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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 23, 2017 14:05:39 GMT
The Lord Of The Rings is perfection, but I really really really want to have The Hobbit edited down so the battle scenes don't constantly get so long and silly. I'd also like to edit out the bits of the elf/dwarf love story and the goofy stooge from Lake Town. I could do without him altogether. I really couldn't get into the films because of all of that.
Is anybody aware of a fan edit perhaps that does something like this?
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Post by pippinmaniac on Feb 23, 2017 14:57:38 GMT
The Lord Of The Rings is perfection, but I really really really want to have The Hobbit edited down so the battle scenes don't constantly get so long and silly. I'd also like to edit out the bits of the elf/dwarf love story and the goofy stooge from Lake Town. I could do without him altogether. I really couldn't get into the films because of all of that.
Is anybody aware of a fan edit perhaps that does something like this? I don't know, but I would like to see a fan edit myself. I felt that MGM wanted three films too, just like New Line got, but too much padding can kill otherwise good films. There was one, maybe two good movies to be made at most out of the source material. And just for the record, there was no need to add a female character in order to appeal to women and girls. The original story was just fine with the all male characters.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 3:42:23 GMT
I don't know, but I would like to see a fan edit myself. I felt that MGM wanted three films too, just like New Line got, but too much padding can kill otherwise good films. There was one, maybe two good movies to be made at most out of the source material. And just for the record, there was no need to add a female character in order to appeal to women and girls. The original story was just fine with the all male characters. I agree that two would have made a lot of sense. Spend a little extra time. Break the films after they escape the spiders and get captured by the elves, and then start the new film with their amazing escape and discovery of Lake Town. But the split location is of course debatable. There was no need for invented characters, I agree, at least not major ones.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 4:01:35 GMT
There should have only been one. The book is only about three hundred pages long and the battle that the entire last film is named for is only about three pages long. A single three hour film would have sufficed.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 4:18:14 GMT
There should have only been one. The book is only about three hundred pages long and the battle that the entire last film is named for is only about three pages long. A single three hour film would have sufficed. I disagree. I think there is plenty of material to justify two, and too much to do any of it justice if you pack it all into one. You need time to sit and breath and explore the world around, and putting it into one film would have required racing through each scene.
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Post by femalefan on Feb 24, 2017 4:24:13 GMT
The Lord Of The Rings is perfection, but I really really really want to have The Hobbit edited down so the battle scenes don't constantly get so long and silly. I'd also like to edit out the bits of the elf/dwarf love story and the goofy stooge from Lake Town. I could do without him altogether. I really couldn't get into the films because of all of that.
Is anybody aware of a fan edit perhaps that does something like this? There is or was a fan edit but it's hard too find.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 4:51:56 GMT
There should have only been one. The book is only about three hundred pages long and the battle that the entire last film is named for is only about three pages long. A single three hour film would have sufficed. I disagree. I think there is plenty of material to justify two, and too much to do any of it justice if you pack it all into one. You need time to sit and breath and explore the world around, and putting it into one film would have required racing through each scene. And yet the Rankin-Bass with its hour and a half running time is still infinitely superior to Jackson's trilogy. I think you're under-estimating what could have been done in a single three hour film.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 4:59:25 GMT
And yet the Rankin-Bass with its hour and a half running time is still infinitely superior to Jackson's trilogy. I think you're under-estimating what could have been done in a single three hour film. Oh I think they could have done it. I just think 2 two hour films would have been better. That whole year of anticipation in between is really key to building interest as well.
I mean you have so much. The introduction to young Bilbo, the start of the journey, the trolls, Rivendell, the Hills, Riddles (which definitely needed to take it's time), battling the orcs, the wolves, Beorn, the forest, the spiders, the elves, the barrel escape (which definitely needed to take it's time), Lake town, finding the mountain, opening the secret door, awakening Smaug, the destruction of Lake town, the arrival of Lake Towns survivors, the arrival of the other armies, the final fight (which definitely needs to take it's time), and of course the journey home, and none of this accounts for the few cool new scenes with Gandolf that are good dealing with the Necromancer, although that got more complex than it needed to. So that is like 25 scenes at a minimal rough count. Certainly plenty to break it up and take a bit more time with each.
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Post by filmfan95 on Feb 24, 2017 5:11:05 GMT
The Maple Films fan edit is one of the best. It tries to edit down the movies into a better paced story. It edits out the Kili and Tauriel romance, and the Dol Guldur subplot, as well as downgrades Alfrid's role. I found it much more enjoyable than the trilogy.
There are a fee oddities in it. Smaug is never covered in liquid gold, but the shot of him barreling out of the mountain is still included (the editor color-corrected it to make it less obvious, but it's still clear that he's covered with some sort of liquid), and Thorin inexplicably gets Orcrist back for the final battle (as Legolas is now a minor character). Also, he still (although he cuts it down severely) keeps the dwarv encountering Smaug, which was pure padding in the movie. But, it's a pretty solid fan edit other than those few things. If you still want the Dol Guldur stuff, he made separate fan edit for it that cuts it down to that subplot. It works a lot better as a separate movie.
The other fan edit I really like is The Bilbo Edition. So check that out too.
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Post by brownstones on Feb 24, 2017 5:17:53 GMT
I think that's most people.
I blame Del Toro for this, not saying his movies would have been better, since I'm not his biggest fan, but just dumping it on Jackson's feet last minute led to an uninspired trilogy.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 5:26:38 GMT
And yet the Rankin-Bass with its hour and a half running time is still infinitely superior to Jackson's trilogy. I think you're under-estimating what could have been done in a single three hour film. Oh I think they could have done it. I just think 2 two hour films would have been better. That whole year of anticipation in between is really key to building interest as well.
I mean you have so much. The introduction to young Bilbo, the start of the journey, the trolls, Rivendell, the Hills, Riddles (which definitely needed to take it's time), battling the orcs, the wolves, Beorn, the forest, the spiders, the elves, the barrel escape (which definitely needed to take it's time), Lake town, finding the mountain, opening the secret door, awakening Smaug, the destruction of Lake town, the arrival of Lake Towns survivors, the arrival of the other armies, the final fight (which definitely needs to take it's time), and of course the journey home, and none of this accounts for the few cool new scenes with Gandolf that are good dealing with the Necromancer, although that got more complex than it needed to. So that is like 25 scenes at a minimal rough count. Certainly plenty to break it up and take a bit more time with each.
That's very true, but I'm still reluctant to entertain the possibilities of a multi-film adaptation of a fairly short book. My main issue with even two films is the same one I had from the very moment they announced it would be a two-part adaptation: that Bilbo might get shafted in favor of the White Council crap, which is exactly what ended up happening. The films got so preoccupied with The White Council, Sauron, Thorin's personal baggage, the Mary Sue elf, Legolas despite the fact Orlando Bloom hasn't been a popular money draw in fucking YEARS, and even Bard's mostly fabricated story arc that they forgot the namesake of their title. After a while, it felt like the filmmakers were annoyed to have to include him. Bilbo finds the Ring. That is the single most important component to connecting The Hobbit to The Lord of the Rings.
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Post by cineastewest on Feb 24, 2017 5:27:11 GMT
You are correct.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 5:33:15 GMT
That's very true, but I'm still reluctant to entertain the possibilities of a multi-film adaptation of a fairly short book. My main issue with even two films is the same one I had from the very moment they announced it would be a two-part adaptation: that Bilbo might get shafted in favor of the White Council crap, which is exactly what ended up happening. The films got so preoccupied with The White Council, Sauron, Thorin's personal baggage, the Mary Sue elf, Legolas despite the fact Orlando Bloom hasn't been a popular money draw in fucking YEARS, and even Bard's mostly fabricated story arc that they forgot the namesake of their title. After a while, it felt like the filmmakers were annoyed to have to include him. Bilbo finds the Ring. That is the single most important component to connecting The Hobbit to The Lord of the Rings. Oh I agree the she-elf bit, the completely contrived Bard's family and town story, Legolas, and some of the White Council bits were completely unnecessary.
The only side story that was ok to add was some following of Gandalf to Dol Guldur, but they really shouldn't have proclaimed to know it was Sauron since he claims to have no idea by the start of Lord of the Rings.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 5:35:30 GMT
The Maple Films fan edit is one of the best. It tries to edit down the movies into a better paced story. It edits out the Kili and Tauriel romance, and the Dol Guldur subplot, as well as downgrades Alfrid's role. I found it much more enjoyable than the trilogy. There are a fee oddities in it. Smaug is never covered in liquid gold, but the shot of him barreling out of the mountain is still included (the editor color-corrected it to make it less obvious, but it's still clear that he's covered with some sort of liquid), and Thorin inexplicably gets Orcrist back for the final battle (as Legolas is now a minor character). Also, he still (although he cuts it down severely) keeps the dwarv encountering Smaug, which was pure padding in the movie. But, it's a pretty solid fan edit other than those few things. If you still want the Dol Guldur stuff, he made separate fan edit for it that cuts it down to that subplot. It works a lot better as a separate movie. The other fan edit I really like is The Bilbo Edition. So check that out too. Thanks!!!! I will definitely check these out. Great stuff.
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 5:37:43 GMT
I think that's most people. I blame Del Toro for this, not saying his movies would have been better, since I'm not his biggest fan, but just dumping it on Jackson's feet last minute led to an uninspired trilogy. I agree, and I think a different director would have been great, and made for a different feel for a different part of the franchise. Whoever did it, just needed to be committed and focused and what was produced was a lot of noise. There is a good film in there somewhere, but there is too much insanity and completely contrived subplots that it's almost unrecognizable at times.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 5:48:07 GMT
That's very true, but I'm still reluctant to entertain the possibilities of a multi-film adaptation of a fairly short book. My main issue with even two films is the same one I had from the very moment they announced it would be a two-part adaptation: that Bilbo might get shafted in favor of the White Council crap, which is exactly what ended up happening. The films got so preoccupied with The White Council, Sauron, Thorin's personal baggage, the Mary Sue elf, Legolas despite the fact Orlando Bloom hasn't been a popular money draw in fucking YEARS, and even Bard's mostly fabricated story arc that they forgot the namesake of their title. After a while, it felt like the filmmakers were annoyed to have to include him. Bilbo finds the Ring. That is the single most important component to connecting The Hobbit to The Lord of the Rings. Oh I agree the she-elf bit, the completely contrived Bard's family and town story, Legolas, and some of the White Council bits were completely unnecessary.
The only side story that was ok to add was some following of Gandalf to Dol Guldur, but they really shouldn't have proclaimed to know it was Sauron since he claims to have no idea by the start of Lord of the Rings.
Having Gandalf not find out it was Sauron basically the whole thing pointless, so it may as well have not even been filmed. Like I said, one three-hour film exclusively focused on Bilbo and the dwarves.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 5:51:13 GMT
I think that's most people. I blame Del Toro for this, not saying his movies would have been better, since I'm not his biggest fan, but just dumping it on Jackson's feet last minute led to an uninspired trilogy. I agree, and I think a different director would have been great, and made for a different feel for a different part of the franchise. Whoever did it, just needed to be committed and focused and what was produced was a lot of noise. There is a good film in there somewhere, but there is too much insanity and completely contrived subplots that it's almost unrecognizable at times. More like completely unrecognizable once you start the second film. They weren't even using dialogue from the book anywhere by Part 2.
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Post by brownstones on Feb 24, 2017 5:53:35 GMT
I think that's most people. I blame Del Toro for this, not saying his movies would have been better, since I'm not his biggest fan, but just dumping it on Jackson's feet last minute led to an uninspired trilogy. I agree, and I think a different director would have been great, and made for a different feel for a different part of the franchise. Whoever did it, just needed to be committed and focused and what was produced was a lot of noise. There is a good film in there somewhere, but there is too much insanity and completely contrived subplots that it's almost unrecognizable at times. this is why I don't trust Guillermo with films, he's on 12 different projects then drops them all to direct a new one. "I spent 2-3 years getting everything ready for The Hobbit, then I wanted to do Pacific Rim, my passion project"
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Feb 24, 2017 5:57:11 GMT
Having Gandalf not find out it was Sauron basically the whole thing pointless, so it may as well have not even been filmed. Like I said, one three-hour film exclusively focused on Bilbo and the dwarves. I don't think it makes it pointless. He knows something is going on, and an epilogue of him and/or Aragorn following Gollum in an attempt to find out WTF was going on would have been suitable. We already know, and it's ok that he doesn't.
One film still seems crammed to me. I can't agree to that.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2017 6:00:43 GMT
It isn't too crammed if you just stick with what Tolkien wrote for it and don't bother with any of the Appendex materials. Bilbo finds The Ring, the core component that makes The Lord of the Rings functionable as a story.
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