|
|
Post by moviemouth on Sept 27, 2018 5:37:51 GMT
There is also the matter of picking up on how words are said by other people when you are learning to speak. When you eventually learn how a word is actually spelled, you are so use to saying it the wrong way that you just don't care to change how you say it. And let's not pretend that all words are meant to be pronounced how they are spelled. You also don't seem to be taking accents into account. Accents often change the sound of words from how they are spelled. Adding and subtracting r from the ends of words for example. I am pretty sure that Mondee rather than Monday has to do with accents as well. No, it has to do with ignorance, lazy mouth and a lack of appreciation for how one speaks tells others about them. I already said that it has PARTLY to do with lazy mouth and sure, lack of appreciation for how one speaks. Luckily I don't care what some user on IMDB2 thinks about me. I say Carmel and I am proud to admit it. Then again, I don't have appreciation for much of anything or anyone. |
|
|
|
Post by deembastille on Sept 27, 2018 9:21:26 GMT
Knowuh (basically they just say Noah for know) Nouh. (no) Probably been listening to The Fall too much. No that's how people feoy lungilund speak Aw tawk. |
|
|
|
Post by deembastille on Sept 27, 2018 9:28:13 GMT
I do but if you are in merry ole England, pronounce the t. In New York City, it holds no such allegiance. Excuse me, but exactly where in "merry ole England" would that be correct? In a scene in The Pirates of Penzance (I hope you'll agree that Gilbert & Sullivan would be considered about as "merry ole English" as you can get), a whole passage of dialogue is based on the similarity, in upper-class English pronunciation--AKA "Received Pronunciation"--of the two words, "orphan" and "often". The "t" in the latter word is sounded only when it becomes necessary to distinguish between those two words. If the "t" were commonly pronounced in "often", the entire scene would make absolutely no sense. In other words, yes--while there are parts of Britain where the word in question is pronounced "of-ten", the more common pronunciation is "off-en". CAVEAT: the last time I visited the UK was back in 1983, so it's possible that things have changed in that area of speech since then. If so, then I will cede the point to you, Deembastille.  Another example: listen to any professional recording of My Fair Lady (in which the cast members are British). In the well-known song "On* the Street Where You Live", the first line reads, "I have often walked down this street before..." does the character sing "of-ten"? No. He sings "off-en". And I just now checked the movie version on You Tube. Definitely "off-en". (Why yes, I am an exceptionally nit-picky person...how could you tell?  ) *Most Brits would probably say "IN the Street", but that's a separate issue.  Why are you referencing non-real operas and musical plays as your proof? |
|
|
|
Post by Fox in the Snow on Sept 27, 2018 10:35:18 GMT
Probably been listening to The Fall too much. No that's how people feoy lungilund speak Aw tawk. Yes, I'm sure there are more common reasons for adding -ahs to the end of your words/sentences than over exposure to Mark E. Smith. The FallSmith's vocal delivery was known for his tendency to end each phrase terminating in a consonant with an added schwa vocalisation ("ah").[44] He often speak-sang or sing-slurred his lyrics, especially from the mid-1990s. His delivery, particularly when playing live, could be described as "rambling", and he often interjected improvised rants.
|
|
|
|
Post by deembastille on Sept 27, 2018 10:54:17 GMT
No that's how people feoy lungilund speak Aw tawk. Yes, I'm sure there are more common reasons for adding -ahs to the end of your words/sentences than over exposure to Mark E. Smith. The FallSmith's vocal delivery was known for his tendency to end each phrase terminating in a consonant with an added schwa vocalisation ("ah").[44] He often speak-sang or sing-slurred his lyrics, especially from the mid-1990s. His delivery, particularly when playing live, could be described as "rambling", and he often interjected improvised rants.
Never heard of The Fall. It all depends on what or who you are surrounded by at home. Both of my parents grew up in Brooklyn. Neither of them speak like Joe Pesci. I grew up in long island until 1984 or so. You can't tell. I do change my voice to make a book character come to life. |
|
|
|
Post by Fox in the Snow on Sept 27, 2018 11:18:55 GMT
Yes, I'm sure there are more common reasons for adding -ahs to the end of your words/sentences than over exposure to Mark E. Smith. The FallSmith's vocal delivery was known for his tendency to end each phrase terminating in a consonant with an added schwa vocalisation ("ah").[44] He often speak-sang or sing-slurred his lyrics, especially from the mid-1990s. His delivery, particularly when playing live, could be described as "rambling", and he often interjected improvised rants.
Never heard of The Fall. It all depends on what or who you are surrounded by at home. Both of my parents grew up in Brooklyn. Neither of them speak like Joe Pesci. I grew up in long island until 1984 or so. You can't tell. I do change my voice to make a book character come to life. They're a bit of an acquired taste, possibly their most accessible song, if you're interested: |
|
|
|
Post by telegonus on Sept 27, 2018 15:31:29 GMT
movieliker After Often Listen Fasten Their spellings give no clue whether the "t" is silent. It's simply a fact that English spellings and pronunciations can be quite arbitrary, and are learned pretty much by rote. This was brilliantly illustrated in a 1952 I Love Lucy episode in which Ricky reads a children's book aloud and gets frustrated by the different pronunciations of "bough, rough, through and cough." Take "bough," for instance. The same pronunciation can be spelled as "bow" (the kind you take), but the same spelling can be pronounced "boe" (the kind you tie). Consider as another example the varying "ow" sounds in "how, know and knowledge." Anyone learning English as a second language has my sympathy, and anyone mastering it my admiration. Well...it looks like you finally made that one mature post which looks like the final say on the matter. It seems like the vice-chancellor himself decided to put the matter to rest. I am pretty sure at least now this issue should end. Excellent post BTW, doghouse. Then there's crow.
Also, pour, sour, dour.
Learning how to pronounce a word such as weight would be of no use when it comes to the word height.
It never ends!
|
|
|
|
Post by rachelcarson1953 on Sept 27, 2018 16:10:57 GMT
movieliker After Often Listen Fasten Their spellings give no clue whether the "t" is silent. It's simply a fact that English spellings and pronunciations can be quite arbitrary, and are learned pretty much by rote. This was brilliantly illustrated in a 1952 I Love Lucy episode in which Ricky reads a children's book aloud and gets frustrated by the different pronunciations of "bough, rough, through and cough." Take "bough," for instance. The same pronunciation can be spelled as "bow" (the kind you take), but the same spelling can be pronounced "boe" (the kind you tie). Consider as another example the varying "ow" sounds in "how, know and knowledge." Anyone learning English as a second language has my sympathy, and anyone mastering it my admiration. Well...it looks like you finally made that one mature post which looks like the final say on the matter. It seems like the vice-chancellor himself decided to put the matter to rest. I am pretty sure at least now this issue should end. Excellent post BTW, doghouse. Three pages later, and over 24 hours later... it still goes on... sigh...  |
|
|
|
Post by BATouttaheck on Sept 27, 2018 17:57:53 GMT
[ rachelcarson1953 But as with many a thread, the topic has morphed and expanded to cover more than the OPs obsession with eating Car-a-mel in Car-Mel, CA I suppose … whether this is a good thing or a bad thing is a matter of perspective  |
|
|
|
Post by movieliker on Sept 27, 2018 18:47:20 GMT
[ rachelcarson1953 But as with many a thread, the topic has morphed and expanded to cover more than the OPs obsession with eating Car-a-mel in Car-Mel, CA I suppose … whether this is a good thing or a bad thing is a matter of perspective The title of this thread is "Pronunciations that drive me crazy". Not "The OPs obsession with pronouncing caramel as carmel". |
|
|
|
Post by rachelcarson1953 on Sept 27, 2018 20:39:10 GMT
[ rachelcarson1953 But as with many a thread, the topic has morphed and expanded to cover more than the OPs obsession with eating Car-a-mel in Car-Mel, CA I suppose … whether this is a good thing or a bad thing is a matter of perspective The title of this thread is "Pronunciations that drives me crazy". Not "The OPs obsession with pronouncing caramel as carmel". Uh-huh... "Pronunciations that drives me crazy"... short trip. But, by my count, worth posting about 42 times by you. Now, how many of my fellow posters would have the dedication (and OCD) to verify that? Only an retired proofreader would care enough.  Right, BATouttaheck? |
|
|
|
Post by movieliker on Sept 27, 2018 20:40:40 GMT
The title of this thread is "Pronunciations that drive me crazy". Not "The OPs obsession with pronouncing caramel as carmel". Uh-huh... "Pronunciations that drives me crazy"... short trip. But, by my count, worth posting about 42 times by you. Now, how many of my fellow posters would have the dedication (and OCD) to verify that? Only an retired proofreader would care enough. Right, BATouttaheck? All of my posts (except the first one) were replies to other posters. |
|
|
|
Post by rachelcarson1953 on Sept 27, 2018 20:49:30 GMT
Uh-huh... "Pronunciations that drives me crazy"... short trip. But, by my count, worth posting about 42 times by you. Now, how many of my fellow posters would have the dedication (and OCD) to verify that? Only an retired proofreader would care enough. Right, BATouttaheck ? All of my posts (except the first one) were replies to other posters. 43 |
|
|
|
Post by movieliker on Sept 27, 2018 20:53:24 GMT
All of my posts (except the first one) were replies to other posters. 43 To me that shows the obsession of others to disagree with my opinion. Not the strength of my objection to mispronouncing the word caramel. |
|
|
|
Post by rachelcarson1953 on Sept 27, 2018 21:20:03 GMT
To me that shows the obsession of others to disagree with my opinion. Not the strength of my objection to mispronouncing the word caramel. 44 |
|
|
|
Post by deembastille on Sept 27, 2018 21:24:28 GMT
I think the caramel carmel thing is upsetting because the carmel people [when they mean the sweet cooked sugar treat you dunk apples in] are saying it that way to SOUND smarter.
Its like the people who say ahuntie but also say how ridakilus the libary called the ambalance. they say ahuntie to sound smarter but their fate is sealed with ridakilus libary and ambalance.
|
|
|
|
Post by telegonus on Sept 27, 2018 21:44:21 GMT
Then there are words that almost nobody mispronounces even as one might expect they would: chocolate and expectorate, for example. I never heard the second sound so as to rhyme with the first,--but who knows?--maybe Ogden Nash did, just once. As to allocate, don't let's go there.  |
|
|
|
Post by BATouttaheck on Sept 27, 2018 21:51:03 GMT
I think the caramel carmel thing is upsetting because the carmel people [when they mean the sweet cooked sugar treat you dunk apples in] are saying it that way to SOUND smarter.
Its like the people who say ahuntie but also say how ridakilus the libary called the ambalance. they say ahuntie to sound smarter but their fate is sealed with ridakilus libary and ambalance. Utter nonsense ^^^^^^ even coming from deem !
MOST people talk the way they talk with no thought as to whether they sound "smart" or not. Showing your bigotry and skewed world view again, deembastille , by the very words you object to so so vigorously and so very often . (The bolded words are ALL regional or cultural variations.) You also objected to LawgIslanders … really do need to relocate or maybe just calm down !
Some people object to others who look down on people because of their pronunciation and rant and rant about in poorly constructed, curse filled diatribes. It's a slippery slope. |
|
|
|
Post by movieliker on Sept 27, 2018 21:56:12 GMT
I think the caramel carmel thing is upsetting because the carmel people [when they mean the sweet cooked sugar treat you dunk apples in] are saying it that way to SOUND smarter.
Its like the people who say ahuntie but also say how ridakilus the libary called the ambalance. they say ahuntie to sound smarter but their fate is sealed with ridakilus libary and ambalance. Utter nonsense ^^^^^^ even coming from deem !
MOST people talk the way they talk with no thought as to whether they sound "smart" or not. Showing your bigotry and skewed world view again, deembastille , by the very words you object to so so vigorously and so very often . (The bolded words are ALL regional or cultural variations.) You also objected to LawgIslanders … really do need to relocate or maybe just calm down !
Some people object to others who look down on people because of their pronunciation and rant and rant about in poorly constructed, curse filled diatribes. It's a slippery slope. Most professionals put a great deal of importance on the way they speak. It is shameful if most people don't think about how they sound when they speak. I am an employer. I don't hire people who don't speak well. And I don't respect those who speak poorly. |
|
|
|
Post by BATouttaheck on Sept 27, 2018 22:01:16 GMT
The title of this thread is "Pronunciations that drive me crazy". Was not the whole point of the thread to stimulate a discussion about words ? OR Was it intended only to vent to the world about YOUR caramels in Carmel problem ? Was everyone supposed to read your post and move on thinking … "Boy is that guy ever WRONG ! Too bad there's no way to help the poor soul out ! Someone should invent a way to communicate information to the ill informed." |
|
Right, 