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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 22:43:17 GMT
Not really, the ST was in a pretty crappy situation. Either try something new and fail spectacularly because OT fans are already upset that new movies are being at all, or go for something safe and familiar that appeal to enough new audience members to give the ST its own fanbase and STILL offend the OT fans because they're pissed the new movies are getting their own fans. If Snoke HAD come from the Unknown Regions, then the complaint would just be that he came out of nowhere. @captaintarpals is right. You're making up a bunch of lame excuses. OT fans never opposed these movies being made. And they could care less about them getting fans. They're not against that either. These are fake storylines from Rey fanatics and exclusive ST fans to deflect from the real reasons. Or they're totally accurate and the Rey Haters and exclusive OT fans just want to make it seem like it isn't. It's like the TOS fans and TNG, except TNG was able to pull it off despite TOSers hating the very idea of TNG. Yes yes yes, the OT characters should've been able to handle the First Order on their own and there was no need for new characters and Star Wars should always only ever be about the OT characters and if they introduce new characters they should always be killed off ASAP like in Rogue One so that the OT characters' prominence can never be threatened. Heard it all before.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 22:57:36 GMT
Disagree. The very nature, existence and motivation of the Empire itself is a window into Palpatine's character in the OT. We don't know much about the Empire in the OT either, just that...they're an Evil Empire that wants to control the Galaxy. We know nothing about how they took over in the first place either.Wow! Did you really just say that?!? The conversation Ben ObiWan Kenobi had with Luke Skywalker right after he rescued him in ANH... that conversation concisely outlined much of how the Empire took over. You must be one of those new Disney converts who actually thinks they know more about SW than anyone else because you think just because the new trilogy is currently the most relevant it's the most authentic to the lore... and it supersedes everything else. The ST is fanfic in relation to the rest of onscreen SW. If you want to "accept it" as not being fanfic, your choice. But you will have a tough time defending it not being so based on what's been previously established. Not to mention if regard the prequels as fanfic based on it's differences and inconsistencies then you have a problem regarding everything about the ST being authentic when it has even more inconsistencies.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 23:00:15 GMT
@captaintarpals is right. You're making up a bunch of lame excuses. OT fans never opposed these movies being made. And they could care less about them getting fans. They're not against that either. These are fake storylines from Rey fanatics and exclusive ST fans to deflect from the real reasons. Or they're totally accurate and the Rey Haters and exclusive OT fans just want to make it seem like it isn't. It's like the TOS fans and TNG, except TNG was able to pull it off despite TOSers hating the very idea of TNG. Yes yes yes, the OT characters should've been able to handle the First Order on their own and there was no need for new characters and Star Wars should always only ever be about the OT characters and if they introduce new characters they should always be killed off ASAP like in Rogue One so that the OT characters' prominence can never be threatened. Heard it all before. Nope. Like I said those claims are not being made by OT fans. Show me where they are. You're the only one saying that. Not us. So stop lying.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:01:51 GMT
We don't know much about the Empire in the OT either, just that...they're an Evil Empire that wants to control the Galaxy. We know nothing about how they took over in the first place either. Wow! Did you really just say that?!? The conversation Ben ObiWan Kenobi had with Luke Skywalker right after he rescued him in ANH... that conversation concisely outlined much of how the Empire took over. No, he just says that the Jedi Knights defended the Republic and then the Empire came by and killed all the Jedi. No explanation if they were invaders from another Galaxy or anything. Or how they took over the Galaxy (did they conquer it and destroy the Republic? Were they a faction within the Republic? Nothing was explained until the PT). Nope, been a Wars fan for over 20 years. Because it chose to be about new characters instead of just being about the old ones the way the EU was. I accept it all. I'm saying that people who were for the PT decanonization and then flip-flopped and now want the same thing here don't have legs to stand on.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 23:02:49 GMT
@captaintarpals is right. You're making up a bunch of lame excuses. OT fans never opposed these movies being made. And they could care less about them getting fans. They're not against that either. These are fake storylines from Rey fanatics and exclusive ST fans to deflect from the real reasons. Or they're totally accurate and the Rey Haters and exclusive OT fans just want to make it seem like it isn't. It's like the TOS fans and TNG, except TNG was able to pull it off despite TOSers hating the very idea of TNG. Yes yes yes, the OT characters should've been able to handle the First Order on their own and there was no need for new characters and Star Wars should always only ever be about the OT characters and if they introduce new characters they should always be killed off ASAP like in Rogue One so that the OT characters' prominence can never be threatened. Heard it all before. Yeah! And I've heard these lying accusations without it ever being backed up before! Don't make me laugh, kid. Back it up or shut up.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:06:56 GMT
Or they're totally accurate and the Rey Haters and exclusive OT fans just want to make it seem like it isn't. It's like the TOS fans and TNG, except TNG was able to pull it off despite TOSers hating the very idea of TNG. Yes yes yes, the OT characters should've been able to handle the First Order on their own and there was no need for new characters and Star Wars should always only ever be about the OT characters and if they introduce new characters they should always be killed off ASAP like in Rogue One so that the OT characters' prominence can never be threatened. Heard it all before. Nope. Like I said those claims are not being made by OT fans. Show me where they are. You're the only one saying that. Not us. So stop lying. The complaints are that the OT characters were mischaracterized and "shafted". How are they shafted? Because they were able to handle the Empire years ago but can't handle the First Order now when they're even stronger than they were as Rebels, and the struggle against the First Order is the story of the new characters like Rey and Finn. Now, if the OT characters weren't "shafted" then that means they'd be the way they were in the OT (nevermind 30 years have passed...) and they'd have been able to stop the First Order on their own, meaning there was never any need for Rey and Finn and anyone else. But there IS a need for Rey and Finn, meaning their very existence is an insult to the OT characters. Easy.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:08:15 GMT
Or they're totally accurate and the Rey Haters and exclusive OT fans just want to make it seem like it isn't. It's like the TOS fans and TNG, except TNG was able to pull it off despite TOSers hating the very idea of TNG. Yes yes yes, the OT characters should've been able to handle the First Order on their own and there was no need for new characters and Star Wars should always only ever be about the OT characters and if they introduce new characters they should always be killed off ASAP like in Rogue One so that the OT characters' prominence can never be threatened. Heard it all before. Yeah! And I've heard these lying accusations without it ever being backed up before! Just like I've heard the "Oh, OT fans don't hate the idea of new characters and the OT ones no longer being the Epic Heroes of the Star Wars Saga!" lie before. Show me any OT fans who weren't against Rey and Finn's mere existence. Then YOU'LL have a leg to stand on. If OT fans didn't hate Rey for the simple fact she was the new lead, we wouldn't have all this "She's a SJW Creation! She's a Mary Sue!" stuff.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 23:13:10 GMT
Wow! Did you really just say that?!? The conversation Ben ObiWan Kenobi had with Luke Skywalker right after he rescued him in ANH... that conversation concisely outlined much of how the Empire took over. No, he just says that the Jedi Knights defended the Republic and then the Empire came by and killed all the Jedi. No explanation if they were invaders from another Galaxy or anything. Or how they took over the Galaxy (did they conquer it and destroy the Republic? Were they a faction within the Republic? Nothing was explained until the PT). He did say. He said a pupil of his (Vader) helped hunt down and kill all of the Jedi Knights. That is a lot of exposition. And by the forces in place that we already saw onscreen, it's not too difficult to conclude it would likely have been evil Force users like Vader that helped him or either Stormtroopers. Then you like lying about certain things to defend your argument. Don't know about those people. I'm not one of them. And it's not necessarily true anyway. You can have 2 trilogies that do a bad job of honoring the lore. I'm not saying that's the position I take. I'm just saying it's possible.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:15:49 GMT
No, he just says that the Jedi Knights defended the Republic and then the Empire came by and killed all the Jedi. No explanation if they were invaders from another Galaxy or anything. Or how they took over the Galaxy (did they conquer it and destroy the Republic? Were they a faction within the Republic? Nothing was explained until the PT). He did say. He said a pupil of his (Vader) helped hunt down and kill all of the Jedi Knights. That is a lot of exposition. And by the forces in place that we already saw onscreen, it's not too difficult to conclude it would likely have been evil Force users like Vader that helped him or either Stormtroopers. It doesn't explain where Palpatine (we didn't even know his NAME it the OT!) got all his armies or ships or anything. NOTHING about where he came from. We don't even know how he had Dark Side lightning powers. Was he some Fallen Jedi Master? Nothing was known. No, I just didn't have the utter devotion to the OT cast that I found the mere existence of the ST to be offensive. If you want to get really anal, the OT had it's inconsistencies too.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 23:21:52 GMT
Yeah! And I've heard these lying accusations without it ever being backed up before! Just like I've heard the "Oh, OT fans don't hate the idea of new characters and the OT ones no longer being the Epic Heroes of the Star Wars Saga!" lie before. Show me any OT fans who weren't against Rey and Finn's mere existence. Then YOU'LL have a leg to stand on. If OT fans didn't hate Rey for the simple fact she was the new lead, we wouldn't have all this "She's a SJW Creation! She's a Mary Sue!" stuff. She is a MarySue in the context of the SW universe. Don't mix the issue with people who think that she shouldn't be able to do the same things as the male Jedi heroes. Some misogynists made that argument. People like you counter by saying any criticism of the Rey character is invalid because she's a female. And that line of argument is just as bogus. Rey has a MarySue connection to the Force. Just like some other posters, I like other strong female SW characters. I outline why Rey has a disingenuous connection to the Force and I'm supposed to be a misogynist. Maybe people who criticize the prequels are men haters.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:29:53 GMT
Just like I've heard the "Oh, OT fans don't hate the idea of new characters and the OT ones no longer being the Epic Heroes of the Star Wars Saga!" lie before. Show me any OT fans who weren't against Rey and Finn's mere existence. Then YOU'LL have a leg to stand on. If OT fans didn't hate Rey for the simple fact she was the new lead, we wouldn't have all this "She's a SJW Creation! She's a Mary Sue!" stuff. She is a MarySue in the context of the SW universe. Don't mix the issue with people who think that she shouldn't be able to do the same things as the male Jedi heroes. Some misogynists made that argument. People like you counter by saying any criticism of the Rey character is invalid because she's a female. And that line of argument is just as bogus. Rey has a MarySue connection to the Force. Just like some other posters, I like other strong female SW characters. I outline why Rey has a disingenuous connection to the Force and I'm supposed to be a misogynist. Maybe people who criticize the prequels are men haters. She's hardly more a Stu or archetype than Luke ever was, it just gets hurled at her more due to the resentment over her existence. I suppose if they explain she's also a Force Birth like Anakin she'll just be more of a Stu. Despite no one saying the same about Anakin. ANY explanation of her connection to the Force was going to get ripped into, from her being Luke's daughter to her being Obi-Wan's Grand-Daughter to damn ANYTHING. No, the Prequels had a bad major female character too so it can't be misogyny.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Mar 31, 2018 23:34:01 GMT
He did say. He said a pupil of his (Vader) helped hunt down and kill all of the Jedi Knights. That is a lot of exposition. And by the forces in place that we already saw onscreen, it's not too difficult to conclude it would likely have been evil Force users like Vader that helped him or either Stormtroopers. It doesn't explain where Palpatine (we didn't even know his NAME it the OT!) got all his armies or ships or anything. NOTHING about where he came from. We don't even know how he had Dark Side lightning powers. Was he some Fallen Jedi Master? Nothing was known. That's still considerably more exposition than we have gotten with the First Order and Snoke. And we've already had 2 movies. It's not the existence. It's the obviously bad writing in so many areas that made it seem like they didn't try pr didn't care or both. It sticks out like a sore thumb unless you choose to ignore because you're just gushing over the nostalgia or the Disney warrior princess theme. Ironically my experience has been that fans of the ST are the sensitive ones. They can't allow a single criticism of these films to pass without taking people up on it. And when people start to make valid points they resort to the "you're a misogynist" or the "you can't accept the OT stars not hogging all of the spotlight" argument. It did. But far less than the ST. It's embarrassing how many inconsistencies it has by comparison.
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Post by formersamhmd on Mar 31, 2018 23:36:26 GMT
It doesn't explain where Palpatine (we didn't even know his NAME it the OT!) got all his armies or ships or anything. NOTHING about where he came from. We don't even know how he had Dark Side lightning powers. Was he some Fallen Jedi Master? Nothing was known. That's still considerably more exposition than we have gotten with the First Order and Snoke. And we've already had 2 movies. By the end of the OT, we still didn't know a thing aside from him killing the Jedi with Vader. It wasn't until the PT we knew how. You can't say that and be utterly sure. Again, I bring up TOSer reaction to TNG's announcement. Frankly I think the only thing that would've worked was make Luke the hero of the ST and Rey his fangirl apprentice who is there to get abused and belittled and mocked by everyone. The ST's characters' sole purpose would be there to get made fun of and be useless in the face of the OT characters. Because they've been under attack from all sides since the movies were announced. I'd be edgy too if I had to put up with that. There really aren't that many.
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pete8680
Sophomore
Yo!
@pete8680
Posts: 464
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Post by pete8680 on Mar 31, 2018 23:50:59 GMT
The SJWism is strong with formersam.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 0:24:52 GMT
The SJWism is strong with formersam. Apparently if the lead isn't white and male then the movie must be SJW. Or if there are any major characters who aren't white. Hell, I remember the poor kid who played Flash Thompson in the last Spider-Man movie got death threats because he wasn't white.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 5:46:52 GMT
That's still considerably more exposition than we have gotten with the First Order and Snoke. And we've already had 2 movies. By the end of the OT, we still didn't know a thing aside from him killing the Jedi with Vader. It wasn't until the PT we knew how. And yet it's still more exposition. And like I said you could gather some ideas how. Sure I can. You keep bringing up the Star Trek fanbase. That's an entirely different fanbase. And yet you feel the criticism of the prequels is fair. You're not defensive about the dynamics of that. I think your subjective bias is showing. I would disagree. Posters like @winterssuicide and @captaintarpals have already outlined some of the writing problems. * No exposition on Snoke despite the strong dialogue connecting him to PT and OT events and knowledge. * Rey being written more like a warrior princess using Disney magic rather than a Jedi or a Lightside Force user. But there's also... * Rey's identity being painted as important when it wasn't. * Rey's parents identity being painted as important when it wasn't. * Rey finding her parents being painted as important when it wasn't. * Kylo limps after Rey and Finn when he was shot by Chewbacca but "magically" gets ahead of them in forest when Rey and Finn were running. * Phasma was right beside Finn and Rose before the explosion of the ship but somehow instantly transported behind a door down a burning hallway. * No explanation how the lightsaber wound up in Maz's basement despite teasing there would be an explanation. * Luke wanting to murder his own nephew despite the fact that his own father was more evil and he tried to rehabilitate him and save him. (Ugh! Horrible characterization!) * Luke just tossed the lightsaber over the cliff. The same lightsaber that supposedly has so much Force karma that it caused Rey to have Force visions. * Snoke being powerful enough to manipulate Rey and Kylo with Force Skype, but can't detect a lightsaber right next to him jiggling around and starting to move. * Leia using a Force power in space after conditions that already should've frozen her stiff and killed her. * Leia is so powerful to use a Force power we've never seen before (if you buy it's plausibility), but she can't lift the rocks at the back of the cave tunnels. Everyone waits for Rey to show up. * Finn drags Rose all the way back to the base against a beige/white dune setting and not one walker tank bothers to shoot them. * The people on Takadonna can see the light of the explosion of the Hosnian system, even though that's impossible by the laws of physics. * Kylo killed Lor San Tekka before he knew where the map fragment was. Even though at the time San Tekka was the only one who knew where it was. If Poe had never taken a shot at him then Kylo is screwed. (It would've made sense for Kylo to take San Tekka prisoner and interrogate him). * Rey was the only person desperate to get BB8 to his destination even though she insisted she had to go back to Jakku. And even though everyone else actually had a better reason to. Finn = said himself that he had seen the horrors of the First Order and now considers them evil (Nope! Not enough reason) Han = talked about how important Luke was and how real the Force is to Rey and Finn; hasn't seen his best friend in years and now has a clue where he might be (Nope! Not enough reason!) Maz = gives several dramatic speaches about how evil the First Order is and how important it is to stop them. (Nope! Not enough reason) Rey = befriended a droid a day ago and accidentally ran into circumstances that forced her to leave Jakku... * In TFA Rey constantly implied that she hated to use the Force or was afraid of knowingly using it. Those are traits that according to previous lore either hindered your ability to use the Force or drew you to the Darkside. But not so with Rey. In fact she was stronger and more aligned to the Light under those circumstances. Believe it or not all of those were off the top of my head. If I actually took some time to try and consider all of them...
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 12:23:59 GMT
By the end of the OT, we still didn't know a thing aside from him killing the Jedi with Vader. It wasn't until the PT we knew how. And yet it's still more exposition. And like I said you could gather some ideas how. But still, laying into Snoke that much when Palpatine barely had anything either is hypocritical and mean-spirited. In this situation, they're pretty damn similar. The Prequels are complete and have had years to be properly analyzed. The ST isn't done yet. Like I said, Palpatine. Only SHE thought this stuff was important. No one else did. As for her not being a helpless and useless fighter, I suppose you'd have been satisfied if they went with the "Useless Fangirl" approach just to keep Luke as the main character. He knew the forest better. She was hurt and wandered off somewhere else. It's been 30 years, it could've gotten anywhere. He was ready to kill Vader too for a few seconds too before he calmed down. Here he did the same thing. And seeing how Kylo already had followers and had been planning to burn the Temple anyways, he'd already made his decision. That's not a plot hole. Arrogance does that to a person. Same way the burning on Mustafar should've killed Anakin long before he was put in his suit. [/quote]* Leia is so powerful to use a Force power we've never seen before (if you buy it's plausibility), but she can't lift the rocks at the back of the cave tunnels. Everyone waits for Rey to show up.[/quote] You ever consider her flying drained her force ability for a while? The FO are as bad at aiming as Stormtroopers. The SW Universe has magic in it, physics defying ain't no thing. Kylo isn't perfect. Finn and Han didn't think the Resistance could beat the FO because they'd been through other stuff. Rey was a bit more idealistic. Never outright stated.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 13:55:52 GMT
And yet it's still more exposition. And like I said you could gather some ideas how. But still, laying into Snoke that much when Palpatine barely had anything either is hypocritical and mean-spirited. No it isn't because we never got any onscreen dialogue from the Emperor until the last episode of the trilogy, save for that cameo in TESB. But his dialogue in that case was immediately expounded on & immediately tied into events right after it. Unfortunately some (but not all) of the ST's flaws can already be fairly analyzed. That's how bad some of the writing is. Already addressed that above - it's not a valid counterpoint or comparison. The entire audience thought that it was important because the storytelling framed it that way through the eyes of the main protagonist. The story devoted a critical amount of time to it as a theme. It would be like Luke pursuing to be a great pilot and great Jedi like his father - only to find out 2/3 (two thirds) of the way through TESB that it was really all a Force dream Luke was having, meant to tell that he could only dream about those things but never attain them because he doesn't really have that Force talent or destiny. That would obviously be a case of misleading storylines and bad writing. Nice try but that doesn't wash because Finn already knew the way and where the Millennium Falcon was. In fact, if you listen closely to the dialogue you can hear Finn saying to Rey "It's just right over here..." right before Kylo pops up in front of them. The only way Kylo could've cut them off is if they were severely lost, and they weren't. So that manufactured excuse doesn't fly. Except we saw onscreen that she wasn't hurt. And there was no lapse of time after the explosion for her to wonder anywhere. And even if it was (which it wasn't), it wouldn't make any sense for her to. Now you're just trolling pathetic and desperate excuses. Lol It could've gotten anywhere is not a plausible explanation. It's just a vague and desperate response. It's been 30 years since Boba Fett got swallowed by the saarlac. But if he showed up at Maz's cantina you'd want some answers! He only did that after a long and aggressive lightsaber battle. Not to mention that during that time the Emperor and his own father had been constantly tempting him to turn to the Darkside. Now he's a seasoned master training apprentices under peaceful conditions. On top of that Kylo hasn't even committed any evil acts yet whereas Vader already had a long list of them. And yet he's supposed to be in more of a hurry to kill Kylo than Vader?!?... Riiiiiiight. But it is stupid, and poor writing to use that element as a flippant joke. A joke that clearly didn't work because I haven't heard one positive remark about it. When it's something that you don't even need Force powers to deduce - as in the average person would actually hear that thing jiggling right next to them - that's not arrogance, that's bad writing. Anakin was conscious while that was happening, allowing him to react to it in using the Force while it was happening. Leia wasn't. Not to mention there's nothing conclusive that says his burns were fatal without using the Force since persons in real life have sometimes survived that much burn coverage. No, never considered it since it sounds like a desperate excuse. And I've also never seen an onscreen example where a person is drained from using the Force once - let alone the long lapse of onscreen time we saw between the time they were in that cave and when Leia used the Force in space. Quite a long time. And yet there aim was good enough that every single walker tank that targeted Luke Skywalker actually hit his astral projection. Not one shot missed! More desperate excuses trying (and failing) to defend this bad writing. That may be true but magic doesn't explain this. And this example pushes the envelope by comparison to other examples in SW. It wasn't Kylo's imperfection, it was poorly thought out writing. Those aren't really viable excuses considering the points I brought up about them. And why wouldn't Han think that they could beat the First Order? They beat the Empire and the Empire was bigger and more powerful. That excuse doesn't make sense and it's not even onscreen. But clearly evidenced onscreen through behavior and dialogue from Rey. No question about it.
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Post by formersamhmd on Apr 1, 2018 15:37:00 GMT
But still, laying into Snoke that much when Palpatine barely had anything either is hypocritical and mean-spirited. No it isn't because we never got any onscreen dialogue from the Emperor until the last episode of the trilogy, save for that cameo in TESB. But his dialogue in that case was immediately expounded on & immediately tied into events right after it. But it still gave us nothing on his origins, just like Snoke. The flaws seem mainly to revolve around "Rey's too tough, the OT characters aren't in charge and the FO are just another Empire!" though. Why, because Palpatine wasn't in a sequel series? That still just means it was important to and ONLY her. The audience got suckered into her desires to be more than a random abandoned kid. I dunno, I could get into that. And Kylo could've known a faster way. You get in a big explosion, you'll be shook up too. Yeah, it is. It's been 30 years. Difference between dying and a lightsaber getting lost/left somewhere. He only thought about it for like 1 second, that's what it means to be a human and not a flawless hero. You'd be amazed what people can ignore if they're really, REALLY focused on something else. There's nothing suggesting the Force kept him alive, and yeah those burns were very much fatal. No more than "Anakin's force powers kept him from dying from his burns." He was standing still. So Kylo should be some infallible villain then? Depression over Ben and disgrace over himself. She changed her mind. People do.
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Post by Waxer-n-boil on Apr 1, 2018 16:55:11 GMT
No it isn't because we never got any onscreen dialogue from the Emperor until the last episode of the trilogy, save for that cameo in TESB. But his dialogue in that case was immediately expounded on & immediately tied into events right after it. But it still gave us nothing on his origins, just like Snoke. Obviously you're missing the point. The story never gave us a reason to want or need to know the Emperors backstory. But that was not the case with Snoke. I already listed plenty of flaws besides what you're saying here. But you're just repeating the same thing. Obviously those are not the only flaws and problems. If you put blinders on to it, that's your choice. Ignorance is a choice. Because Palpatine didn't have any involvement to the plot of the OT till the last movie. So there was no need for exposition on him. That's not true of Snoke. It doesn't matter if your main protagonist is the only one who cares about a particular thing in a story. Showing what they care about is a theme of that character, a theme that the audience is also meant to care about when it comes to them. Suckering the audience with it is a cheap and mean-spirited writing trick. You're trolling. Nobody would "get into that". Which is exactly why nobody else does it Abrams and idiot PTB over Disney SW. There was no faster way. The scene clearly showed him heading towards the same entryway that Han Solo came in from, which is right below where Rey and Finn exited. There was no shortcut. There's just you putting up extremely pathetic trolling responses, cuz you've got nothing! Lol Except she clearly wasn't shaken up onscreen. So you're making up stuff that's not onscreen. Just to clue you in - this is always what anyone defending the STs horrible writing eventually does. Every single time. It's quite sad and pathetic to watch unfold. That's on the level of: "I know you are, but what am I?" Silly. Not even worth dignifying with a response. Yeah well, if you knew your SW then you'd know that the saarlac slowly digests it's victims over a thousand years. So technically he might not be dead and if there was some way he could escape or someone extract him from the saarlac - he might survive it. (There's actually been talk of a Boba Fett movie that portrays that happening. But it seems to have stalled). The point is if Fett did somehow survive and show up at Maz's castle, you'd want to know how and why. The same thing applies to the lightsaber. It was much longer than a second. Kylo was sleep and took time to wake up, after all. And it's still comparatively uncharacteristic. Lame... just lame. There's no way you can prove that they were fatal. That's not onscreen. As I already said, those things are survivable in real life. You're just flailing in desperate responses without any credibility. Lol Where the fighter-landspeeders that Poe, Finn, and Rose piloting standing still? They were moving at very high rates of speed and they shot all of those down with accuracy. Not to mention that there's a scene in TESB that shows these walker tanks can shoot down running people easily. And Finn was basically walking very slowly because he had to drag Rose. What's your next pathetic excuse totally devoid of credibility? Lol Nope! Just a well written villain. That's not too much to ask for. Which has nothing to do with assessing the likelihood of defeating the First Order. It doesn't make sense for him to think that you can defeat a galaxy spanning enemy but can't defeat an isolated one that's made small strikes so far. Remember, he already adopted this stance before Starkiller base attacked. More lame analysis from you. Changing her mind has nothing to do with her being stronger in the Force than a trained Kylo when Rey is untrained and unpracticed. And Rey is stronger while being full of doubt and fear and resentment towards wanting to use/experience the Force - all things that hinder Force proficiency according to the lore. I can't take your responses seriously anymore. They no longer have any credibility. They're one egg shy of a dozen away from being desperate and cartoonish trolling. Have fun failing at trying to defend this poorly written nonsense. LULZ
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