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Post by theravenking on Mar 30, 2020 21:20:49 GMT
I always regarded Endless Night as one of the most underrated Christies. The Gilliat movie is quite faithful to the book. The same cannot be said about the Marple episode of the same name which shoehorns in Miss Marple into the plot, it has nice production values, but is otherwise just a pale shadow of the source material.
I've never seen any of Gilliat's other films. Are there any you would recommend?
Sure! You’ve seen Green for Danger, I think? Gilliat directed and co-wrote that. Excellent film, one of the finest adaptations of a Golden Age mystery story, with that magnificent Alastair Sim performance as Insp. Cockrill. His scripts, mostly with writing partner Frank Launder, are first-class—small masterpieces of plot construction and witty repartee. In particular: The Man who Changed His Mind (fun horror with Karloff, great punny title; Gilliat alone), Seven Sinners (the 1936 British flick, not the 1940 American movie with Marlene Dietrich of the same name; a beautifully-constructed mystery thriller with a John-Dickson-Carr-esque set-up), The Lady Vanishes (the famous, fantastically fun Hitchcock thriller), Night Train to Music ( Lady Vanishes’ spiritual sequel, just as good, most of the cast returns, feels like a Lubitsch, thrilling climax). Gilliat and Launder’s script for Inspector Hornleigh on Holiday is solid, with a good central plot deception, but unfortunately the movie around it isn’t that great. (That deception was used in a different mystery movie around the same time, but I won’t say which one just in case you want to see Holiday.) It’s too bad Gilliat and Launder never worked with Ernst Lubitsch, who prized plot construction and twists more than Hitchcock, but they never ventured out of the British film industry, unfortunately… Thanks for your recommendations!
Believe it or not, but I actually haven't seen Green For Danger. It's been on my watchlist for a while though and with so much down time in the upcoming weeks I might have the opportunity to check it out.
I have of course seen The Lady Vanishes, wasn't aware of its spiritual sequel though.
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Post by Nalkarj on Mar 30, 2020 22:01:57 GMT
Thanks for your recommendations!
Believe it or not, but I actually haven't seen Green For Danger. It's been on my watchlist for a while though and with so much down time in the upcoming weeks I might have the opportunity to check it out.
I have of course seen The Lady Vanishes, wasn't aware of its spiritual sequel though.
Heh, sorry about that, thought you had. It’s really great, both as an adaptation (improving on Christianna Brand’s characterization of Cockrill, giving all the suspects in-depth characterizations, clearly laying out the plot, providing all the clues, building up to the surprise solution and the final twist on top of that) and as a movie (well-filmed, well-acted, looks great, well-paced). Night Train to Munich is a longtime favorite of mine: it starts off a bit slow but builds quickly, feels like Lubitsch’s To Be or Not to Be in the middle, and has that great ending. Great cast, including Lady Vanishes’ Margaret Lockwood and “Charters and Caldicott,” Naunton Wayne and Basil Radford; Rex Harrison replacing Michael Redgrave; and Paul Heinreid. And thank you for your Endless Night recommendation; with any lucky, we’ll both to get watch mystery movies that have been on our watchlists for a while!
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Post by Nalkarj on Mar 31, 2020 3:33:42 GMT
I’ve been thinking about And Then There Were None (’45) recently: it’s one of those movies that I saw as a kid and that stuck in my memory for some reason.
Anyway, I highly, highly recommend it—it’s one of the finest whodunit movies ever made, suspenseful, atmospheric, funny, fun, cleverly written and directed. Oh, and June Duprez is gorgeous.
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Post by Nalkarj on Dec 30, 2021 3:45:52 GMT
@forceghostackbar, did you ever end up seeing Murder on the Orient Express? I just rewatched it for the first time in years on TCM and haven’t really changed my mind on it, unfortunately: It’s gorgeously directed and has a magnificent opening and ending, but the middle, with one suspect interview after another, is dull. I love all the suspects and all the actors’ performances, so it’s not even that, it’s just… Poirot asks questions, the suspects answer, rinse and repeat. Which is too bad because the movie is so beautiful, the production values are so high, the attention to detail is impeccable, the score is one of my favorite movie scores ever. The scene with the train starting is a masterpiece. And I find the ending oddly moving, oddly because it features murderers drinking to having gotten away with their crime. But I find it moving nonetheless. And yet that middle…
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2021 5:40:38 GMT
Nalkarj Not yet! But this reminds me to watch this and Knives Out soon! So I can’t click that spoiler tag yet
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 8:29:34 GMT
@forceghostackbar , did you ever end up seeing Murder on the Orient Express? I just rewatched it for the first time in years on TCM and haven’t really changed my mind on it, unfortunately: It’s gorgeously directed and has a magnificent opening and ending, but the middle, with one suspect interview after another, is dull. I love all the suspects and all the actors’ performances, so it’s not even that, it’s just… Poirot asks questions, the suspects answer, rinse and repeat. Which is too bad because the movie is so beautiful, the production values are so high, the attention to detail is impeccable, the score is one of my favorite movie scores ever. The scene with the train starting is a masterpiece. And I find the ending oddly moving, oddly because it features murderers drinking to having gotten away with their crime. But I find it moving nonetheless. And yet that middle… Never Seen It! I mostly agree with your review here. Though I found it very hard to get into for some reason. It wasn’t until the end that I warmed up to it because the solution to the mystery is certainly very unique and I can see why this story became so iconic. I think my main issue is that I never felt involved in the mystery because everyone’s true identity is concealed from the audience (which has to be the case since they ALL have the same secret) and we know that the killer must have some connection to the Armstrong girl so the motive itself is obvious from the start. So the only true misdirection is that there is only one or two killers. Which again, is very clever and satisfying, but the set up for it makes for a somewhat tedious build up since everything has to be focused on setting up that big twist.
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Post by Nalkarj on Jan 6, 2022 18:07:56 GMT
Never Seen It! I mostly agree with your review here. Though I found it very hard to get into for some reason. It wasn’t until the end that I warmed up to it because the solution to the mystery is certainly very unique and I can see why this story became so iconic. I think my main issue is that I never felt involved in the mystery because everyone’s true identity is concealed from the audience (which has to be the case since they ALL have the same secret) and we know that the killer must have some connection to the Armstrong girl so the motive itself is obvious from the start. So the only true misdirection is that there is only one or two killers. Which again, is very clever and satisfying, but the set up for it makes for a somewhat tedious build up since everything has to be focused on setting up that big twist. Great thoughts, Ack! I think I like it more than you do, though I agree that it’s an oddly cold film. Sorta as if it’s made by late-period David Lean. I think that may be largely because of Albert Finney, whose Poirot is just such a cold fish. He seems so aloof and distant that he doesn’t really register as a character, at least to me. And we spend almost every moment with him! That said, I’ve never had a problem getting into it… The Lindbergh Armstrong kidnapping opening grabs me every time I see the movie. And it holds my attention—all the way up to first few interviews. I have a feeling you’ll prefer the sequel, Death on the Nile. It’s warmer, more character-based, and more human—and, aptly, has a warmer and more human Poirot in Peter Ustinov—and is, for me, more fun. But it lacks MotOE’s stirring music and gorgeous direction—almost all its virtues are in the Anthony Shaffer screenplay and, depending on your taste for camp, the hammy performances—so ultimately the movies are kind of a wash for me. The best Poirot movie made by these producers, in my opinion, is the third and final entry, Evil Under the Sun. It has fewer stunning moments than MotOE and isn’t as good a mystery as DotN, but it’s a smart adaptation (also by Shaffer) that improves on Christie’s book and has fewer flaws than either of its predecessors.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 19:12:32 GMT
Never Seen It! I mostly agree with your review here. Though I found it very hard to get into for some reason. It wasn’t until the end that I warmed up to it because the solution to the mystery is certainly very unique and I can see why this story became so iconic. I think my main issue is that I never felt involved in the mystery because everyone’s true identity is concealed from the audience (which has to be the case since they ALL have the same secret) and we know that the killer must have some connection to the Armstrong girl so the motive itself is obvious from the start. So the only true misdirection is that there is only one or two killers. Which again, is very clever and satisfying, but the set up for it makes for a somewhat tedious build up since everything has to be focused on setting up that big twist. Great thoughts, Ack! I think I like it more than you do, though I agree that it’s an oddly cold film. Sorta as if it’s made by late-period David Lean. I think that may be largely because of Albert Finney, whose Poirot is just such a cold fish. He seems so aloof and distant that he doesn’t really register as a character, at least to me. And we spend almost every moment with him! That said, I’ve never had a problem getting into it… The Lindbergh Armstrong kidnapping opening grabs me every time I see the movie. And it holds my attention—all the way up to first few interviews. I have a feeling you’ll prefer the sequel, Death on the Nile. It’s warmer, more character-based, and more human—and, aptly, has a warmer and more human Poirot in Peter Ustinov—and is, for me, more fun. But it lacks MotOE’s stirring music and gorgeous direction—almost all its virtues are in the Anthony Shaffer screenplay and, depending on your taste for camp, the hammy performances—so ultimately the movies are kind of a wash for me. The best Poirot movie made by these producers, in my opinion, is the third and final entry, Evil Under the Sun. It has fewer stunning moments than MotOE and isn’t as good a mystery as DotN, but it’s a smart adaptation (also by Shaffer) that improves on Christie’s book has and fewer flaws than either of its predecessors. I’ll get to those soon! But tonight it’s Knives Out! 🔪
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Post by Nalkarj on Jan 6, 2022 19:46:01 GMT
Only tangentially related to the above, but I’d love to hear everyone’s thoughts on the David Suchet Agatha Christie’s Poirot show.
I still like it, but I’ve recently been falling out of love with some of the early, best-liked episodes. They’re so relentlessly cheery and colorful that they often come off as a better-plotted Murder, She Wrote—light, easily forgettable fare with good actors trying to make the most of one-note characters. (How many times does Hastings—possibly even dumber than Christie’s character—need to say “Good lord” and “I say”?)
I recently rewatched “The Million Dollar Bond Robbery,” which I remembered as one of the best episodes, and found it dull: lots of harrumphing stuffed shirts, a rather obvious mystery plot (writer Anthony Horowitz adds a character whose presence inadvertently gives away the solution), and loads of filler. Now, the Christie short story it’s based on is, what, 10 pages or so, so I understand the need for filler, but the filler feels like filler and makes the episode drag. Seasickness isn’t inherently funny, or even inherently a joke, yet that one non-joke gets repeated a half-dozen times. “The Theft of the Royal Ruby” and One, Two, Buckle My Shoe, which I hadn’t seen before, seemed much the same way.
The show’s later seasons go too far in the other direction: gray and humorless. The last season is nearly entirely a misfire. I remember the Murder on the Orient Express adaptation (penultimate season) being particularly poor, though admittedly I haven’t seen it since 2010.
The best episodes, I think, are those in the early 2000s, including fine adaptations of Five Little Pigs and Death on the Nile. These episodes are the first really to look and feel cinematic, but they also have better writing and more humor than the later episodes.
All that said, my comments may be unfair to a few really good early episodes: Murder on the Links looks great and far improves on its source material, and the Season 2 Peril at End House is excellent, in large part because of Polly Walker’s sympathetic performance. And I remember loving “The Adventure of the Egyptian Tomb”—I’m a sucker for anything Egyptological—though, especially in light of “Bond Robbery,” I have to rewatch before making any judgment.
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Post by Nalkarj on Jan 6, 2022 19:47:10 GMT
Great thoughts, Ack! I think I like it more than you do, though I agree that it’s an oddly cold film. Sorta as if it’s made by late-period David Lean. I think that may be largely because of Albert Finney, whose Poirot is just such a cold fish. He seems so aloof and distant that he doesn’t really register as a character, at least to me. And we spend almost every moment with him! That said, I’ve never had a problem getting into it… The Lindbergh Armstrong kidnapping opening grabs me every time I see the movie. And it holds my attention—all the way up to first few interviews. I have a feeling you’ll prefer the sequel, Death on the Nile. It’s warmer, more character-based, and more human—and, aptly, has a warmer and more human Poirot in Peter Ustinov—and is, for me, more fun. But it lacks MotOE’s stirring music and gorgeous direction—almost all its virtues are in the Anthony Shaffer screenplay and, depending on your taste for camp, the hammy performances—so ultimately the movies are kind of a wash for me. The best Poirot movie made by these producers, in my opinion, is the third and final entry, Evil Under the Sun. It has fewer stunning moments than MotOE and isn’t as good a mystery as DotN, but it’s a smart adaptation (also by Shaffer) that improves on Christie’s book has and fewer flaws than either of its predecessors. I’ll get to those soon! But tonight it’s Knives Out! 🔪 Even better! GIVE ACK THE WEALTHY, DYSFUNCTIONAL FAMILY! (Wait, what?)
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Post by Penn Guinn on Jan 6, 2022 19:50:47 GMT
@forceghostackbar
for me .. Orient Express was even better on the second (and later) viewings ... it is a matter of knowing whodunnitandwhy adding to rather than distracting as long as it is not known during the first watching.
Do not care for Finney's Poirot at all at all. For me ... Poirot is either Peter Ustinov or David Suchet. Totally different interpretations but both A+++.
Knives Out is a treat !
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Post by Penn Guinn on Jan 6, 2022 20:00:57 GMT
NalkarjI have always liked the Suchet Poirots and for me, he is the most like Christie's Poirot physically. Have a soft spot for the least likely casting ... Ustinov ! I tend to just watch the shows and enjoy them for what they are ... passing entertainment... without the ability to compare, contrast or notice changes from one season to another. They are better than what passes for modern TV and for me that is a major plus. Always enjoy reading your detailed breakdown of plot and character etc. of the things you watch.
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Post by Nalkarj on Jan 6, 2022 20:07:36 GMT
Nalkarj I have always liked the Suchet Poirots and for me, he is the most like Christie's Poirot physically. Have a soft spot for the least likely casting ... Ustinov ! I tend to just watch the shows and enjoy them for what they are ... passing entertainment... without the ability to compare, contrast or notice changes from one season to another. They are better than what passes for modern TV and for me that is a major plus. Always enjoy reading your detailed breakdown of plot and character etc. of the things you watch. Merci beaucoup, mon ami! Sometimes, yeah, I should stop the analyzing. And, yes, I’d rather watch Poirot (or, for that matter, Murder, She Wrote) than most of what’s on TV nowadays. I’m just so intrigued by why I like something, why someone else doesn’t, etc., for better or worse.
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Post by Penn Guinn on Jan 6, 2022 20:14:20 GMT
Nalkarj I used to like M,SW but now that I bought some seasonal disks at a sale ... I find that they have not (as the kiddies say) "held up well". Some episodes are fun mostly to see the olde timey guest stars. Small doses, and not binging, helps. If analyzing is part of the fun ... why ever stop ?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 22:50:11 GMT
I’ll get to those soon! But tonight it’s Knives Out! 🔪 Even better! GIVE ACK THE WEALTHY, DYSFUNCTIONAL FAMILY! (Wait, what?) Already got one! Only they ain’t wealthy! (Just dysfunctional!)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 22:56:14 GMT
@forceghostackbar for me .. Orient Express was even better on the second (and later) viewings ... it is a matter of knowing whodunnitandwhy adding to rather than distracting as long as it is not known during the first watching. Do not care for Finney's Poirot at all at all. For me ... Poirot is either Peter Ustinov or David Suchet. Totally different interpretations but both A+++.
Knives Out is a treat ! I often find I enjoy movies with big twists better the second time. Which seems odd, but somehow it’s true. The Prestige (not necessarily a mystery, but it does contain several big twists) is a great example of a movie that is way more enjoyable on repeat viewings, once you know the ending.
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Post by Penn Guinn on Jan 6, 2022 23:31:53 GMT
@forceghostackbar
True for me too with The Sixth Sense and Witness for the Prosecution and so many others that seem to get better with time and re-watchings. For me, twists are not even a requirement for improvement via re-peats.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 23:39:48 GMT
@forceghostackbar True for me too with The Sixth Sense and Witness for the Prosecution and so many others that seem to get better with time and re-watchings. For me, twists are not even a requirement for improvement via re-peats. It’s true of good movies in general for me too. I almost always enjoy really good movies more and more as I rewatch them.
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Post by Penn Guinn on Jan 6, 2022 23:45:17 GMT
@forceghostackbar
Some that I have actively disliked and then gave a second chance have become magically not so bad.
Will you give us a report on Knives Out (I hope I hope !)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 6, 2022 23:49:18 GMT
@forceghostackbar Some that I have actively disliked and then gave a second chance have become magically not so bad.
Will you give us a report on Knives Out (I hope I hope !) Will do! I’m going to start it tonight but I might not finish it until tomorrow so stay tuned…
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