Post by ThatGuy on Jun 10, 2018 22:16:49 GMT
No, Spider-man was the doorway. But the Raimi Spider-man movies has that campy/corny-ness to them.
How is Iron Man more comic booky than the X-men movies? If they made Iron Man, I don't think they would have gone as far as Favreau did. Yeah, they pulled back when it came to The Mandarin, but think about all the pull backs we got from the X-men movies.
And I wasn't really criticizing the X-men movies, but the people around it and their views on it and also giving a time frame. Back in those days we wanted CBMs to be closer to the comics, but at the same time, not overly corny/campy. People felt that the movies would have to be corny and campy for them to be like the comics and that you had to change them to be in live action or they would come out like Batman Forever/ & Robin and the like. Nobody thought that if you made the movies in earnest and had the characters believe in what they were doing that it would come out great. When the characters don't think that what they were doing (the costumes and such) was stupid then they audience won't. People behind the movies at that time, had audiences believing that you had to be moody and wearing dark leather for the movies to work. Either that or go Raimi (which was just his style anyway). The MCU is that middle ground between those worlds and it works and people respond to it.
I'd really like to see a DC movie made like an MCU movie. The current DC movies are trying to be so anti-MCU that they go against their own characters.
But I gotta say I disagree (mostly anyway). I do not find the Raimi series to be campy. I find Spiderman 2 to be deeper, more thematic than all MCU movies and it takes its central character far more seriously than Homecoming does. Homecoming is cheesy and weightless as hell compared to Spiderman 2. It's also Doctor Strange and Ant Man that seem corny to me because they do what Spiderman 2 and X Men never did: they delibrately run down and degrade their character with constant winking at the audience.
To me the perfect balance between the two extremes (cheesy and grounded) are exemplified in the first two X Men movies, the first two Spiderman movies, Batman Begins, Iron Man, all three Cap movies and the first and third Avengers movies.
By campy/corny, I'm talking about Raimi's directing style. Yes, they'll have deep stuff like his heart to heart moments with May, but the style of the movie is campy. He does all the same tricks from his Evil Dead movies. X-men never winked at the audience? The movies are full of winks. Constantly telling us how stupid the idea of X-men is? "Would you rather wear yellow spandex?" Logan was wearing dog tags with Wolverine on it, but says how stupid it is that they all have codenames? "The 3rd movie is the always the worst."? Logan had the plot revolve around an X-men comic book. When did Dr. Strange "wink at the camera"? When did Ant-man? The only things I can see being corny in Ant-man is the usage of realistic small items that can be made to look regular size when they wear small. Or the large ant/toy train.
The ones in that list that had perfect balance would be Nolan's Batman (all of them), Iron Man, the Cap movies, and the Avengers movies (all of them*). Especially 3. Because everything was perfectly balanced as it should be.
*The thing that people cry about with AoU is Ultron not being the character he is in the comics. Ultron was created by another character and took from that charcater's personality. He did the same thing in AoU, but with another character. Blame Edgar Wright for sitting on his hands and not making Ant-man. By now we would have had Hank Pym as the main person in the Ant-man suit.