NormanClature
Junior Member
"Anyone would think tin-pot-dictatorship is a bad thing???!?"
@armyofone
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Post by NormanClature on Jul 22, 2018 0:50:09 GMT
.........Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash and Cyborg in the movie?
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 22, 2018 2:15:30 GMT
.........Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash and Cyborg in the movie? Because they don't live in Atlantis.
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jul 22, 2018 2:21:57 GMT
.........Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash and Cyborg in the movie? Because they don't live in Atlantis. But the whole point of the Justice League is to stop world-catastrophy events that threaten the lives of everyone in the world. Orm wanting to go to war with humans isn't one?
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NormanClature
Junior Member
"Anyone would think tin-pot-dictatorship is a bad thing???!?"
@armyofone
Posts: 2,108
Likes: 1,196
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Post by NormanClature on Jul 22, 2018 2:23:09 GMT
.........Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash and Cyborg in the movie? Because they don't live in Atlantis. Is the entire movie set in Atlantis?
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 22, 2018 2:30:04 GMT
Because they don't live in Atlantis. But the whole point of the Justice League is to stop world-catastrophy events that threaten the lives of everyone in the world. Orm wanting to go to war with humans isn't one? Unlike the Avengers, who won't bother to help people below their pay grade (i.e. the unimportant and poor people who can't afford to pay the Avengers' fee), the Justice League actually helps regular people (e.g. Superman saves a little girl from a burning building, Wonder Woman stops terrorists who take hostages, the Flash stops a robber in a grocery store, etc.). So they can't all be in Atlantis when there are plenty of people around the world who need their help.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 22, 2018 2:30:21 GMT
.........Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, The Flash and Cyborg in the movie?
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 22, 2018 2:31:32 GMT
But the whole point of the Justice League is to stop world-catastrophy events that threaten the lives of everyone in the world. Orm wanting to go to war with humans isn't one? Unlike the Avengers, who won't bother to help people below their pay grade (i.e. the unimportant and poor people who can't afford to pay the Avengers' fee), the Justice League actually helps regular people (e.g. Superman saves a little girl from a burning building, Wonder Woman stops terrorists who take hostages, the Flash stops a robber in a grocery store, etc.). So they can't all be in Atlantis when there are plenty of people around the world who need their help. What does this have to do with anything?
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jul 22, 2018 2:37:11 GMT
But the whole point of the Justice League is to stop world-catastrophy events that threaten the lives of everyone in the world. Orm wanting to go to war with humans isn't one? Unlike the Avengers, who won't bother to help people below their pay grade (i.e. the unimportant and poor people who can't afford to pay the Avengers' fee), the Justice League actually helps regular people (e.g. Superman saves a little girl from a burning building, Wonder Woman stops terrorists who take hostages, the Flash stops a robber in a grocery store, etc.). So they can't all be in Atlantis when there are plenty of people around the world who need their help. Okay, but you didn't answer my question though. They're supposed to get together when the threat is to the world and not just an individual or a small group or small city. So again, is Orm going to war with all humans not a threat to the world?
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Post by politicidal on Jul 22, 2018 2:47:50 GMT
I think in Cyborg's case he might end up like a toaster in the bathtub.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 22, 2018 4:02:06 GMT
Unlike the Avengers, who won't bother to help people below their pay grade (i.e. the unimportant and poor people who can't afford to pay the Avengers' fee), the Justice League actually helps regular people (e.g. Superman saves a little girl from a burning building, Wonder Woman stops terrorists who take hostages, the Flash stops a robber in a grocery store, etc.). So they can't all be in Atlantis when there are plenty of people around the world who need their help. Okay, but you didn't answer my question though. They're supposed to get together when the threat is to the world and not just an individual or a small group or small city. So again, is Orm going to war with all humans not a threat to the world? It's really simple, but obviously MCU fans can't understand it because MCU fans are used to the dumbed-down MCU movies. In AoU, the Avengers just invade a foreign country and attack residents of that foreign country without any regard for the political ramifications of a their actions (i.e. a team of mercenaries led by a former American soldier illegally invading a foreign country and attacking residents of that foreign country could be viewed by the rest of the world as the US committing an act of war on a foreign country). And in Black Panther, Ross (an agent of the US government) participates in an illegal coup against the rightful King (Killmonger, who defeated T'Challa legally in combat and was coronated King of Wakanda) of a foreign country, which could involve the US in a war against Wakanda. To the Atlanteans, the Justice League are surface-dwellers. If the Justice League just went to Atlantis and fought Orm's army, the Atlanteans could view it as the surface dwellers sending the Justice League to war against them and that would only result in an escalation of the war. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean, the war could be stopped without major escalation if Arthur were able to defeat Orm and claim the throne of Atlantis. That's a better approach to ending the war without major escalation rather than the Justice League just going to Atlantis and fighting Orm's army, which would result in more tension and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface-dwellers and lead to an escalation of the war.
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jul 22, 2018 4:20:30 GMT
Okay, but you didn't answer my question though. They're supposed to get together when the threat is to the world and not just an individual or a small group or small city. So again, is Orm going to war with all humans not a threat to the world? It's really simple, but obviously MCU fans can't understand it because MCU fans are used to the dumbed-down MCU movies. In AoU, the Avengers just invade a foreign country and attack residents of that foreign country without any regard for the political ramifications of a their actions (i.e. a team of mercenaries led by a former American soldier illegally invading a foreign country and attacking residents of that foreign country could be viewed by the rest of the world as the US committing an act of war on a foreign country). And in Black Panther, Ross (an agent of the US government) participates in an illegal coup against the rightful King (Killmonger, who defeated T'Challa legally in combat and was coronated King of Wakanda) of a foreign country, which could involve the US in a war against Wakanda. To the Atlanteans, the Justice League are surface-dwellers. If the Justice League just went to Atlantis and fought Orm's army, the Atlanteans could view it as the surface dwellers sending the Justice League to war against them and that would only result in an escalation of the war. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean, the war could be stopped without major escalation if Arthur were able to defeat Orm and claim the throne of Atlantis. That's a better approach to ending the war without major escalation rather than the Justice League just going to Atlantis and fighting Orm's army, which would result in more tension and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface-dwellers and lead to an escalation of the war. Except, as Mera told Arthur, Orm has already made it known he's going to start a war with the surface. Orm intends on attacking first. That alone is enough to warrant the Justice League to intervene.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 22, 2018 4:37:51 GMT
Okay, but you didn't answer my question though. They're supposed to get together when the threat is to the world and not just an individual or a small group or small city. So again, is Orm going to war with all humans not a threat to the world? It's really simple, but obviously MCU fans can't understand it because MCU fans are used to the dumbed-down MCU movies. In AoU, the Avengers just invade a foreign country and attack residents of that foreign country without any regard for the political ramifications of a their actions (i.e. a team of mercenaries led by a former American soldier illegally invading a foreign country and attacking residents of that foreign country could be viewed by the rest of the world as the US committing an act of war on a foreign country). And in Black Panther, Ross (an agent of the US government) participates in an illegal coup against the rightful King (Killmonger, who defeated T'Challa legally in combat and was coronated King of Wakanda) of a foreign country, which could involve the US in a war against Wakanda. To the Atlanteans, the Justice League are surface-dwellers. If the Justice League just went to Atlantis and fought Orm's army, the Atlanteans could view it as the surface dwellers sending the Justice League to war against them and that would only result in an escalation of the war. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean, the war could be stopped without major escalation if Arthur were able to defeat Orm and claim the throne of Atlantis. That's a better approach to ending the war without major escalation rather than the Justice League just going to Atlantis and fighting Orm's army, which would result in more tension and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface-dwellers and lead to an escalation of the war. I like how you say in the previous post how the Justice League go into other countries "to help" then say that the Avengers invade other countries. That bias is strong, son! No one gave the Justice League permission to go into Russia with their pet zombie.
Killmonger did not defeat T'Challa because T'Challa wasn't killed and he didn't yield. You say that Ross participates in a coup, but then Mera is starting a coup by going to get Arthur to overthrow the rightful King of Atlantis that is only trying to stop people from poisoning his home. Also, you say that the Atlanteans see the Justice League as surface-dwellers. What do you think they see Arthur as? And this is after Justice League so Arthur knows the others. He could ask them for help. Just because Arthur is half Atlantean means nothing. He is still an outsider. Hell, him being a half breed makes it worse.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 22, 2018 6:04:44 GMT
It's really simple, but obviously MCU fans can't understand it because MCU fans are used to the dumbed-down MCU movies. In AoU, the Avengers just invade a foreign country and attack residents of that foreign country without any regard for the political ramifications of a their actions (i.e. a team of mercenaries led by a former American soldier illegally invading a foreign country and attacking residents of that foreign country could be viewed by the rest of the world as the US committing an act of war on a foreign country). And in Black Panther, Ross (an agent of the US government) participates in an illegal coup against the rightful King (Killmonger, who defeated T'Challa legally in combat and was coronated King of Wakanda) of a foreign country, which could involve the US in a war against Wakanda. To the Atlanteans, the Justice League are surface-dwellers. If the Justice League just went to Atlantis and fought Orm's army, the Atlanteans could view it as the surface dwellers sending the Justice League to war against them and that would only result in an escalation of the war. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean, the war could be stopped without major escalation if Arthur were able to defeat Orm and claim the throne of Atlantis. That's a better approach to ending the war without major escalation rather than the Justice League just going to Atlantis and fighting Orm's army, which would result in more tension and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface-dwellers and lead to an escalation of the war. Except, as Mera told Arthur, Orm has already made it known he's going to start a war with the surface. Orm intends on attacking first. That alone is enough to warrant the Justice League to intervene. I see that you still haven't gotten it yet so I'll try to explain it more clearly to you. Regardless if Orm intends to attack first, there are 2 ways to end the war: 1. The Justice League could get involved. But like I said, the Atlanteans view the Justice League as surface-dwellers and fighting for the surface-dwellers, which would result in the Atlanteans to distrust the surface-dwellers more and thus give Orm more justification for going to war with the surface-dwellers. The Atlanteans may feel that they have no choice but to fight and win the war so the Atlanteans might dig their heels in and pledge their support for Orm even more, resulting in an escalation of the war. 2. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean and son of the Queen, if Arthur defeats Orm, then Arthur can claim the throne of Atlantis and end the war without increased tensions and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface dwellers and without major escalation of the war.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 22, 2018 6:23:34 GMT
Killmonger did not defeat T'Challa because T'Challa wasn't killed and he didn't yield. Killmonger did defeat T'Challa. Because when Killmonger was about to cut off T'Challa's head, Zuri stopped Killmonger. Since Zuri was basically the referee of the fight, by interfering in the fight and stopping Killmonger from killing T'Challa, Zuri is basically yielding for T'Challa and declaring Killmonger the winner. That's what happens in fights. When the referee steps in and stops the fight, that means the fight is over and the fighter who is still standing is the winner. So Killmonger did defeat T'Challa and did legally win the fight, which is why Killmonger was coronated as the legal and rightful King of Wakanda. You say that Ross participates in a coup, but then Mera is starting a coup by going to get Arthur to overthrow the rightful King of Atlantis Ross is an agent of the American government so Ross' actions represent America and thus Ross' participation in an illegal coup against the legal and rightful King of a foreign country could be considered as the US supporting an illegal overthrow of the legal and rightful King, which could result in getting the US involved in a war that POTUS doesn't want the US to be in. Mera is an Atlantean so her actions don't represent the surface-dwellers or any foreign nations. Her actions are internal to Atlantis. What do you think they see Arthur as? Arthur is the son of the Queen so Arthur not only has Atlantean blood but Atlantean royal blood. Just because Arthur is half Atlantean means nothing. He is still an outsider. Arthur isn't just half-Atlantean. Arthur's mother is the Queen so Arthur is Atlantean royalty.
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Post by scabab on Jul 22, 2018 7:43:51 GMT
Is it actually set after Justice League? I couldn't really tell.
Still there's been plenty of major disasters in the original individual comics without the Justice League being called in every time.
I'm not sure people always ask that for the movies.
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NormanClature
Junior Member
"Anyone would think tin-pot-dictatorship is a bad thing???!?"
@armyofone
Posts: 2,108
Likes: 1,196
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Post by NormanClature on Jul 22, 2018 11:27:56 GMT
Except, as Mera told Arthur, Orm has already made it known he's going to start a war with the surface. Orm intends on attacking first. That alone is enough to warrant the Justice League to intervene. I see that you still haven't gotten it yet so I'll try to explain it more clearly to you. Regardless if Orm intends to attack first, there are 2 ways to end the war: 1. The Justice League could get involved. But like I said, the Atlanteans view the Justice League as surface-dwellers and fighting for the surface-dwellers, which would result in the Atlanteans to distrust the surface-dwellers more and thus give Orm more justification for going to war with the surface-dwellers. The Atlanteans may feel that they have no choice but to fight and win the war so the Atlanteans might dig their heels in and pledge their support for Orm even more, resulting in an escalation of the war. 2. Since Arthur is half-Atlantean and son of the Queen, if Arthur defeats Orm, then Arthur can claim the throne of Atlantis and end the war without increased tensions and distrust between the Atlanteans and surface dwellers and without major escalation of the war. It is pretty clear that Orm gets as far as taking the attack to land. There is no need for the Justice League to go to Atlantis but why aren't they there to defend the shore?
And that isn't even including what Black Manta is doing..........
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Post by politicidal on Jul 22, 2018 12:18:59 GMT
Is it actually set after Justice League? I couldn't really tell. Still there's been plenty of major disasters in the original individual comics without the Justice League being called in every time. I'm not sure people always ask that for the movies. Just for piling on whatever the franchise is. Justice League or the Avengers.
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Post by dazz on Jul 22, 2018 13:10:14 GMT
Obvious answer is Aquaman is to much a bro to ask for help, it's his people there for his problem, now if the Atlanteans do make a full scale assault on the surface theres no excuse as to why Superman or Flash don't get involved, you know seeing how they can get to wherever the main assault is in seconds to lend a hand, Batman, Cyborg & Wonder Woman would need a heads up though, and likelihood is the attack would take place right after Arthur's attempts and a "peaceful" resolution fail leaving no time for him to warn the others.
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Post by James Bond on Jul 22, 2018 14:06:45 GMT
Iron Man 3 was set after The Avengers. Why weren't Cap, Thor, Hulk, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury in that?
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Post by dazz on Jul 22, 2018 15:43:59 GMT
Iron Man 3 was set after The Avengers. Why weren't Cap, Thor, Hulk, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury in that? Best guess Cap -Was on a mission elsewhere Thor - Was in Asguard Hulk - Banner was keeping out of the loop on purpose at Stark Tower Black Widow - Also on a mission elsewhere doing spy shit. Hawkeye - Probably at home with the famly or on assignment somewhere Fury - Overseeing other threats and didn't consider Mandarin a priority...that or he took his eye off the ball for a minute, could have been focused on bringing Coulson back if you count the TV stuff, that or too busy digging into the Hydra stuff, you know Fury has a lot on his plate give the man a break people jeez.
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