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Post by stargazer1682 on Sept 20, 2018 13:02:58 GMT
I've started re-watching the series on Hulu, and something occurred to me during Prophecy Girl - the prophecy about the "Anointed One" said that 'the Slayer would not know him; and he would lead her to the Master".
And yet, when she resigns herself to her fate, the Anointed One approaches her under the pretense of being a lost child, to which Buffy says, "I know who you are," then following him to the master.
It's probably not intentional, but it's interesting that right from the start she essentially defies the prophecy; and in so doing, lives. It's almost like Buffy's act of free will, knowing her purported destiny and embracing, rather than trying to defy it - which usually causes a prophecy to occur - invalidated destiny itself and allowed her to set her own course with unpredictable outcomes; and as such sets the tone for the rest of the series.
Which is also funny, when you compare this to Angel and his team, who get tossed around by fate and chewed up by one form of prophecy or another; even going so far as to consider themselves agents of "the powers that be," as if they have no choice in anything else they do.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2018 7:26:00 GMT
We have just started the first season of 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer' too stargazer for the first time a long, LONG time and are going to re-watch 'Teacher's Pet' tonight but I still remember a lot of things about the Anointed One and I always thought that was strange how they did that too and after he was killed off I thought it would have later turned out he wasn't the real Anointed One and another one would show up later in the show but I think the writers regretted doing the Anointed One storyline and chose to axe it 'cause it was strange how they spent all that time building the character up to have him killed off by Spike and then never get mentioned in the show again and I am glad they killed him off 'cause Spike and Dru turned out to be far better villains for that season and Angelus did later too and I think the only way the Anointed One would have worked without the Master is if they had found a way to age him. 
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Post by stargazer1682 on Sept 22, 2018 15:54:55 GMT
Yeah, if memory serves, I recall reading that the writers may have realized "The Anointed One" was meant to be the second season's big bad, as the immediate successor to the Master, but that they quickly found that he wasn't as compelling a villain as they originally intended; plus the fact that they had unwittingly put themselves into creating a character that, by his own nature was unsustainable. He was a child turned into a vampire, and therefore was not supposed to age, but by casting an actual child, obviously was going to show signs of aging and growing; and in fact had grown between seasons 1 and 2; which is why he spends so much of season 2 sitting, to hide this fact.
The recognition of their failure in this character seems to be acknowledged in Spike referring to him as "the annoying one," which I want to say may have been something fans had begun referring to him as in the early days of the internet discussion forums.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 24, 2018 13:29:50 GMT
Spike killing the Annointed One is a pivotal moment for Buffy. It's really where the show says, "Out with the old (classic vampire monsters like the Master) and in with the new (rock star vampires like Spike)."
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Post by mmexis on Sept 26, 2018 1:41:52 GMT
Just a thought, but maybe we need to factor in Buffy's "spidey-sense". Could the anointed one really be unknown to her. She knows preternaturally when there is a demon near by. Love that scene in the bronze where she tells Giles the vampire is the one dressed like LeBarge. I think the anointed one could say what he wanted, but she would know him.
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Post by stargazer1682 on Sept 26, 2018 3:27:20 GMT
But the prophecy specifically said, "the Slayer will not know him". Prophesies, by their very nature, take all variables into account, because from the perspective of the person report a prophesy those events already happened and everything from Buffy's power set to the color of her shoes were something determined before the prophet saw the events play out. Arguably, as such, a prophesy should be immutable, without some external force that was decidedly not part of the original prophesy. Even knowing about a prophesy shouldn't change the outcome; and conventionally, at least in mythology, knowledge of a certain fate usually leads to a prophesy coming true. The best example of this being Oedipus.
As for Buffy's power set, she didn't know Angel was a vampire until her cross compelled a response; and she spent loads of time and even kissed him without being wiser. She didn't know Ted wasn't human, she didn't know Oz was the werewolf. An extension of this, Kendra didn't know Buffy wasn't a vampire.
When they lost their memories, Buffy had no sense that Spike wasn't human.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 26, 2018 13:12:03 GMT
To be fair, Buffy thought the big guy was the Annointed, not the kid. In that sense, she didn't know him.
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Post by stargazer1682 on Sept 26, 2018 13:55:30 GMT
She knew him when it counted, which is when he lead her to the Master.
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 26, 2018 14:10:16 GMT
True enough, but not knowing him to begin with is what allowed him to rise in the first place.
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Post by stargazer1682 on Sept 26, 2018 15:48:29 GMT
Yeah, but the prophesy was never really about him rising, so much as him leading her to the Master, where the Master would rise and the Slayer would die.
Technically the Master rose for maybe an hour, and technically the Slayer died; and that's arguably enough, on the surface of it, to get around the prophesy. It technically came true, but without the implied consequences. I just think it's interesting that strictly speaking Buffy managed to break a specific part of the prophesy by not only knowing who the Anointed One was at a critical point she was said she would not know him, but even goes so far as saying, "I know who you are". So there's play there, where it could be said that she defied her destiny by making a conscious determination that wasn't meant to be; and consequently altering everything about her, the Slayer line and the way the world was preordained to be.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2018 6:37:26 GMT
Yeah, if memory serves, I recall reading that the writers may have realized "The Anointed One" was meant to be the second season's big bad, as the immediate successor to the Master, but that they quickly found that he wasn't as compelling a villain as they originally intended; plus the fact that they had unwittingly put themselves into creating a character that, by his own nature was unsustainable. He was a child turned into a vampire, and therefore was not supposed to age, but by casting an actual child, obviously was going to show signs of aging and growing; and in fact had grown between seasons 1 and 2; which is why he spends so much of season 2 sitting, to hide this fact. The recognition of their failure in this character seems to be acknowledged in Spike referring to him as "the annoying one," which I want to say may have been something fans had begun referring to him as in the early days of the internet discussion forums.
Here's what annoys me the most. Why did Angel not face The Master? When Buffy didn't want to face the Master 'cause she was afraid she would die why didn't Angel say he would face the Master instead or go with her to help her defeat him? I mean it looked silly that they had Giles saying he was going to fight the Master to prevent Buffy from dying meanwhile Angel is in his apartment and Xander had to go to him for help and then he is telling Xander he can't defeat the Master 'cause he is just a kid when Angel should have been able to do it himself. I never got that 'cause Angel goes on to defeat bigger villains than the Master in his own show yet he wasn't even willing to face the Master. I know they didn't want to take away from Buffy as the slayer but shouldn't she had been telling Angel she would go instead of Giles? 
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Post by PreachCaleb on Sept 27, 2018 13:21:58 GMT
Simple: Angel is not a hero at this point.
I also don't doubt Angel when he tells Buffy in The Harvest: "Because I'm afraid."
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Post by mmexis on Sept 27, 2018 18:24:54 GMT
And wasn't the Master Angel's sire? (through Darla?)
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