|
|
Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 19, 2018 15:33:35 GMT
Dont people realize that they were basically smelly, toothless, dirty, homeless, scurvy ridden, criminals who would kill men, rape women, and throw children overboard, while stealing all their worldly possessions? What exactly is there to like about them?
And how did they become popular? Heroic even? Was it the old Errol Flynn black and white movies? We even sell the lie to children! Pirates were basically scumbags. How did this happen? |
|
|
|
Post by ant-mac on Sept 19, 2018 15:36:48 GMT
Are they?
I wasn't aware of the fact.
|
|
|
|
Post by koskiewicz on Sept 19, 2018 15:46:55 GMT
...prolly 'cause of dat "puffy shirt" Seinfeld wore...  |
|
|
|
Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 19, 2018 15:48:49 GMT
Are they? I wasn't aware of the fact. Pirates aren't a thing down under? They're pretty popular in the states. Errol Flynn movies. Pirates of the Caribbean. Kids dress up as pirates. There are "Pirates Days" on seaside communities. The Pirates sports team. yeah... |
|
|
|
Post by ant-mac on Sept 19, 2018 15:55:54 GMT
Are they? I wasn't aware of the fact. Pirates aren't a thing down under? They're pretty popular in the states. Errol Flynn movies. Pirates of the Caribbean. Kids dress up as pirates. There are "Pirates Days" on seaside communities. The Pirates sports team. yeah... As far as I'm aware, they're no more or less popular than astronauts, cowboys, Indians, cops, robbers and so on.
And I've never seen an Errol Flynn pirate film, or a PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN one...
|
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Sept 19, 2018 16:16:34 GMT
u r asking “why r criminals popular” basically. beats me and i really dislike the fact they are and that many movies fetishize criminality or present it as normal, desirable or sexy. we may not like or understand it but it is happening. Oceans8 is the latest example of that that annoyed me. the only pirate i really ever liked in media was... ARCHER  |
|
|
|
Post by Terrapin Station on Sept 19, 2018 16:18:52 GMT
Lots of good pirate fiction + the archetype of someone who has reached existential authenticity via being a "principled, adventurous rebel." (The principles being the pirate's own, or course.)
That pirates travel the seas helps as that taps into explorer/adventurer archetypes, plus there's an aesthetic attraction to the ships, clothing, etc. as presented in pirate fictions, as well as a "romantic" attraction to a stylized idea of recent past centuries--most traditional pirate fiction is set in the 19th century or earlier, sometimes a fantastical version of the 19th century or earlier.
|
|
|
|
Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 19, 2018 16:35:53 GMT
u r asking “why r criminals popular” basically. beats me and i really dislike the fact they are and that many movies fetishize criminality or present it as normal, desirable or sexy. we may not like or understand it but it is happening. Oceans8 is the latest example of that that annoyed me. the only pirate i really ever liked in media was... ARCHER Right, I get that. But we don't teach "kids how to be" or "all about" Bank Robbers, and Drug Dealers, and Pimps, and Tax Evaders. Whereas its somehow "cool" for a little kids to run around in a Pirate costume and a sword and an eye patch and go "Arrr, me mateys!" |
|
|
|
Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 19, 2018 16:38:46 GMT
Lots of good pirate fiction + the archetype of someone who has reached existential authenticity via being a "principled, adventurous rebel." (The principles being the pirate's own, or course.) That pirates travel the seas helps as that taps into explorer/adventurer archetypes, plus there's an aesthetic attraction to the ships, clothing, etc. as presented in pirate fictions, as well as a "romantic" attraction to a stylized idea of recent past centuries--most traditional pirate fiction is set in the 19th century or earlier, sometimes a fantastical version of the 19th century or earlier. All good points. The romance, the adventure, the high seas, etc. But aren't there other archetypes that fulfill those better than filthy criminals who terrorized the high seas? I just wonder why there was ever a need to "idolize and convert" the notion of the Pirate into a heroic one? |
|
|
|
Post by Nora on Sept 19, 2018 16:46:15 GMT
u r asking “why r criminals popular” basically. beats me and i really dislike the fact they are and that many movies fetishize criminality or present it as normal, desirable or sexy. we may not like or understand it but it is happening. Oceans8 is the latest example of that that annoyed me. the only pirate i really ever liked in media was... ARCHER Right, I get that. But we don't teach "kids how to be" or "all about" Bank Robbers, and Drug Dealers, and Pimps, and Tax Evaders. Whereas its somehow "cool" for a little kids to run around in a Pirate costume and a sword and an eye patch and go "Arrr, me mateys!" do we not? we let them play/adore criminals of all sorts. and :-) it literally says “this is for some 8year old girl sitting somewhere dreaming of being a criminal” in Oceans8. I see what you mean though. I think some of it is connected with the (wrong) idea its (pirating) not a thing anymore... |
|
|
|
Post by Terrapin Station on Sept 19, 2018 16:49:09 GMT
Lots of good pirate fiction + the archetype of someone who has reached existential authenticity via being a "principled, adventurous rebel." (The principles being the pirate's own, or course.) That pirates travel the seas helps as that taps into explorer/adventurer archetypes, plus there's an aesthetic attraction to the ships, clothing, etc. as presented in pirate fictions, as well as a "romantic" attraction to a stylized idea of recent past centuries--most traditional pirate fiction is set in the 19th century or earlier, sometimes a fantastical version of the 19th century or earlier. All good points. The romance, the adventure, the high seas, etc. But aren't there other archetypes that fulfill those better than filthy criminals who terrorized the high seas? I just wonder why there was ever a need to "idolize and convert" the notion of the Pirate into a heroic one? Well, it's not really a conspiracy, lol. A good question is how the author(s)--whoever they were, we're not sure--of 1724's A General History of the Pyrates to become interested in them, but that era was one of the golden ages of exploration, when there was a taste for anything adventurous and exotic. And then that book influenced a bunch of other early works, like Treasure Island and Peter Pan. |
|
|
|
Post by Terrapin Station on Sept 19, 2018 16:51:25 GMT
u r asking “why r criminals popular” basically. beats me and i really dislike the fact they are and that many movies fetishize criminality or present it as normal, desirable or sexy. we may not like or understand it but it is happening. Oceans8 is the latest example of that that annoyed me. the only pirate i really ever liked in media was... ARCHER Right, I get that. But we don't teach "kids how to be" or "all about" Bank Robbers, and Drug Dealers, and Pimps, and Tax Evaders. Whereas its somehow "cool" for a little kids to run around in a Pirate costume and a sword and an eye patch and go "Arrr, me mateys!" Kids are fascinated with all sorts of criminals. They play cops and robbers (or at least used to--maybe I'm showing my age), they like gangster films, like learning about Al Capone, etc. |
|
|
|
Post by Terrapin Station on Sept 19, 2018 16:59:20 GMT
Lots of kids (and adults, too) are also fascinated with monsters--vampires, werewolves, zombies, etc., and slasher villains--Michael Myers, Jason, Freddy, as well as more realistic monsters--dinosaurs, sharks, predatory cats, snakes, etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by Ass_E9 on Sept 19, 2018 17:03:11 GMT
Yarr guess is as good as mine. 
|
|
|
|
Post by BATouttaheck on Sept 19, 2018 17:26:52 GMT
Classical pirates are "just pretend" to a little kid.
'druther have the little kiddies playing as being criminals of a by gone time with the eye patch and parrot on the shoulder
than playing at (or being shown as entertainment) the more recent "heroes" of popular culture ~ dope dealers, pimps, drive by shooters and other villainous types.
|
|
|
|
Post by ant-mac on Sept 19, 2018 17:46:47 GMT
almost no parents consciously teaches their children anymore. that is, they are not consciously taught anything. they hear their parents say shit, they say shit. and what most of them DO learn, it is not positive. I have had to deal with toddler boys pinning down toddler girls to the floor and then 'mount them'. why? guess whose bumping uglies in his presence? no second grader should be told to not worry about doing well in school because you could just go on public assistance when you grow up. the best thing we can do is to say the truth about things but not be brutal with that truth depending on the age of the child. The first part of my adult life involved me trying to keep my sex life a secret from my parent or parents.
The second part involved me trying to keep it a secret from my child.
What's wrong with people?
|
|
|
|
Post by BATouttaheck on Sept 19, 2018 17:56:28 GMT
almost no parents consciously teaches their children anymore. that is, they are not consciously taught anything. they hear their parents say shit, they say shit. and what most of them DO learn, it is not positive. no second grader should be told to not worry about doing well in school because you could just go on public assistance when you grow up. ^^^^ has nothing to do with pirates but a LOT to say about the poster who really really needs to get a new job in a new neighborhood or find some one in real life who can help her deal with these terrible anger issues! as deem so often says : srsly ! |
|
|
|
Post by Primemovermithrax Pejorative on Sept 19, 2018 19:08:11 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by ant-mac on Sept 19, 2018 19:13:49 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by lenlenlen1 on Sept 19, 2018 19:32:16 GMT
Right, I get that. But we don't teach "kids how to be" or "all about" Bank Robbers, and Drug Dealers, and Pimps, and Tax Evaders. Whereas its somehow "cool" for a little kids to run around in a Pirate costume and a sword and an eye patch and go "Arrr, me mateys!" do we not? we let them play/adore criminals of all sorts. and :-) it literally says “this is for some 8year old girl sitting somewhere dreaming of being a criminal” in Oceans8.I see what you mean though. I think some of it is connected with the (wrong) idea its (pirating) not a thing anymore... Does it really say that? It sounds vaguely familiar. I must have forgotten that was in there.
I guess I just think of those movies as being for adults. The all ages crowd didn't go to that movie, whereas they would to Pirates of Caribbean.
And yes, there's the notion that Pirates are over, but actually that's not accurate. Its certainly different now, but Piracy still exists. "I'm de captain now".
|
|
