism, and Sikhism. I still say it should be religions in general, in a public school setting.
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 21:00:17 GMT
I see no problem with a class teaching about a specific religion. And we don't know if this school was teaching only about Islam, or covering other religions as well. At any rate, Islam is becoming more and more of a fact in the West today, and it does no harm to become better acquainted with it on a knowledgeable footing. Yes, it is becoming more & more of a fact in the West today. So are Hinduism, Buddhism, and Sikhism. I still say it should be religions in general, in a public school setting. I agree, and there's no evidence at this point that the school was focusing on Islamism alone, and not planning to teach some introductory coursed in other religions.
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Post by Cody™ on Oct 9, 2019 21:18:24 GMT
So you don’t see it as a problem for a Christian to be obligated to recite the Islamic declaration of faith which endorses a distinct false pagan god and an antichrist false prophet who denied the death, burial and resurrection of Christ? No. Neither would any rational adult. At any rate, get your facts straight on the Islamic stance regarding Jesus. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_in_IslamIslam does not disrespect Jesus, but it does deny he was an incarnation of god, just as the Jewish religion does. Mouth-breathing Christers have virtually no idea of what the Qu'ran has to say on this topic, and that results in ignorant statements like yours. You need to repent. Your heart is full of hatred for the Christian Faith. Not only does Islam deny the deity of Christ, the Quran rejects the death, burial and resurrection. Islam is the biggest antichrist belief system on the planet. Is it any wonder you are a fan? |
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 21:23:01 GMT
No. Neither would any rational adult. At any rate, get your facts straight on the Islamic stance regarding Jesus. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_in_IslamIslam does not disrespect Jesus, but it does deny he was an incarnation of god, just as the Jewish religion does. Mouth-breathing Christers have virtually no idea of what the Qu'ran has to say on this topic, and that results in ignorant statements like yours. You need to repent. Your heart is full of hatred for the Christian Faith. Not only does Islam deny the deity of Christ, the Quran rejects the death, burial and resurrection. Islam is the biggest antichrist belief system on the planet. Is it any wonder you are a fan? You need to repent of being an idiot. I'm not holding my breath. Judaism also denies all of the above. Waiting to hear you get in your two cents on that topic, or are you too chickenshit to court accusations of anti-Semitism?
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on Oct 9, 2019 21:27:21 GMT
My brother did a postgraduate teacher training course and as part of that he had to do assessment placings at schools. One of which was at a Catholic school who failed him for no making the sign of the cross at start of each lesson. He appealed it and was upheld.
The religious believe that their dogma is more important than reason or fairness.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2019 21:29:54 GMT
Christianity is the only religion that the New World Order wants to wipe off the face off the earth. They're not going after any of the others. It's one of the things to validate my belief that the Christian narrative is the correct one. I guess I'm not part of the New World Order then, since I want to wipe them all off the face of the Earth. Well that, and the New World Order is an imaginary boogeyman constructed with exactly the aim of making people like you believe what you do.
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Post by Cody™ on Oct 9, 2019 21:30:43 GMT
The odds that this story is being accurately and honestly reported are next to zero. Some Christians are whiny, gullible little idiots. Others are whiny, lying little idiots. It’s extremely irritating not to mention disingenuous the way you libs discredit these type of stories because they’re reported in “conservative” sources. You don’t seem to take into account that the reason they appear exclusively in right-wing outlets is because your precious liberal media largely ignore this stuff as they don’t fit their political narrative.
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Post by Cody™ on Oct 9, 2019 21:36:14 GMT
You need to repent. Your heart is full of hatred for the Christian Faith. Not only does Islam deny the deity of Christ, the Quran rejects the death, burial and resurrection. Islam is the biggest antichrist belief system on the planet. Is it any wonder you are a fan? You need to repent of being an idiot. I'm not holding my breath. Judaism also denies all of the above. Waiting to hear you get in your two cents on that topic, or are you too chickenshit to court accusations of anti-Semitism? I have no problem calling Judaism out for being antichrist because that is also exactly what it is. The difference is jews make up only around 15 million people worldwide, a great deal of which aren’t even religious. Islam has over 1.5 billion adherents. With the overwhelming majority considered conservative. Jews are also not a danger to Christians, whereas the overwhelming majority of violent persecution against christians is being perpetrated at the hands of Muslims. |
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Post by clusium on Oct 9, 2019 21:39:20 GMT
Yes, it is becoming more & more of a fact in the West today. So are Hinduism, Buddhism, and Sikhism. I still say it should be religions in general, in a public school setting. I agree, and there's no evidence at this point that the school was focusing on Islamism alone, and not planning to teach some introductory coursed in other religions. Hmmmmmmm..... Sounds more like the course was promoting only Islam to me. Many --if not all --religions have specific prayers or creeds, for the adherents to make, in order to get the faith, loyalty, & commitment from said adherents. Even Buddhism, which as a general rule has no rule forbiddings its adherents from following more than one faith, has a prayer, to gain the faith & loyalty of their adherents: Ie: "I take refuge in the Buddha. I take refuge in the Dharma. ... etc." If world religions are to be taught in the public school setting, it should be taught in a way for non-adherents of the different religions that are being taught, will not feel coerced.
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 21:43:11 GMT
You need to repent of being an idiot. I'm not holding my breath. Judaism also denies all of the above. Waiting to hear you get in your two cents on that topic, or are you too chickenshit to court accusations of anti-Semitism? I have no problem calling Judaism out for being antichrist because that is also exactly what they are. The difference is jews make up only around 15 million people worldwide, a great deal of which aren’t even religious. Islam has over 1.5 billion adherents. With the overwhelming majority considered conservative. Jews are also not a danger to Christians, whereas the overwhelming majority of violent persecution against christians is being perpetrated at the hands of Muslims. In shorter words, you're a bigot who has no problem condemning anyone who does't worship you preferred savior. If you actually followed his teachings you'd know he takes a dim view of that, but you're no more of a Christian than the people you rail against. In some salient respects, far less so. The chief danger posed to 'Christians' like yourself lies in their own ignorance and stupidity, but you're far too ignorant and stupid to recognize that.
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Post by amyghost on Oct 9, 2019 21:45:40 GMT
I agree, and there's no evidence at this point that the school was focusing on Islamism alone, and not planning to teach some introductory coursed in other religions. Hmmmmmmm..... Sounds more like the course was promoting only Islam to me. Many --if not all --religions have specific prayers or creeds, for the adherents to make, in order to get the faith, loyalty, & commitment from said adherents. Even Buddhism, which as a general rule has no rule forbiddings its adherents from following more than one faith, has a prayer, to gain the faith & loyalty of their adherents: Ie: "I take refuge in the Buddha. I take refuge in the Dharma. ... etc." If world religions are to be taught in the public school setting, it should be taught in a way for non-adherents of the different religions that are being taught, will not feel coerced. Some will never get over feeling coerced, whenever they find themselves in a setting that requires them to open up their minds to something other than their preconceived notions. No help for that, and I'm not in favor of restricting the curriculum to accommodate those types anyway.
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Post by clusium on Oct 9, 2019 21:51:53 GMT
Hmmmmmmm..... Sounds more like the course was promoting only Islam to me. Many --if not all --religions have specific prayers or creeds, for the adherents to make, in order to get the faith, loyalty, & commitment from said adherents. Even Buddhism, which as a general rule has no rule forbiddings its adherents from following more than one faith, has a prayer, to gain the faith & loyalty of their adherents: Ie: "I take refuge in the Buddha. I take refuge in the Dharma. ... etc." If world religions are to be taught in the public school setting, it should be taught in a way for non-adherents of the different religions that are being taught, will not feel coerced. Some will never get over feeling coerced, whenever they find themselves in a setting that requires them to open up their minds to something other than their preconceived notions. No help for that, and I'm not in favor of restricting the curriculum to accommodate those types anyway. It's not about learning or opening up their minds to something other than their preconceived notions. Otherwise, non-christians would be guilty of it themselves, for making this exact same complaint when Christianity was being promoted in the public school system. World religions can be taught without forcing non-adherents to accept belief in them, if their religious background forbids them from doing so. Believe me. It can be done, & should be done so.
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Post by goz on Oct 9, 2019 21:54:36 GMT
99.999% that this was a case where she had to learn the prayer as part of a comparative religion class and refused, then religious nutcases turned it into a "OMG THE SCHOOLS ARE TRYING TO TURN KIDS INTO MUSLIMS!!!!!!!!!!" story. Because those are always popular with the gullible. Precisely, the very term 'comparative religion' is enough to turn the fundies into apoplexic maniacs, let alone 'learn' something about other religions and cultures. Witness Cody!
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Post by Cody™ on Oct 9, 2019 21:55:22 GMT
I have no problem calling Judaism out for being antichrist because that is also exactly what they are. The difference is jews make up only around 15 million people worldwide, a great deal of which aren’t even religious. Islam has over 1.5 billion adherents. With the overwhelming majority considered conservative. Jews are also not a danger to Christians, whereas the overwhelming majority of violent persecution against christians is being perpetrated at the hands of Muslims. In shorter words, you're a bigot who has no problem condemning anyone who does't worship you preferred savior. If you actually followed his teachings you'd know he takes a dim view of that, but you're no more of a Christian than the people you rail against. In some salient respects, far less so. The chief danger posed to 'Christians' like yourself lies in their own ignorance and stupidity, but you're far too ignorant and stupid to recognize that. Yes yes anybody who criticises any worldview that doesn’t happen to be Christianity is a bigot, and a racist, and prejudiced, and a regressive, and an extremist.  Go away you’re boring.
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Post by goz on Oct 9, 2019 21:56:31 GMT
Indeed there is. Maybe someone should have explained that to the plaintiff in the case. Back when I was in high school, before the Lord's Prayer was banned in the public school board, what my high school used to do was: one day read from the New Testament, & then pray the Lord's Prayer; another day, read from the Old Testament & then pray the Jewish prayer of Thanks; Then another day, read from the Quran, & then pray the Muslim prayer; another day, from the Hindu scriptures followed by the Hindu prayer; then another day, from the Buddhist scripture followed by Buddhist prayer. Pretty fair, I would say. What about any other religions? To me it is discrimination against them!
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