antinatalism and pessimism

antinatalism and pessimism Sept 19, 2017 2:10:32 GMT

Quote

Post by cupcakes on Sept 19, 2017 2:10:32 GMT

^tpfkar

Sept 18, 2017 22:37:42 GMT @miccee said:

Sept 18, 2017 22:31:39 GMT cupcakes said:

Nonsense, as of course as there exists no "objective meaning" of anything. Only our shared subjective, which has emphatically ruled that life on balance is a freakin' blast gone too soon, and giving a kid a great start on this wild ride, one that they can choose to step out of any time, is a great gift.

And if society wants the fairest possible state of affairs, that would mean no humans and no society.

But non-existent people do not share that subjective opinion; and you cannot infer consent in all cases based on what the majority thinks. You don't know in which cases you're going to give birth to someone who will find life to be a "freakin' gift" and which cases you're going to give birth to someone who will suffer from severe paranoid schizophrenia and spend their entire life in a psychiatric ward. Or in which cases the child is going to start out with all the advantages, then be crippled in a car accident before their 20th birthday, causing them to spend 70 years confined to a wheelchair, soiling themselves and having other people change their nappy.

Our shared subjective sense of morality generally holds that you cannot gamble someone else's lifesavings without their consent on a risky investment, just because you plan to give them back more than you took if the investment works out. Therefore all I'm really doing is reframing life as being an inherently risky and unnecessary prospect.

Sorry, the nonexistent -wait for it- don't exist. Nor is "consent" even a coherent concept for the empty space where they don't reside. And of course there are no 100% guarantees, and of course they aren't expected. Some having problems is not a sane reason to, forgive me, throw the baby out with the bathwater. Your exaggerated emotional framings of virtually tiny relative risks remain utterly unconvincing of anything save your personal distorted outlook on life. But primo poop visualizations once again!

Certainly stealing is bad, but starting tiny-risk stratospheric-dividend investments for them from your own resources, and nurturing them and their assets, and giving them the substrate on which to have a disproportionately fantastic time, with the ever present ability to check out if they ever want to, is an inherently net-positive lottery-lucky-to-get gift.

And again, "unnecessary" is not the measure.

And they shouldn't be expected to pay the price of everyone else's joy. Especially if nobody would be deprived of that joy in a universe with no sentient life.