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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 22, 2018 12:28:10 GMT
Why did Zod get sent to the safety of space when the planet was about to explode? I mean a reason that's actually shown in the film, they're the only ones that count. they were not brought to "safety" but to the phantom zone prison. As seems the law and tradition of Krypton.
It is not clear in the film if it is was even accepted or acknoledged by the general public that Krypton will implode. Maybe it was kept a secret to avoid mass panics. Or else why would they not all try to evacuate in masses like the Els? Not sending the Zod traitors to the Zone would have raised suspicions and achieved nothing but troublemaking and Zod rioting.
It's a pretty convenient thing with Zod but it's what it is in space operas.
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 22, 2018 15:17:35 GMT
Why did Zod get sent to the safety of space when the planet was about to explode? I mean a reason that's actually shown in the film, they're the only ones that count. they were not brought to "safety" but to the phantom zone prison. As seems the law and tradition of Krypton.
It is not clear in the film if it is was even accepted or acknoledged by the general public that Krypton will implode. Maybe it was kept a secret to avoid mass panics. Or else why would they not all try to evacuate in masses like the Els? Not sending the Zod traitors to the Zone would have raised suspicions and achieved nothing but troublemaking and Zod rioting.
It's a pretty convenient thing with Zod but it's what it is in space operas.
None of that is at all indicated in the film. |
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 22, 2018 15:40:34 GMT
they were not brought to "safety" but to the phantom zone prison. As seems the law and tradition of Krypton.
It is not clear in the film if it is was even accepted or acknoledged by the general public that Krypton will implode. Maybe it was kept a secret to avoid mass panics. Or else why would they not all try to evacuate in masses like the Els? Not sending the Zod traitors to the Zone would have raised suspicions and achieved nothing but troublemaking and Zod rioting.
It's a pretty convenient thing with Zod but it's what it is in space operas.
None of that is at all indicated in the film. so wasn't your assertion that "Zod get sent to the safety of space" when it was clear it was a prison. Nor was "they're the only ones that count".
My interpretation was specualation too, but valid because I interpreted the plot elements and dialogue reasonably so that they make sense in context. Whereas you made an ad absurdum interpretation thereby rendering everything pointless and against what was told. That's a no go in logical interpreation.
It's like if a traitor is banned from the city to a fortress in the mountains, and little later a deluge/avalange destroys the city so that only the prisoners survive. Convenient and lazy maybe, but possible.
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 22, 2018 17:19:54 GMT
None of that is at all indicated in the film. so wasn't your assertion that "Zod get sent to the safety of space" when it was clear it was a prison. Nor was "they're the only ones that count".
My interpretation was specualation too, but valid because I interpreted the plot elements and dialogue reasonably so that they make sense in context. Whereas you made an ad absurdum interpretation thereby rendering everything pointless and against what was told. That's a no go in logical interpreation.
It's like if a traitor is banned from the city to a fortress in the mountains, and little later a deluge/avalange destroys the city so that only the prisoners survive. Convenient and lazy maybe, but possible.
What we see in the film is that the planet is about to be destroyed, which seems to be causing all the drama, and they send the villains away to somewhere that turns out to be escapable, and they just stay to die. That's all the information we are given, no assertions. |
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 22, 2018 19:31:53 GMT
so wasn't your assertion that "Zod get sent to the safety of space" when it was clear it was a prison. Nor was "they're the only ones that count".
My interpretation was specualation too, but valid because I interpreted the plot elements and dialogue reasonably so that they make sense in context. Whereas you made an ad absurdum interpretation thereby rendering everything pointless and against what was told. That's a no go in logical interpreation.
It's like if a traitor is banned from the city to a fortress in the mountains, and little later a deluge/avalange destroys the city so that only the prisoners survive. Convenient and lazy maybe, but possible.
What we see in the film is that the planet is about to be destroyed, which seems to be causing all the drama, and they send the villains away to somewhere that turns out to be escapable, and they just stay to die. That's all the information we are given, no assertions. We are given a lot more information: You just have to interpret is sensibly. It's a moral tale: Krypton is a dying world and society. They have exploited it literally to it's core and resources are gone. There are no natural births anymore. There is civil war. And their legacy is a genetic codex. As Jor-El say: " Everybody on Krypton is already dead!". But they are not sure about that. " There is no refuge. Kal-El was right! This is the end." says Jor-Els wife just before she dies. Kal-El is the first natural born child since ever. They want to save the legacy by sending the codex & Kal-El to another world. |
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Aug 22, 2018 19:50:05 GMT
Why did Zod get sent to the safety of space when the planet was about to explode? I mean a reason that's actually shown in the film, they're the only ones that count. 
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 22, 2018 19:54:55 GMT
Why did Zod get sent to the safety of space when the planet was about to explode? I mean a reason that's actually shown in the film, they're the only ones that count.
No it was just a question about a really bad piece of writing no on really talks about (unlike why did Lois Lane get invited onto the ship?) |
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dnno1
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 25, 2018 19:03:52 GMT
Yes, the council was fully aware that the planet was going be destroyed because Jor-El had warned them, but it was too late to save anything and the council believed that they had no other choice by to do what they did. So they know the planet is about to be destroyed and the send the criminals somewhere else? Yes, they were plotting a coup. Would you have them stick around to finish it? Some people might think that justice should go out the window when the end is nigh, but on the contrary, so long as (a majority of) people believe in justice it will prevail even to the end of times. |
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 25, 2018 19:30:35 GMT
so wasn't your assertion that "Zod get sent to the safety of space" when it was clear it was a prison. Nor was "they're the only ones that count".
My interpretation was specualation too, but valid because I interpreted the plot elements and dialogue reasonably so that they make sense in context. Whereas you made an ad absurdum interpretation thereby rendering everything pointless and against what was told. That's a no go in logical interpreation.
It's like if a traitor is banned from the city to a fortress in the mountains, and little later a deluge/avalange destroys the city so that only the prisoners survive. Convenient and lazy maybe, but possible.
What we see in the film is that the planet is about to be destroyed, which seems to be causing all the drama, and they send the villains away to somewhere that turns out to be escapable, and they just stay to die. That's all the information we are given, no assertions. The thing is that no one in this universe could conceivably know that a force as large enough to destroy a planet could free prisoners from a phantom zone otherwise they would have taken precautions against it. |
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NormanClature
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Post by NormanClature on Aug 26, 2018 10:41:27 GMT
Yes, the council was fully aware that the planet was going be destroyed because Jor-El had warned them, but it was too late to save anything and the council believed that they had no other choice by to do what they did. So they know the planet is about to be destroyed and the send the criminals somewhere else? I think that given a choice of being dead or carrying a bunch of relevant Kryptonian technology into the Phantom Zone and taking my chances, I'd choose the latter.  |
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 26, 2018 11:15:37 GMT
So they know the planet is about to be destroyed and the send the criminals somewhere else? Yes, they were plotting a coup. Would you have them stick around to finish it? Some people might think that justice should go out the window when the end is nigh, but on the contrary, so long as (a majority of) people believe in justice it will prevail even to the end of times. Your feelings of how righteous they are is not actually related to the content of the film. |
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dnno1
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 26, 2018 12:49:59 GMT
Yes, they were plotting a coup. Would you have them stick around to finish it? Some people might think that justice should go out the window when the end is nigh, but on the contrary, so long as (a majority of) people believe in justice it will prevail even to the end of times. Your feelings of how righteous they are is not actually related to the content of the film. Actually, it is. The. Kryptonians in Man of Steel, were so righteous and traditional that they opted to banish Zod and Co. to an eternity in the phantom zone rather than execute him or let him and his cohorts die in the conning events. Zod even mentions how foolish they were in doing that ("You won't kill us yourself! You wouldn't sully your hands! But you'll damn us to a black hole for eternity! Jor-El was right. You're a pack of fools, every last one of you.") remember that scene? It is apparent that Kryptonians were creatures of habit. The stuck to tradition more than to sporacity or innovation. I think you might want to watch the movie again to answer your question. |
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 26, 2018 13:37:49 GMT
Your feelings of how righteous they are is not actually related to the content of the film. Actually, it is. The. Kryptonians in Man of Steel, were so righteous and traditional that they opted to banish Zod and Co. to an eternity in the phantom zone rather than execute him or let him and his cohorts die in the conning events. Zod even mentions how foolish they were in doing that ("You won't kill us yourself! You wouldn't sully your hands! But you'll damn us to a black hole for eternity! Jor-El was right. You're a pack of fools, every last one of you.") remember that scene? It is apparent that Kryptonians were creatures of habit. The stuck to tradition more than to sporacity or innovation. I think you might want to watch the movie again to answer your question. You've switched from "justice to the end" to "creatures of habit". Those are not actually the same thing. Remember we're not talking about the mythology within the comics, we're talking about Zack Snyder's storytelling and script he used. |
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dnno1
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 26, 2018 13:56:10 GMT
Actually, it is. The. Kryptonians in Man of Steel, were so righteous and traditional that they opted to banish Zod and Co. to an eternity in the phantom zone rather than execute him or let him and his cohorts die in the conning events. Zod even mentions how foolish they were in doing that ("You won't kill us yourself! You wouldn't sully your hands! But you'll damn us to a black hole for eternity! Jor-El was right. You're a pack of fools, every last one of you.") remember that scene? It is apparent that Kryptonians were creatures of habit. The stuck to tradition more than to sporacity or innovation. I think you might want to watch the movie again to answer your question. You've switched from "justice to the end" to "creatures of habit". Those are not actually the same thing. Remember we're not talking about the mythology within the comics, we're talking about Zack Snyder's storytelling and script he used. The imprisoning of Zod's faction is the justice and instead of abandoning their tradition, they stuck to it. That is because enough of them believed in their practice. Creatures of habit tend to follow the same practice because they believe in it. Imprisoning criminals in the phantom zone is the Kryptonian form of justice and a habit. This tradition is well rooted in the comics and Zack Snyder not only honored that, but also made it more cohesive with Richard Donner's take on the same event. |
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 26, 2018 14:40:47 GMT
You've switched from "justice to the end" to "creatures of habit". Those are not actually the same thing. Remember we're not talking about the mythology within the comics, we're talking about Zack Snyder's storytelling and script he used. The imprisoning of Zod's faction is the justice and instead of abandoning their tradition, they stuck to it. That is because enough of them believed in their practice. Creatures of habit tend to follow the same practice because they believe in it. Imprisoning criminals in the phantom zone is the Kryptonian form of justice and a habit. This tradition is well rooted in the comics and Zack Snyder not only honored that, but also made it more cohesive with Richard Donner's take on the same event. This film is not a comic or a Richard Donner film. |
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Post by Tristan's Journal on Aug 26, 2018 17:42:10 GMT
The imprisoning of Zod's faction is the justice and instead of abandoning their tradition, they stuck to it. That is because enough of them believed in their practice. Creatures of habit tend to follow the same practice because they believe in it. Imprisoning criminals in the phantom zone is the Kryptonian form of justice and a habit. This tradition is well rooted in the comics and Zack Snyder not only honored that, but also made it more cohesive with Richard Donner's take on the same event. This film is not a comic or a Richard Donner film. and it does not have to be, just accept it: the Kryponians send their traitors to remote high security prisons like humans do, or the Klingons with Rura Pente, or the Britons to Botany Bay. Nobody questioned it besides you. It's a plot device to set up the drama. I suggest a new thread, Red: how did Snyder not explain how Supes can suddenly fly without any propulsion devises, can he bend gravity? Or how is it not explained why people not recognize Supes without glasses, where did he learn the Jedi mind trick?  |
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 26, 2018 18:55:23 GMT
This film is not a comic or a Richard Donner film. and it does not have to be, just accept it: the Kryponians send their traitors to remote high security prisons like humans do, or the Klingons with Rura Pente, or the Britons to Botany Bay. Nobody questioned it besides you. It's a plot device to set up the drama. I suggest a new thread, Red: how did Snyder not explain how Supes can suddenly fly without any propulsion devises, can he bend gravity? Or how is it not explained why people not recognize Supes without glasses, where did he learn the Jedi mind trick? Oh it's been questioned before, you're too busy accepting this rubbish instead of demanding better. It is sad that this miserable Michael Bay-wannabe film is seen as a high bar to DC fans, the plot of the film doesn't even justify itself. |
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dnno1
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 26, 2018 19:04:40 GMT
The imprisoning of Zod's faction is the justice and instead of abandoning their tradition, they stuck to it. That is because enough of them believed in their practice. Creatures of habit tend to follow the same practice because they believe in it. Imprisoning criminals in the phantom zone is the Kryptonian form of justice and a habit. This tradition is well rooted in the comics and Zack Snyder not only honored that, but also made it more cohesive with Richard Donner's take on the same event. This film is not a comic or a Richard Donner film. Nobody is saying that, but this is a story based on a comic book, just conveyed in a different medium. In the original (comic book) story Superman was rocketed to earth before his planet was destroyed. Both the Dinner and Snyder versions describe the same event with different interpretations. |
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Post by dnno1 on Aug 26, 2018 19:07:18 GMT
and it does not have to be, just accept it: the Kryponians send their traitors to remote high security prisons like humans do, or the Klingons with Rura Pente, or the Britons to Botany Bay. Nobody questioned it besides you. It's a plot device to set up the drama. I suggest a new thread, Red: how did Snyder not explain how Supes can suddenly fly without any propulsion devises, can he bend gravity? Or how is it not explained why people not recognize Supes without glasses, where did he learn the Jedi mind trick? Oh it's been questioned before, you're too busy accepting this rubbish instead of demanding better. It is sad that this miserable Michael Bay-wannabe film is seen as a high bar to DC fans, the plot of the film doesn't even justify itself. Its actually the best,Superman film ever made. |
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Post by RedDeadFallout on Aug 26, 2018 19:15:05 GMT
Oh it's been questioned before, you're too busy accepting this rubbish instead of demanding better. It is sad that this miserable Michael Bay-wannabe film is seen as a high bar to DC fans, the plot of the film doesn't even justify itself. Its actually the best,Superman film ever made. Well that just means the other ones are worse. |
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