Kal_1993
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@kalyan1993
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Post by Kal_1993 on Aug 16, 2017 17:38:12 GMT
The episode had everything we have always wanted and everything we were dreading.
But the writing was terrible. And yes writing was worse than Eastwatch.
North of the Wall:
They run into a huge group of White Walkers, Dany flies beyond the wall with her Dragons. Kills the White walkers. Loads and loads of them.
In the process, Viserion is killed by the night King and resurrected towards the end as Ice Dragon.
Winterfell:
Misunderstanding between Sansa and Arya grow to epic proportions. They grow suspicious of each other. Little Finger is clearly winning. Both are acting stupid than usual.
Seriously Arya should have gone south to kill the Queen. Coming back to winterfell, it is obvious writers are desperate to give her some storyline, no matter how retarded it looks.
Dragonstone:
Dany does exactly opposite of what Tyrion advices. There is talk of succesor to Dany.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 16, 2017 17:44:18 GMT
No Cersei. Filler episode
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 16, 2017 17:51:12 GMT
Is this the first time a penultimate episode is not greeted with unconditional worship? (yes, Battle of the Bastards was insulting nonsense but the masses loved it)
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2017 21:03:46 GMT
It was okay, fairly cool, although I could predict most of what was going to happen so it the latter half felt more boring than it should have done. The show has been cartoonish with its script for a while now (at least since BOTB) so I wasn't expecting it to return to form.
I'm guessing next week we will see the Hound vs his zombie brother somehow.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2017 7:06:13 GMT
Is this the first time a penultimate episode is not greeted with unconditional worship? (yes, Battle of the Bastards was insulting nonsense but the masses loved it) I've been without wifi for a couple days and haven't kept up... are people not liking this episode?
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 17, 2017 7:17:44 GMT
Is this the first time a penultimate episode is not greeted with unconditional worship? (yes, Battle of the Bastards was insulting nonsense but the masses loved it) I've been without wifi for a couple days and haven't kept up... are people not liking this episode? Well, the OP is hardly positive and one of the few answers starts with "It was okay, fairly cool, although I could predict most of what was going to happen…" Comments I read elsewhere were equally mixed. It seems dragon riding and plot armour are wearing thin.
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Post by Aj_June on Aug 17, 2017 7:48:25 GMT
I've been without wifi for a couple days and haven't kept up... are people not liking this episode? Well, the OP is hardly positive and one of the few answers starts with "It was okay, fairly cool, although I could predict most of what was going to happen…" Comments I read elsewhere were equally mixed. It seems dragon riding and plot armour are wearing thin. Has anyone here seen samurai movies in which one samurai finishes off 50 or 60 men of the villain? It often looked good as in Tatsuya Nakadai's Harakiri (1962) or Toshiro Mifune's Samurai Rebellion (1967). But I had a feeling that the show runners just trolled us all through the episode 6. It's OK and may be great if viewers are happy to see the visuals or superstars together but they completely put up a stupid take of what things are logically possible even in a supernatural world and the episode lacked the concept of 'time' altogether. This is first time I felt cheated. Hope the book explains it better or it do be better if they remove this subplot altogether.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 17, 2017 8:08:30 GMT
Well, the OP is hardly positive and one of the few answers starts with "It was okay, fairly cool, although I could predict most of what was going to happen…" Comments I read elsewhere were equally mixed. It seems dragon riding and plot armour are wearing thin. Has anyone here seen samurai movies in which one samurai finishes off 50 or 60 men of the villain? It often looked good as in Tatsuya Nakadai's Harakiri (1962) or Toshiro Mifune's Samurai Rebellion (1967). But I had a feeling that the show runners just trolled us all through the episode 6. It's OK and may be great if viewers are happy to see the visuals or superstars together but they completely put up a stupid take of what things are logically possible even in a supernatural world and the episode lacked the concept of 'time' altogether. This is first time I felt cheated. Hope the book explains it better or it do be better if they remove this subplot altogether. I didn't see the episode, nor any of S7 apart from the "Loot Train Attack". I felt so thoroughly cheated and mocked by "Battle of the Bastards" I stopped watching. I gave in and watched "Winds of Winter" months later to get closure but it seems the show never stopped piling up illogical decisions and blatant implausibilities from S5E09 on, catering to action fools and feelers as opposed to satisfying the audience who liked the tight plots and characterisation of the earlier seasons. One could feel cheated at seeing Jorah in the fighting pit in S5E09. What could he possibly have hoped by winning something Daenerys despised? He couldn't know he was going to help save her. Cheating continued when Stannis was made to be found by Brienne, then she went on to rescue Sansa and Davos acted all along as if he'd been watching the show in secret and knew exactly he had to somehow rescue the fan favourite. The show has really been a mockery since it rode the dragon.
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Post by bluerisk on Aug 17, 2017 23:27:38 GMT
Well, the Night's King lost half his army for a dragon that is utterly sensetive to fire. One hit by his brothers and he is gone for good. But maybe he has an other purpose.
But all this just to get a corpse for Cercei?!
The suffering that may come through the Ice Dragon might outweight the suffering from taking King's Landing, and only King's Landing and here only the Red Keep, by epic proportions.
But Brandon Stark the Elder is the real deal - killing a dragon by his own hands. I don't ask how they attached the chains to the dragon...if they can dive, why wait for Jon's rescue party...is he like Bran , or Brandon Stark the Younger, a greenseer and knew that he could snap a personal ride?
And why wasn't Bran warning Jon?! A raven from Eastwatch needs only a few our to Dragonstone. The warning could have arrived long before Jon arrived by sea.
Time managment and safe passage was an issue several times:
If she, the short Bimbo, can fly with three dragons beyond the wall, why not escort Jon back to Winterfell first, let him and her speak to the Northern Lords about their plan to capture a Wight in order to unite the realm against the common enemy. No, they sail days if not weaks to Eastwatch, albeit teleport Euron could intercept them any time - as the writers pleases it. If it is a common plan, she could have contributed one of her dragons - for the sake of safety, for the sake of saving precious time, for the sake of calming down the situation at Winterfell and to speak to the Lords who grow impatient. The same could have done with the Sand Snakes and Yara (just escorting them with dragons and use the fleet to blockade the black water bay. To recon the situation in High Garden and Castely Rock...
Not Dany is that stupid but the writers.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 1:28:13 GMT
But all this just to get a corpse for Cercei?! Not Dany is that stupid but the writers. Complete nonsense, of course. A corpse won't prove anything unless it "does the wight" for demonstration purposes in King's Landing and why should the Night King or whatever controls them do this? Oh, for plot purpose? Yes, I see. No, the writers are not stupid. They know exactly how stupid their Funko Pop buying audience is.
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Post by bluerisk on Aug 18, 2017 1:53:14 GMT
But all this just to get a corpse for Cercei?! Not Dany is that stupid but the writers. Complete nonsense, of course. A corpse won't prove anything unless it "does the wight" for demonstration purposes in King's Landing and why should the Night King or whatever controls them do this? Oh, for plot purpose? Yes, I see. No, the writers are not stupid. They know exactly how stupid their Funko Pop buying audience is. Re-animated corpse then. But why would Cercei even believe anything to be true? It could be a trick - a deformed and sick beggar covered in dirt, maybe even mutilated. There exemplar - as much as I could see it, has no longer eyes and thus no longer the only striking visual of the super natural nature. And who knows how this re-animation business works: Somehow the process is linked to one or more White Walkers. This was made clear when they killed a White Walker and almost his entire troop fell to ashes*. The question is now: has it a maximum reach? The Knight's King or an other WW could have taken over but they didn't. Are these Walkers pegged no matter what. I mean: can the WW or the NK switch their re-animated soldiers on or off as they like or is it once activated you can't switch them off. But it was clear that they tried to get the captured one back. *Like in LOST the Others (I guess they were called this way in both shows at some time) were haunting: invisible and invincible for any human being. But in this scene this White Walker and his troop look like lost, almost bewildered and the humans made the successful surprise attack. And even the stand-off between the traped group and the dead army, even with the Night's King, was almost peaceful - just waiting. Clegane most have been bored to death when he started to throw rocks at them...and was it the WW or this personally attacked/provoked soldier that initiated the attack. Why didn't the WW wait only that long till the ice had grown back and why didn't the Knight's King - who can summond entire blizzards - freeze the lake, and why didn't they (Jon's group) maintain to destroy the ice around them. Again: has the Night's King greenseer powers and did he know that Dany would come and "bring" him his new ride (in all the other scenes they never carried these spears with them). Did he know there plan and that's why the other wights tried to get him back?
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 2:09:55 GMT
Complete nonsense, of course. A corpse won't prove anything unless it "does the wight" for demonstration purposes in King's Landing and why should the Night King or whatever controls them do this? Oh, for plot purpose? Yes, I see. No, the writers are not stupid. They know exactly how stupid their Funko Pop buying audience is. And who knows how this re-animation business works: Not relevant. Let's admit it for the sake of it all, I ask again: why would White Walkers want to help convince Cersei? Without their cooperation in demonstrating, all these fools can get is a corpse.
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Post by bluerisk on Aug 18, 2017 3:38:44 GMT
And who knows how this re-animation business works: Not relevant. Let's admit it for the sake of it all, I ask again: why would White Walkers want to help convince Cersei? Without their cooperation in demonstrating, all these fools can get is a corpse. How did they know the purpose of this wight? He could serve as test object for new weapons or as object for studies to find a weakness or weapon. But they clearly didn't want to "help" and tried to retrieve the captured wight but they failed. They grapped for him, even ignored the living of Jon's group just to get this wight back. The question: why don't they switch him off?! Is there control limited once they have ignited the re-animation...just like the Children couldn't stop it. Is there a kill switch? Or could the living dead even turn against their masters as the White Walkers did in case of the Children? So your question is completely irrelevant: if they wanted to help or not - it is out of their hands now. But as long as there was a chance to thwart their efforts they tried. But rather lukewarm imho. Like I said: the NK could have done far more, be more agressive. But he waited for the dragons before he did anything. The NK wasn't shocked, he wasn't surprised, but he was well prepared for he had these spears they never had carried before, and which were not used gainst Jon or his party albeit they had been in reach and easy targets, but the NK used them to his full success. And they had even large chains with them to retrieve the dragon. Four of them, very big and heavy; something like that - iron is extremly rare beyond the wall - is not falling from the sky: it must be mined and forged months in advance and then carried over thousands of miles. So much effort for something that is actually utterly useless beyond the wall. It was as he waited for the dragon and Jon and the captured corpse was just secondary. Getting back the corpse was a bonus, the cherry on top, but the dragon was the actual objective. In the books the WW serve the great other, the antagonist of the red god, what if this great other can provide his followers also with visions of the future...does the great other exist in the TV show at all? But how did he know?! Anyway: Cercei has a re-animated corpse in her own service. So even if it all works and they can get it back to King's Landing it will still be less impressive than Ser Gregor Glegane.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 4:04:40 GMT
Not relevant. Let's admit it for the sake of it all, I ask again: why would White Walkers want to help convince Cersei? Without their cooperation in demonstrating, all these fools can get is a corpse. But they clearly didn't want to "help" and tried to retrieve the captured wight but they failed. They grapped for him, even ignored the living of Jon's group just to get this wight back. The question: why don't they switch him off?! Is there control limited once they have ignited the re-animation...just like the Children couldn't stop it. Is there a kill switch? Or could the living dead even turn against their masters as the White Walkers did in case of the Children? … The NK wasn't shocked, he wasn't surprised, but he was well prepared for he had these spears they never had carried before, and which were not used gainst Jon or his party albeit they had been in reach and easy targets, but the NK used them to his full success. And they had even large chains with them to retrieve the dragon. Four of them, very big and heavy; something like that - iron is extremly rare beyond the wall - is not falling from the sky: it must be mined and forged months in advance and then carried over thousands of miles. So much effort for something that is actually utterly useless beyond the wall. It was as he waited for the dragon and Jon and the captured corpse was just secondary. Getting back the corpse was a bonus, the cherry on top, but the dragon was the actual objective. This is getting confusing now. I didn't see the episode but it was said that a bunch of wights fell dead again after a White Walker controlling them was killed. Now we'd have another wight with a "life" of its own which no one can control? We saw spears in S2E10 and the Thenn leader was killed by one at Hardhome. The chains are an obvious contrivance and yes, I think the writing is so twisted to support whatever spectacle is wanted that I don't think analysing any of it is worthwhile. There will be no consistent explanation of how wights and White Walkers function together, they will be tied or free as the plot demands it.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 4:51:52 GMT
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Post by bluerisk on Aug 18, 2017 12:46:11 GMT
But they clearly didn't want to "help" and tried to retrieve the captured wight but they failed. They grapped for him, even ignored the living of Jon's group just to get this wight back. The question: why don't they switch him off?! Is there control limited once they have ignited the re-animation...just like the Children couldn't stop it. Is there a kill switch? Or could the living dead even turn against their masters as the White Walkers did in case of the Children? … The NK wasn't shocked, he wasn't surprised, but he was well prepared for he had these spears they never had carried before, and which were not used gainst Jon or his party albeit they had been in reach and easy targets, but the NK used them to his full success. And they had even large chains with them to retrieve the dragon. Four of them, very big and heavy; something like that - iron is extremly rare beyond the wall - is not falling from the sky: it must be mined and forged months in advance and then carried over thousands of miles. So much effort for something that is actually utterly useless beyond the wall. It was as he waited for the dragon and Jon and the captured corpse was just secondary. Getting back the corpse was a bonus, the cherry on top, but the dragon was the actual objective. This is getting confusing now. I didn't see the episode but it was said that a bunch of wights fell dead again after a White Walker controlling them was killed. Now we'd have another wight with a "life" of its own which no one can control? We saw spears in S2E10 and the Thenn leader was killed by one at Hardhome. The chains are an obvious contrivance and yes, I think the writing is so twisted to support whatever spectacle is wanted that I don't think analysing any of it is worthwhile. There will be no consistent explanation of how wights and White Walkers function together, they will be tied or free as the plot demands it. The wights died when the WW was killed. But this one was the only wight in this group who didn't die for whatever reason. Maybe he got rogue in some sort of way. The concept that (all) minions die with their master is not new, but they die when their master die. So an other WWs or even the Night's King had to kill themselves in order to kill this minion. Would you kill yourself? So they tried (lukewarm imho) to get this one by freeing it. But like killing himself was no option for the Knight's King, risking the main objective was also no option (hence his lukewarm actions or even the lack of: waiting, attacking only with single walkers after a long period of no action, not freezing the lake to allow the army to attack at once, not using this long spears). Sometimes you have to accept a collateral damage in order to achieve the main objective. Maybe this loss is of no importance since Cercei will give a damn, or the Knight's King made a grave error in his evalution: getting a dragon > getting back the wight. And no, this spears were special. Far longer than their standard weapons (which are more swords and used as such), no handgrip to fight in combat but real spears and around 3 meters long...and they didn't even bother to use them on Jon and his group. And the spear the King's threw at Vizerion was handed over, it was not his personal weapon, and like I said: it was longer and bigger than the bolts of Qyburn's Scorpion. Here you can see both: the standard weapon (at the back of the Night's King), and one of the spears they never used in combat before (carried by an other walker - but as far as I konw in Bran's vision only).
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 13:26:54 GMT
The wights died when the WW was killed. But this one was the only wight in this group who didn't die for whatever reason. Maybe he got rogue in some sort of way. The concept that (all) minions die with their master is not new, but they die when their master die. So an other WWs or even the Night's King had to kill themselves in order to kill this minion. Would you kill yourself? So they tried (lukewarm imho) to get this one by freeing it. But like killing himself was no option for the Knight's King, risking the main objective was also no option (hence his lukewarm actions or even the lack of: waiting, attacking only with single walkers after a long period of no action, not freezing the lake to allow the army to attack at once, not using this long spears). Sometimes you have to accept a collateral damage in order to achieve the main objective. This keeps getting worse the more it is discussed. So some sort of "special wight" was there, going rogue. Or maybe they are all basically rogue but then they stood in rows doing nothing for Bran to walk through them in S6 and they seemed to be under full control at Hardhome. We've seen lone wights before: Othor attacking Jeor Mormont in S1 and that one going after Sam with an axe in the prologue of S3E01. Osha's former companion also came on his own to kill her, or so she told. It looks like it's whatever the story needs, don't think about it, "it's magic". Suddenly, this wight was important to the Night King? Why? He's lost some of them before, why should he care about this one? He didn't know Jon's plan, had no reason to care much about it. He couldn't have known about someone coming to the rescue with dragons either, yet he was prepared to shoot one down and fetch it out of a lake. At this point (well, no, long ago really) we must admit that there is no explaining what happens in any other way than for the sake of giving willing viewers what they want. The writing makes about as much sense as that of a porn film.
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Post by DSDSquared on Aug 18, 2017 13:37:17 GMT
The episode was VERY good and most people I know who have seen it absolutely loved it. You guys are nuts. I still prefer Episode 4, but this one is definitely close.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Aug 18, 2017 13:44:27 GMT
The episode was VERY good and most people I know who have seen it absolutely loved it. You guys are nuts. I still prefer Episode 4, but this one is definitely close. After seeing the masses of retards who liked Battle of the Bastards, I won't take any mention of the number of pleased viewers seriously. I know they'll swallow any sort of crap.
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Post by DSDSquared on Aug 18, 2017 13:48:41 GMT
The episode was VERY good and most people I know who have seen it absolutely loved it. You guys are nuts. I still prefer Episode 4, but this one is definitely close. After seeing the masses of retards who liked Battle of the Bastards, I won't take any mention of the number of pleased viewers seriously. I know they'll swallow any sort of crap. Battle of the Bastards was a great episode too. I preferred Winds of Winter, but both were excellent. I am confused on what your problem is with this show. There has never been a show as good. Breaking Bad was close, but it only went five seasons and the first season was arguably just good. Still probably my second favorite show ever. Game of Thrones is on its 7th season and is still amazing and an event every week it is on. This season has moved at a faster pace, but is no less excellent. Episode six is VERY good and the final battle scene in the North was amazingly done. I have not seen movies with the production value of this show.
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