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Post by captainbryce on Jun 21, 2018 17:17:27 GMT
After the events of the first Superman film starring Christopher Reeve, we see him hauling off Lex Luthor (played by Gene Hackman) to jail. My question is, what crime exactly would Luthor be charged with?  Yes he did sabotage a US military nuclear weapons convoy, and yes it was calculated to destroy the west coast of California, killing innocent people. But, there was no way to prove that he had anything to do with those events. Only Superman knew about the plot. But there was no actual direct evidence of Luthor’s involvement. So on what grounds could he be imprisoned, and what crime was Luthor and his henchmen Otis going to be charged with? |
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manowar2010
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Post by manowar2010 on Jun 21, 2018 18:10:30 GMT
After the events of the first Superman film starring Christopher Reeve, we see him hauling off Lex Luthor (played by Gene Hackman) to jail. My question is, what crime exactly would Luthor be charged with? Yes he did sabotage a US military nuclear weapons convoy, and yes it was calculated to destroy the west coast of California, killing innocent people. But, there was no way to prove that he had anything to do with those events. Only Superman knew about the plot. But there was no actual direct evidence of Luthor’s involvement. So on what grounds could he be imprisoned, and what crime was Luthor and his henchmen Otis going to be charged with? I don't remember the entire movie (actually, not sure if I have even SEEN the entire movie, as Superman II was shown a lot more on cable in my youth) but just reading the plot, it's possible that Luthor could be charged with some type of conspiracy, as he bought a lot of worthless land that COULD become valuable if his plan worked. Whether that meets any legal threshold or not, not sure, but hey, it's a movie. Couldn't he also be charged with kidnapping Superman? It's possible that Eve Teschmacher would corroborate Superman's version. Manowar2010 |
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Post by politicidal on Jun 21, 2018 19:30:05 GMT
It's Superman, he never lies.  |
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Post by deembastille on Jun 21, 2018 22:52:44 GMT
terrorism. against his own country. with his country's own WOMD.
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Post by brownstones on Jun 21, 2018 23:04:53 GMT
After the events of the first Superman film starring Christopher Reeve, we see him hauling off Lex Luthor (played by Gene Hackman) to jail. My question is, what crime exactly would Luthor be charged with? Yes he did sabotage a US military nuclear weapons convoy, and yes it was calculated to destroy the west coast of California, killing innocent people. But, there was no way to prove that he had anything to do with those events. Only Superman knew about the plot. But there was no actual direct evidence of Luthor’s involvement. So on what grounds could he be imprisoned, and what crime was Luthor and his henchmen Otis going to be charged with?
well......what about Teschmacher?
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 22, 2018 2:27:22 GMT
He killed a couple of cops who were tracking Otis.
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Post by captainbryce on Jun 22, 2018 10:41:39 GMT
He killed a couple of cops who were tracking Otis. He killed one cop. The problem is, there is no direct evidence of that. As far as the police department knows, “Harry” the cop was killed in an accident when he was crawling around in an active train track. Nobody actually witnessed Luthor killing him. Nor was there any witnesses to the missile tampering. Any evidence against Luthor would be entirely circumstantial and it would be Superman’s word against Luthor’s. I suppose Miss Tessmacher could have testified against Luthor on Superman’s behalf, but there is no indication that she ever actually did that. There was no trial at all, which is kind of my point. Superman just takes Luthor to jail. And the sequel clearly establishes that Miss Tessmacher is the one who breaks him out of prison, so even if there were a trial, her allegiance is still with him. |
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 22, 2018 14:16:44 GMT
He killed one cop. The problem is, there is no direct evidence of that. As far as the police department knows, “Harry” the cop was killed in an accident when he was crawling around in an active train track. Yeah but they had a record on Luthor and were tracking his accomplice.
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Post by Nalkarj on Jun 22, 2018 14:30:03 GMT
I always assumed—because of the subterranean hideout et al.—that Lex had already been in prison, was already a known criminal, and had already escaped, so Supes was just bringing him back.
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 22, 2018 17:31:51 GMT
Superman did catch a bunch of crooks in the story so why would they doubt him about Luthor?
In fact, Luthor's ego would make him admit to it.
He was able to break out of jail when he wanted to.
All it took was a scratch on his Liberace record to drive him over the edge.
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Post by MCDemuth on Jun 23, 2018 1:46:09 GMT
Otis was already under suspicion for something. Lex killed that policeman. Lex bought all that land in a real-estate scheme. Lex broke into a museum to steal the Kryptonite Lex threatened the city. Lex tried to kill Superman. The missile trajectories were altered (By "Someone") Lex told Superman his entire plan with the Missiles. Lex tried to kill Miss Tessmacher. Maybe those things are "circumstantial", but when you add it all up... Plus, Superman was a known hero, and never lies. In fact, Luthor's ego would make him admit to it. If I recall right... When Superman took Lex to jail, the Warden asked who it was... Lex took off his wig, and said: "Lex Luthor. The Greatest Criminal Mind Of Our Time"... That's not something an innocent man would say! He might as well have admitted it to the warden. Superman VS Lex Luthor... Who would you believe? Case Closed. |
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jun 23, 2018 18:35:30 GMT
Technically its an interesting question.
There is a comic book ( I forget which exactly) where Superman says he's going to bring Luthor in for some thing or the other, and Luthor just says "prove it." Knowing he cant, Superman flies off. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2018 19:43:26 GMT
After the events of the first Superman film starring Christopher Reeve, we see him hauling off Lex Luthor (played by Gene Hackman) to jail. My question is, what crime exactly would Luthor be charged with? Mass murder, for the people who died in his missile thing. Now there's some presumption to this. We know Superman reversed time and saved Lois, but we really don't know just how he did that. We know Lois complained to him of things exploding and rocks all over the place and stuff, so I always presumed that the bomb went off as before, and Superman just made sure to save Lois this time. In which case plenty of people probably still died. There is Superman's eyewitness testimony. Given his reputation, it is entirely possible that a prosecutor could decide to proceed with a prosecution based on that alone, and entirely possible that a jury could convict on that alone. A search of Luthor's home pad might also reveal supporting evidence. For that matter, the introduction of Luthor makes it clear that he's already wanted by the police. So there's reason to lock him up right there. In fact if he were an already convicted criminal who escaped, rather than being wanted as a suspect, then it would even make sense that Superman would take him directly back to prison rather than turning him in to the cops. |
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Post by MCDemuth on Jun 26, 2018 21:12:39 GMT
Now there's some presumption to this. We know Superman reversed time and saved Lois, but we really don't know just how he did that. We know Lois complained to him of things exploding and rocks all over the place and stuff, so I always presumed that the bomb went off as before, and Superman just made sure to save Lois this time. In which case plenty of people probably still died. Watch the YouTube video in my post: imdb2.freeforums.net/post/1497703 |
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Post by captainbryce on Jun 26, 2018 22:22:51 GMT
He killed one cop. The problem is, there is no direct evidence of that. As far as the police department knows, “Harry” the cop was killed in an accident when he was crawling around in an active train track. Yeah but they had a record on Luthor and were tracking his accomplice.
People can be “tracked” without necessarily having a “record”. They may simply have a warrant or APB out on them, with no actual record of a crime. Luthor was possibly suspected of crimes, OR the cops/Feds just wanted to keep tabs on him in order to catch him in the commission of a crime. They may simply have wanted to know where his lair was so they could subpoena evidence against him. Ultimately, we don’t know what (if anything) the authorities had on Luthor because that is never revealed in the film. Luthor boasting about being “the greatest criminal mind of our time” could have (and certainly seemed like) a self reinforced stroke to his own ego. There was no actual evidence of that in the film, other than him being in hiding. In any case, people cannot simply be thrown in prison without due process. Superman has no authority to “arrest anyone”, much less take them to prison. At most all he should legally be able to do is deliver suspects into the hands of police (which is what he does several times earlier in the movie). Luthor can be temporarily jailed after he is officially charged with a crime. But he still has to have his day in court and be found guilty by a jury before serving a prison sentence. Superman seems to bypass all of those steps. I realize it’s only a comic book, fantasy film and this isn’t the type of thing children (or young fans) are supposed to think about. But now that I’m an adult and realize how the real world operates, Superman’s actions wouldn’t have gone off as smoothly in the real world! |
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 26, 2018 22:26:10 GMT
But now that I’m an adult and realize how the real world operates, Superman’s actions wouldn’t have gone off as smoothly in the real world! And what about the kid who gets slapped because of Superman? He caused an act of child abuse! |
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Post by captainbryce on Jun 26, 2018 22:51:24 GMT
But now that I’m an adult and realize how the real world operates, Superman’s actions wouldn’t have gone off as smoothly in the real world! And what about the kid who gets slapped because of Superman? He caused an act of child abuse! Well no, her mother cause the act of child abuse (if you believe that slapping a child amounts to “child abuse”). |
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 26, 2018 22:53:53 GMT
Well no, her mother cause the act of child abuse (if you believe that slapping a child amounts to “child abuse”). Yes but if Superman had not dropped by, she wouldn't have ran in to tell her mother she saw a flying man. And with his super hearing, he should have heard their conversation.
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Post by captainbryce on Jun 26, 2018 23:31:58 GMT
Well no, her mother cause the act of child abuse (if you believe that slapping a child amounts to “child abuse”). Yes but if Superman had not dropped by, she wouldn't have ran in to tell her mother she saw a flying man. And with his super hearing, he should have heard their conversation.
Well assuming he did here it, what was he supposed to do exactly? |
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Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Jun 26, 2018 23:46:17 GMT
Well assuming he did here it, what was he supposed to do exactly? By 1970s standards, probably not much. Maybe give the mother a lecture on the value of peaceful thoughts or something.
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