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Post by Deleted on Jul 7, 2017 18:59:02 GMT
If they loved it so much why aren't they here, or on other boards, praising it? Because TFA was one of those movies that everyone went crazy to see and then half the people who saw it realized later, you know what? It really wasn't a good movie. You know, like some of the Transformers and some of the Fast and Furious movies. These yahoos actually think that EVERYBODY still loves TFA like the public perception was within the first month of the movie. So many people have moved on to ho-humsville when it comes to TFA. Yes. There was many praises for TPM in its first year. Five to ten years later it gained da reputation of being a mediocre movie. Yousa can't wake these TFA apologists up! Five years from now when no one is bragging about and praising TFA other than what it made at da box office, these clowns will still be making the same profusely leaky arguments for TFA. They live by da Nile river in da land of da 3 monkeys.
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jul 7, 2017 19:03:59 GMT
There needs to be another option:
Perhaps but you don't hasta call her Johnson
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agentsparky
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Post by agentsparky on Jul 23, 2017 4:44:29 GMT
As it stands now, yes she's a Mary Sue.
However it's still pending. If The Last Jedi can provide an explanation to Rey's backstory that could change.
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bb15
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Post by bb15 on Jul 23, 2017 18:14:32 GMT
I like Jar jar because he makes me laugh by pissing off guys like Furious to no end; and thinking about it, Furious strongly reminds me of Jar Jar, and that's why I like him too, and that's why he hates Jar Jar. So the circle is complete.
Rey is just badly written, and that's it. Now, that's a terrible character.
if rey is badly written so is luke, so is anakin, lets not fucking go there with jar jar fucking binks, she aint the best star wars character and shes certainly not the worse Well said. Luke and Anakin follow a streamlined version of the hero's journey. Luke is the male fantasy of Lucas put in the hero's journey mold. George has admitted this. The trouble for some audience members comes when an action/adventure film has a female lead. Rey is female who is also a combination of Luke and Anakin. - If a big chunk of the male audience wants to completely identify with the hero, how can they do that if the hero is a female? Answer; they can't and so we have this anti-female action/adventure lead backlash from them. - Some women also have trouble accepting an action/adventure movie being led by a female character. It doesn't fit the stereotype of the woman being passive, and only a sidekick to the man. * This issue has been known for a long time by the film studios. There was this kind of negative feedback about Ripley in the Alien films for instance. This anti-action female lead negativity is why there have been multiple male driven action/adventure films (including Indiana Jones) but no Wonder Woman film (until this year). - The mass audience has only recently been ready for the hero's journey to be taken by a female lead. Result; TFA, "Rouge One" and "Wonder Woman" all in the last couple of years. Imo at least, BB ;-)
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Surly
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Post by Surly on Jul 23, 2017 21:51:34 GMT
if rey is badly written so is luke, so is anakin, lets not fucking go there with jar jar fucking binks, she aint the best star wars character and shes certainly not the worse Well said.Β Luke and Anakin follow a streamlined version of the hero's journey. Luke is the male fantasy of Lucas put in the hero's journey mold. George has admitted this.Β The trouble for some audience members comes when an action/adventure film has a female lead. Rey is female who is also a combination of Luke and Anakin. - If a big chunk of the male audience wants to completely identify with the hero, how can they do that if the hero is a female?Β Answer; they can't and so we have this anti-female action/adventure lead backlash from them.Β - Some women also have trouble accepting an action/adventure movie being led by a female character. It doesn't fit the stereotype of the woman being passive, and only a sidekick to the man.Β * This issue has been known for a long time by the film studios. There was this kind of negative feedback about Ripley in the Alien films for instance.Β This anti-action female lead negativity is why there have been multiple male driven action/adventure films (including Indiana Jones) but no Wonder Woman film (until this year). - The mass audience has only recently been ready for the hero's journey to be taken by a female lead.Β Result; TFA, "Rouge One" and "Wonder Woman" all in the last couple of years.Β Imo at least, BB ;-) Yeah I can't agree with you here pal. There's clear differences between Rey and that of Anakin and especially Luke. Luke failed just as much if not more than he exceeded in ANH. Granted he was good at piloting. But that was about the only thing he was outstanding at. He got beat up twice and had to be rescued 4 times in his first movie. Those are just facts! So Luke wasn't this guy who was always successful. He wasn't this character who was overwhelmingly and sometimes accidentally successful every time he used the Force as we saw in his first 2 movies. Speaking of heroes journeys, Luke's followed one that had more character arc and development. Rey has already covered what Luke covered in 2 and a half movies just in TFA already. Rey's journey fits the template of a Disney warrior princess much more than the classic hero's journey template. And that warrior princess template is - she's loved by everyone, respected by everyone, has flawless character, the magic chooses her, she does nothing to earn or develop her magic, she is overwhelmingly successful even when she uses magic by accident. And the only thing between her and instant and absolute success is just believing.... That's Rey. And that's why some people don't like her, not her gender. Although I'm sure some people don't like her because she is a female, to say that's the only reason it could ever be is a scapegoat cop out for defending the character against any criticism.
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ryboto
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Post by ryboto on Jul 23, 2017 22:02:37 GMT
She'd still be a Mary Sue as she's written in TFA...
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Post by Deleted on Jul 23, 2017 22:43:16 GMT
Well said.Β Luke and Anakin follow a streamlined version of the hero's journey. Luke is the male fantasy of Lucas put in the hero's journey mold. George has admitted this.Β The trouble for some audience members comes when an action/adventure film has a female lead. Rey is female who is also a combination of Luke and Anakin. - If a big chunk of the male audience wants to completely identify with the hero, how can they do that if the hero is a female?Β Answer; they can't and so we have this anti-female action/adventure lead backlash from them.Β - Some women also have trouble accepting an action/adventure movie being led by a female character. It doesn't fit the stereotype of the woman being passive, and only a sidekick to the man.Β * This issue has been known for a long time by the film studios. There was this kind of negative feedback about Ripley in the Alien films for instance.Β This anti-action female lead negativity is why there have been multiple male driven action/adventure films (including Indiana Jones) but no Wonder Woman film (until this year). - The mass audience has only recently been ready for the hero's journey to be taken by a female lead.Β Result; TFA, "Rouge One" and "Wonder Woman" all in the last couple of years.Β Imo at least, BB ;-) Yeah I can't agree with you here pal. There's clear differences between Rey and that of Anakin and especially Luke. Luke failed just as much if not more than he exceeded in ANH. Granted he was good at piloting. But that was about the only thing he was outstanding at. He got beat up twice and had to be rescued 4 times in his first movie. Those are just facts! So Luke wasn't this guy who was always successful. He wasn't this character who was overwhelmingly and sometimes accidentally successful every time he used the Force as we saw in his first 2 movies. Speaking of heroes journeys, Luke's followed one that had more character arc and development. Rey has already covered what Luke covered in 2 and a half movies just in TFA already. Rey's journey fits the template of a Disney warrior princess much more than the classic hero's journey template. And that warrior princess template is - she's loved by everyone, respected by everyone, has flawless character, the magic chooses her, she does nothing to earn or develop her magic, she is overwhelmingly successful even when she uses magic by accident. And the only thing between her and instant and absolute success is just believing.... That's Rey. And that's why some people don't like her, not her gender. Although I'm sure some people don't like her because she is a female, to say that's the only reason it could ever be is a scapegoat cop out for defending the character against any criticism. This'n be too right! Rey is on the Disney warrior princess archetype. Not the hero's journey. In fact Rey is Dorothy from the Wizard of Oz. Her runs around confused and scared of everything Force related in the movie. But every time she happens to use it she is thoroughly successful. Even against trained and experienced Force users. Her accidentally falls into her successes with da Force. Like Dorothy accidentally killed da wicked witch of the East by landing her house on her. And when she was paralyzed with fear of da wicked witch of the West she accidentally kills her and becomes da hero by splashing water on her. Da dynamics are eerily similar to Rey's encounters with Kylo. Tarpals knows this might blow some people's minds, but some people don't want that kind of hero in their SW, male or female.
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ryboto
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Post by ryboto on Jul 23, 2017 22:45:12 GMT
Well said. Luke and Anakin follow a streamlined version of the hero's journey. Luke is the male fantasy of Lucas put in the hero's journey mold. George has admitted this. The trouble for some audience members comes when an action/adventure film has a female lead. Rey is female who is also a combination of Luke and Anakin. - If a big chunk of the male audience wants to completely identify with the hero, how can they do that if the hero is a female? Answer; they can't and so we have this anti-female action/adventure lead backlash from them. - Some women also have trouble accepting an action/adventure movie being led by a female character. It doesn't fit the stereotype of the woman being passive, and only a sidekick to the man. * This issue has been known for a long time by the film studios. There was this kind of negative feedback about Ripley in the Alien films for instance. This anti-action female lead negativity is why there have been multiple male driven action/adventure films (including Indiana Jones) but no Wonder Woman film (until this year). - The mass audience has only recently been ready for the hero's journey to be taken by a female lead. Result; TFA, "Rouge One" and "Wonder Woman" all in the last couple of years. Imo at least, BB ;-) Yeah I can't agree with you here pal. There's clear differences between Rey and that of Anakin and especially Luke. Luke failed just as much if not more than he exceeded in ANH. Granted he was good at piloting. But that was about the only thing he was outstanding at. He got beat up twice and had to be rescued 4 times in his first movie. Those are just facts! So Luke wasn't this guy who was always successful. He wasn't this character who was overwhelmingly and sometimes accidentally successful every time he used the Force as we saw in his first 2 movies. Speaking of heroes journeys, Luke's followed one that had more character arc and development. Rey has already covered what Luke covered in 2 and a half movies just in TFA already. Rey's journey fits the template of a Disney warrior princess much more than the classic hero's journey template. And that warrior princess template is - she's loved by everyone, respected by everyone, has flawless character, the magic chooses her, she does nothing to earn or develop her magic, she is overwhelmingly successful even when she uses magic by accident. And the only thing between her and instant and absolute success is just believing.... That's Rey. And that's why some people don't like her, not her gender. Although I'm sure some people don't like her because she is a female, to say that's the only reason it could ever be is a scapegoat cop out for defending the character against any criticism. No matter how many times you tell them, they still believe Luke=Anakin=Force God Gary Sue. THE SAME AS REY! YOU'RE A MISOGYNIST PIG. No getting through to them with facts.
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ryboto
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Post by ryboto on Jul 23, 2017 22:47:18 GMT
if rey is badly written so is luke, so is anakin, lets not fucking go there with jar jar fucking binks, she aint the best star wars character and shes certainly not the worse Well said. Luke and Anakin follow a streamlined version of the hero's journey. Luke is the male fantasy of Lucas put in the hero's journey mold. George has admitted this. The trouble for some audience members comes when an action/adventure film has a female lead. Rey is female who is also a combination of Luke and Anakin. - If a big chunk of the male audience wants to completely identify with the hero, how can they do that if the hero is a female? Answer; they can't and so we have this anti-female action/adventure lead backlash from them. - Some women also have trouble accepting an action/adventure movie being led by a female character. It doesn't fit the stereotype of the woman being passive, and only a sidekick to the man. * This issue has been known for a long time by the film studios. There was this kind of negative feedback about Ripley in the Alien films for instance. This anti-action female lead negativity is why there have been multiple male driven action/adventure films (including Indiana Jones) but no Wonder Woman film (until this year). - The mass audience has only recently been ready for the hero's journey to be taken by a female lead. Result; TFA, "Rouge One" and "Wonder Woman" all in the last couple of years. Imo at least, BB ;-) Interesting that the male fantasy is full of failure and near death and actually needing others. Female fantasy is all about independence! HELL YEA! If Rey were a combo, she'd still only be good at piloting. She wouldn't know how to use the force beyond enhancing her intuition, and she wouldn't know how to use a lightsabre...yet. Stop justifying. Open your eyes.
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Post by Oh My Aching Ackbar-Raddus! on Jul 30, 2017 5:37:33 GMT
She's a Mary Mary Quite Contrary.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Aug 13, 2017 23:03:52 GMT
Oh yeah she's a Mary Sue.
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Post by Skaathar on Dec 16, 2017 4:13:59 GMT
Rey is the biggest Mary Sue in cinema since Bella Swan.
And the typical hero's journey does not make one a Mary Sue, in fact it makes them the opposite since "journey" implies that they have to conquer challenges and improve themselves to become the hero. A Mary Sue doesn't have a journey, she (or he) is simply a perfect hero, period.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2017 5:28:07 GMT
I can't believe the Mary Todd option didn't get more votes...
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agentsparky
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Post by agentsparky on Dec 18, 2017 20:08:34 GMT
As it stands now, yes she's a Mary Sue. However it's still pending. If The Last Jedi can provide an explanation to Rey's backstory that could change. After seeing The Last Jedi, I have to concur that Rey is a Mary Sue.
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Post by darkpast on Dec 23, 2017 7:22:55 GMT
So stupid, anyone that thinks this is a sexist ASSHOLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Post by Skaathar on Dec 23, 2017 16:24:50 GMT
So stupid, anyone that thinks this is a sexist ASSHOLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope you're joking, because simply stating facts doesn't make one a sexist asshole. In fact, accusing someone of being a sexist asshole for speaking the truth is actually quite sexist itself.
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Post by darkpast on Dec 23, 2017 19:12:48 GMT
So stupid, anyone that thinks this is a sexist ASSHOLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I hope you're joking, because simply stating facts doesn't make one a sexist asshole. In fact, accusing someone of being a sexist asshole for speaking the truth is actually quite sexist itself. half yes/half no, just think the term is overused and lost all meaning from what it was originally intended to mean
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Post by Skaathar on Dec 23, 2017 19:15:43 GMT
I hope you're joking, because simply stating facts doesn't make one a sexist asshole. In fact, accusing someone of being a sexist asshole for speaking the truth is actually quite sexist itself. half yes/half no, just think the term is overused and lost all meaning from what it was originally intended to mean You mean the term mary sue?
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Post by Jedan Archer on Dec 24, 2017 12:10:40 GMT
I hope you're joking, because simply stating facts doesn't make one a sexist asshole. In fact, accusing someone of being a sexist asshole for speaking the truth is actually quite sexist itself. half yes/half no, just think the term is overused and lost all meaning from what it was originally intended to mean Happens a lot to other terms too, "Mary Sue" - originally and actually a mere writing trope - has been hijacked by magazines like The Mary Sue or MRAs for political meaning regarding women. One can circumvent any misunderstanding if one calls it "Fanfiction Character" or "Fanfic Writing" instead of Mary Sue/Gary Stu. Means the same and ignorant people cannot deflect easily with sexist accusations.
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