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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 4, 2018 6:47:52 GMT
Krishna is considered an omniscient, omnipotent deity, or so "he" claims in the Bhagavad Gita, which is supposed to be a conversation between an ordinary human being, Arjuna, and Krishna. For a comparison between Krisha and other Hindu philosophical ideals or gods there is much discussion to be found in the Bhagavad Gita. For more depth of discussion the Upanishads are more helpful, to this student anyway. Do you have any good suggestions for an english translation of the Upanishads? I finished the Gita this past weekend, and I am interested in reading more Hindu literature. Easwaran also has an Upanishad translation. Have you read his, or did you read another version of the Upanishads? When I was in high school a friend of mine on the debate team gave me a copy of A Source Book in Indian Philosophy by Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan and Charles A. Moore. Radhakrishnan was the first vice president and second president of India. Moore was a professor of comparative philosophy. The book is a comprehensive history of Indian Philosophy from the Vedas to modern times. The Vedas are rather primitive, long and repetitive. The Upanishads are long and repetitive too, but often quoted today. So the book does not include them in entirety, but the excerpts on the Upanishads include all the famous quotes from them you're likely to find. It only has excerpts from the Bhagavad gita and Mahabharata and does not include all the quotes you're likely to find. You might want other books that focus more on those. My complete Bhagavad gita is from A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada of the famous ISKCON. Radhakrishnan's book has excellent commentary and explains the development of the various stages in Indian Philosophy rather well. The Gita was also given to me as a gift.
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Post by OldSamVimes on Mar 4, 2018 17:41:50 GMT
I'm not sure. I forgot to find that quote, but it's highlighted and perhaps I'll do it tomorrow. DO IT ALREADY GODDAMMIT 'Seeing your form so mighty in appearance, so many mouths and eyes, thighs, feet and bellies, and with those fangs of yours that are so dreadful, all the worlds tremble, terrified as I am!
'With gaping mouths and eyes gigantic blazing, you touch the sky and burn with many colors! So I have seen you, and my spirit shuddered, calmness and courage lost to me, O Vishnu!
So terrifying your mouths in appearance, resembling the fires of destruction, disorientated, I can find no refuge, O Lord of Gods, O World Abode, have mercy!
'Into you pour the sons of Dhritarashtra with all the earthly rulers there assembled, Bhisma and Drona too, along with Karna, and with them also our leading warriors!
'Quickly they spill into your mouths so fearsome, your jaws that all with fangs are thickly studded, some men with heads grotesquely crushed and mangled, between your teeth in desperation clinging!
'Just as the many torrents of the rivers flow ever onward into the great ocean, so do the heroes of this world of mortals enter your flaming mouths seen in the distance.
'Like moths that hasten onward till they enter the blazing flame in which they find destruction, just so the worlds, in hastening to enter your gaping mouths, all seek out their destruction.
'With every mouth ablaze, you lick with flaming tongues the worlds which on every side you swallow, and fill the cosmos wholly with your brilliance, your awful light that blazes forth, O Vishnu!
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Mar 4, 2018 22:31:17 GMT
'Seeing your form so mighty in appearance, so many mouths and eyes, thighs, feet and bellies, and with those fangs of yours that are so dreadful, all the worlds tremble, terrified as I am!
'With gaping mouths and eyes gigantic blazing, you touch the sky and burn with many colors! So I have seen you, and my spirit shuddered, calmness and courage lost to me, O Vishnu!
So terrifying your mouths in appearance, resembling the fires of destruction, disorientated, I can find no refuge, O Lord of Gods, O World Abode, have mercy!
'Into you pour the sons of Dhritarashtra with all the earthly rulers there assembled, Bhisma and Drona too, along with Karna, and with them also our leading warriors!
'Quickly they spill into your mouths so fearsome, your jaws that all with fangs are thickly studded, some men with heads grotesquely crushed and mangled, between your teeth in desperation clinging!
'Just as the many torrents of the rivers flow ever onward into the great ocean, so do the heroes of this world of mortals enter your flaming mouths seen in the distance.
'Like moths that hasten onward till they enter the blazing flame in which they find destruction, just so the worlds, in hastening to enter your gaping mouths, all seek out their destruction.
'With every mouth ablaze, you lick with flaming tongues the worlds which on every side you swallow, and fill the cosmos wholly with your brilliance, your awful light that blazes forth, O Vishnu!
So, in conclusion, are you saying that Hinduism is not a religion of peace, either?
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Post by Arlon10 on Mar 4, 2018 23:40:36 GMT
'Seeing your form so mighty in appearance, so many mouths and eyes, thighs, feet and bellies, and with those fangs of yours that are so dreadful, all the worlds tremble, terrified as I am!
'With gaping mouths and eyes gigantic blazing, you touch the sky and burn with many colors! So I have seen you, and my spirit shuddered, calmness and courage lost to me, O Vishnu!
So terrifying your mouths in appearance, resembling the fires of destruction, disorientated, I can find no refuge, O Lord of Gods, O World Abode, have mercy!
'Into you pour the sons of Dhritarashtra with all the earthly rulers there assembled, Bhisma and Drona too, along with Karna, and with them also our leading warriors!
'Quickly they spill into your mouths so fearsome, your jaws that all with fangs are thickly studded, some men with heads grotesquely crushed and mangled, between your teeth in desperation clinging!
'Just as the many torrents of the rivers flow ever onward into the great ocean, so do the heroes of this world of mortals enter your flaming mouths seen in the distance.
'Like moths that hasten onward till they enter the blazing flame in which they find destruction, just so the worlds, in hastening to enter your gaping mouths, all seek out their destruction.
'With every mouth ablaze, you lick with flaming tongues the worlds which on every side you swallow, and fill the cosmos wholly with your brilliance, your awful light that blazes forth, O Vishnu!
So, in conclusion, are you saying that Hinduism is not a religion of peace, either? Maybe not, or maybe that is just something like Blake's The Tyger. India is remarkably peaceful today, and for most of modern history. People who had no movies or television perhaps had violent story time just like people with movies and television. Maybe it didn't lead to social disorder at all.
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Post by OldSamVimes on Mar 5, 2018 2:29:37 GMT
'Seeing your form so mighty in appearance, so many mouths and eyes, thighs, feet and bellies, and with those fangs of yours that are so dreadful, all the worlds tremble, terrified as I am!
'With gaping mouths and eyes gigantic blazing, you touch the sky and burn with many colors! So I have seen you, and my spirit shuddered, calmness and courage lost to me, O Vishnu!
So terrifying your mouths in appearance, resembling the fires of destruction, disorientated, I can find no refuge, O Lord of Gods, O World Abode, have mercy!
'Into you pour the sons of Dhritarashtra with all the earthly rulers there assembled, Bhisma and Drona too, along with Karna, and with them also our leading warriors!
'Quickly they spill into your mouths so fearsome, your jaws that all with fangs are thickly studded, some men with heads grotesquely crushed and mangled, between your teeth in desperation clinging!
'Just as the many torrents of the rivers flow ever onward into the great ocean, so do the heroes of this world of mortals enter your flaming mouths seen in the distance.
'Like moths that hasten onward till they enter the blazing flame in which they find destruction, just so the worlds, in hastening to enter your gaping mouths, all seek out their destruction.
'With every mouth ablaze, you lick with flaming tongues the worlds which on every side you swallow, and fill the cosmos wholly with your brilliance, your awful light that blazes forth, O Vishnu!
So, in conclusion, are you saying that Hinduism is not a religion of peace, either? Peace is what you get in between sufferings. No religion can shy away from suffering and pain. ..some say it's through suffering and pain that you find redemption. Peace is shying away from conflict, from the fire of existence. IMO that's boring. Peace is overrated.
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Mar 5, 2018 15:55:34 GMT
So, in conclusion, are you saying that Hinduism is not a religion of peace, either? Peace is what you get in between sufferings. No religion can shy away from suffering and pain. ..some say it's through suffering and pain that you find redemption. Peace is shying away from conflict, from the fire of existence. IMO that's boring. Peace is overrated. Wow, Sam... are you the same Sam who made this statement, that I use as my signature? Let me know if your worldview has changed and I need to change my signature.
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Post by yougotastewgoinbaby on Mar 5, 2018 21:33:25 GMT
Damn, you weren't kidding. That is way more vivid and descriptive than Easwaran's translation.
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Post by OldSamVimes on Mar 5, 2018 22:14:59 GMT
Peace is what you get in between sufferings. No religion can shy away from suffering and pain. ..some say it's through suffering and pain that you find redemption. Peace is shying away from conflict, from the fire of existence. IMO that's boring. Peace is overrated. Wow, Sam... are you the same Sam who made this statement, that I use as my signature? Let me know if your worldview has changed and I need to change my signature. Yes, that was me too.. I was being facetious with the 'Peace is overrated' comment, but the argument could be made that absolute peace from a cosmic perspective would make consciousness meaningless.
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Post by rachelcarson1953 on Mar 5, 2018 22:32:04 GMT
Wow, Sam... are you the same Sam who made this statement, that I use as my signature? Let me know if your worldview has changed and I need to change my signature. Yes, that was me too.. I was being facetious with the 'Peace is overrated' comment, but the argument could be made that absolute peace from a cosmic perspective would make consciousness meaningless. So, I'm unsure... would you rather I change my signature quote to something else? Like - "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it." Ayn Rand
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Post by Aj_June on May 26, 2018 5:37:23 GMT
I can't answer your OP but if I may provide some other information then I have this to say: Gita is a chapter inside the epic Mahabharata. Mahabharata is possibly the most interpolated text in history of Hindu Dharma or may be history of any kind of literature. Literally every ancient and medieval sects have interpolated it but lately the most mischievous interpolation has come from the Vaishnavite sect. The Vaishnavite sect irrespective of its large following in current era came later than former major extinct sects (such Saura -followers of sun god of Hinduism) as well as current major sects like Shaivism. Krishna was initially a politician in this book. Vaishnavites interpolated Mahabharata to make krishna an avatar of Vishnu (even though there is no backing from Vedas that Vishnu has any avatar). Later the position of Krishna was so highly elevated that there are now sects such as the cult Hare Krishna which claims Vishnu is the avatar of Krishna. It is often said that the original Gita was of 100 verses. I can't comment on that but I am pretty sure that Gita has been interpolated. At least try to avoid Vaisnavite translations of the book. The best possible translation comes from an ancient Kashmir Shaivite philosopher called Abhinavagupta but I am not sure how easy it is to get hands on that. That said Upanishads are better and less interpolated Hindu texts. Apart from that 5 books that I have seen excel in Advaita philosophy (which essentially is the foundation of Gita) are: 1. Ashtavakra Gita - This is better than Bhagavad Gita in many ways and it is more atheistic book so might appeal more to westerners. 2. Tripura Rahasya 3. Avadhuta Gita 4. Vasisthas Yoga (Which I believe is one of the favourite book of the member called OldSamVimes ) 5. Tantraloka 6. Any summary of Upanishads written by any famous philosophers of Shaivite or Advaita school.
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Post by goz on May 27, 2018 1:57:51 GMT
As far as religious superheroes go, I prefer atman and obin.
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