Christians: Is God a “just” god, or a “merciful” god?

Christians: Is God a “just” god, or a “merciful” god? Dec 21, 2018 13:32:19 GMT goz likes this

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Post by captainbryce on Dec 21, 2018 13:32:19 GMT

Dec 20, 2018 19:39:36 GMT Isapop said:

Dec 20, 2018 16:18:21 GMT captainbryce said:

With the right amount of mental gymnastics, anything can be twisted hard enough to mean anything else. The problem is, the passage requires you to ADD all of that into it yourself in order to try to "make it work". It's just special pleading on behalf of Christians that the sacrifice of Jesus be DIFFERENT, and somehow doesn't apply due solely to the fact that God later sends Jesus as a sacrifice. But there is nothing in scripture that establishes an actual difference. On its own, scripture does not distinguish between specific types of sacrifices, or imply that one type sacrifice from one party would be more acceptable than another type. It simply says "sacrifice".

The NT also seems to imply that "doing right" is not even a viable option that can save someone. In the addition to the aforementioned passage in Ephesians about salvation being a free gift from God so that no one can boast, both Jesus and Paul plainly state that "no one is good", and Paul says "all have fallen short of the glory of God". If no one is good, and all have fallen short, then how can doing right ever be a viable option for anyone to be saved? The two things can't both be true. And yet, that's exactly what seemed to happen in Moses case. So I still see a glaring hole in the theology.

I don't think I exerted too much in the way of mental gymnastics here, and I don't think I added anything. The proverb is saying God likes your good works better than your ritual sacrifices. Christianity is saying that, though they're commendable, it's not your good works that will SAVE you, but Jesus' sacrifice. I don't see a problem on this one.

But maybe a real Christian has a stronger argument to make than mine.

Does that not in itself seem antithetical to the point established originally? If God values good works over sacrifice then WHY would salvation be based on sacrifice instead of good works? It’s a contradiction in principle; God is basically talking out of both sides of his mouth. If good works was really better, then logically we shouldn’t need a sacrifice.

And by the way, the sacrifice of Jesus wasn’t really a sacrifice at all since he was resurrected. Nothing was lost! If the wages of sin is death, then Christ only paid our ransom so long as he is dead. But if he was just going to be alive again 3 days later and live forever, then what the hell was the point? At least when Elvis died for my sins he stayed dead!

And this whole notion of sacrificial atonement is completely immoral and unjust to its core. The idea that someone else should pay for your sins is immoral. People should pay for their own sins, and an infinite punishment for finite crimes is also completely immoral. It is not “justice” that a murderer and a rapist get to be “saved” just because they accept Jesus as their Lord and savior, but an atheist, or a Buddhist, or a homosexual have to burn in hell for all eternity despite never harming anyone else. Christianity is a completely immoral system.