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Post by charzhino on Mar 18, 2019 10:14:35 GMT
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 18, 2019 10:31:27 GMT
Well I wouldn't call that a problem... I would call that "people who have nothing else to complain, looking for problems."
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Post by politicidal on Mar 18, 2019 15:21:31 GMT
Well I wouldn't call that a problem... I would call that "people who have nothing else to complain, looking for problems." So...the internet?
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Mar 18, 2019 15:34:38 GMT
Well, at least this sort of nonsense hasn't spread to my beloved Star Wars franch -- -- oh, right. Welp...
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Post by Skaathar on Mar 18, 2019 15:36:20 GMT
I don't consider this a "problem". It's definitely a pattern, and sure it would be refreshing if they broke away from it, but that doesn't mean it's a problem.
Edit: Actually, Nick Fury's assistant is Maria Hill. So that already broke the pattern.
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Post by charzhino on Mar 18, 2019 16:06:49 GMT
I don't consider this a "problem". It's definitely a pattern, and sure it would be refreshing if they broke away from it, but that doesn't mean it's a problem. Edit: Actually, Nick Fury's assistant is Maria Hill. So that already broke the pattern. Fury is a support character in every movie
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Post by bud47 on Mar 18, 2019 16:14:36 GMT
As it says, Black Panther broke the trend and they even included a white sidekick. So, not sure where you're getting that the MCU hasn't "fixed this problem". Shang-Chi will further change things up. Most of the previous MCU films were adapting the primary superheroes in their available stable that just happen to also be white in the comics. Falcon and War Machine have always been, for the most part, sidekicks and they chose to use black Nick Fury when they could have just as easily used a white actor for the role. If they hadn't made some of the supporting cast multiracial (contributing to this so-called problem), then they would have been accused of racism by hiring an all-white cast. So how do they win in this sutation without changing up the races for characters like Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, etc.? Wouldn't you rather see these characters portrayed somewhat faithfully on film at least once before they start race-swapping just for the sake of diversity?
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Post by charzhino on Mar 18, 2019 16:25:54 GMT
If they hadn't made some of the supporting cast multiracial (contributing to this so-called problem), then they would have been accused of racism by hiring an all-white cast. So how do they win in this sutation without changing up the races for characters like Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, etc.? Wouldn't you rather see these characters portrayed somewhat faithfully on film at least once before they start race-swapping just for the sake of diversity? I dont fundamentally agree with what the author is saying but it was a bit of an eye opener when they were listing all the ethnic minority support characters. And black panther was an entire black so the predominant support characters were black anyway. It is an overused trope in blockbusters and surprising MCU has not really subverted it yet
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Post by bud47 on Mar 18, 2019 16:40:25 GMT
If they hadn't made some of the supporting cast multiracial (contributing to this so-called problem), then they would have been accused of racism by hiring an all-white cast. So how do they win in this sutation without changing up the races for characters like Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, etc.? Wouldn't you rather see these characters portrayed somewhat faithfully on film at least once before they start race-swapping just for the sake of diversity? I dont fundamentally agree with what the author is saying but it was a bit of an eye opener when they were listing all the ethnic minority support characters. And black panther was an entire black so the predominant support characters were black anyway. It is an overused trope in blockbusters and surprising MCU has not really subverted it yet Everett Ross was a sidekick (at least during the final battle) in Black Panther.
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Post by Skaathar on Mar 18, 2019 16:46:23 GMT
I don't consider this a "problem". It's definitely a pattern, and sure it would be refreshing if they broke away from it, but that doesn't mean it's a problem. Edit: Actually, Nick Fury's assistant is Maria Hill. So that already broke the pattern. Fury is a support character in every movie Yes, but he's not a dedicated support character for a specific white person the same way Falcon or Warmachine or Wong or Ned is, as I believe was the point of the OP. Nick Fury's dedicated support character is Maria Hill, who is a white person assisting a black person.
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Post by scabab on Mar 18, 2019 18:40:52 GMT
Not sure why that's a problem. Captain America is white his sidekick Falcon is black. Iron Man is white, his sidekick War Machine is black.
They're mostly white characters in the comics, if they didn't have a black sidekick then they wouldn't really be having much of anyone.
Blade is black and he has a white sidekick. Black Panther is black and you had...what's his name? The guy from The Hobbit? He was white.
Characters like Heimdall and Valkyrie weren't even black in the comic, they did that for the movie to make it more diverse and now they're complaining about it but they'd be complaining more if there were no black people in the movie.
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Post by charzhino on Mar 18, 2019 18:57:40 GMT
Not sure why that's a problem. Captain America is white his sidekick Falcon is black. Iron Man is white, his sidekick War Machine is black. They're mostly white characters in the comics, if they didn't have a black sidekick then they wouldn't really be having much of anyone. Blade is black and he has a white sidekick. Black Panther is black and you had...what's his name? The guy from The Hobbit? He was white. Characters like Heimdall and Valkyrie weren't even black in the comic, they did that for the movie to make it more diverse and now they're complaining about it but they'd be complaining more if there were no black people in the movie. What the author is implying is that MCU doesn't have the courage to either race swap some leads like DC has done with Aquaman, Fox did with Catwoman and Human Torch or go with coloured lead alternatives like Miles Morales instead of parker.
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Post by Skaathar on Mar 18, 2019 19:01:22 GMT
Not sure why that's a problem. Captain America is white his sidekick Falcon is black. Iron Man is white, his sidekick War Machine is black. They're mostly white characters in the comics, if they didn't have a black sidekick then they wouldn't really be having much of anyone. Blade is black and he has a white sidekick. Black Panther is black and you had...what's his name? The guy from The Hobbit? He was white. Characters like Heimdall and Valkyrie weren't even black in the comic, they did that for the movie to make it more diverse and now they're complaining about it but they'd be complaining more if there were no black people in the movie. What the author is implying is that MCU doesn't have the courage to either race swap some leads like DC has done with Aquaman, Fox did with Catwoman and Human Torch or go with coloured lead alternatives like Miles Morales instead of parker. Courage? The MCU deciding to keep their leading character races consistent with their comic counterparts have got nothing to do with courage or the lack thereof.
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Post by hi224 on Mar 18, 2019 19:03:16 GMT
or they could, ya know, hire the best actor available?.
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Post by scabab on Mar 18, 2019 19:21:28 GMT
What the author is implying is that MCU doesn't have the courage to either race swap some leads like DC has done with Aquaman, Fox did with Catwoman and Human Torch or go with coloured lead alternatives like Miles Morales instead of parker. Theres nothing courageous about changing a pre-established characters race. Why should Doctor Strange or Captain Marvel be black when they've always been white? Catwoman at least was played by a black woman in the 60's TV series and a comic series. The movie bombed. Human Torch received a ton of backlash and changed his history with Sue Storm no longer being brother and sister. That movie also bombed. Aquaman doesn't really even count. The man is half white and half Hawaiian, he isn't exactly black or asian himself. Black Panther is a lead no? He's black. They've race swapped plenty of characters. Isn't Mary Jane in the Spider-Man movies now black? Nick Fury is black. Baron Mordo is black. People lose their shit when a non white character is made white but now people are complaining that not enough white characters are made non white?
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Post by charzhino on Mar 18, 2019 19:30:25 GMT
People lose their shit when a non white character is made white but now people are complaining that not enough white characters are made non white? PC thugs for you. And aquaman does count, hes white as white with blonde hair but portrayed by a Samoan with brown hair. Id say thats a pretty big difference
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Post by ThatGuy on Mar 18, 2019 19:40:05 GMT
What the author is implying is that MCU doesn't have the courage to either race swap some leads like DC has done with Aquaman, Fox did with Catwoman and Human Torch or go with coloured lead alternatives like Miles Morales instead of parker. Theres nothing courageous about changing a pre-established characters race. Why should Doctor Strange or Captain Marvel be black when they've always been white? Catwoman at least was played by a black woman in the 60's TV series and a comic series. The movie bombed. Human Torch received a ton of backlash and changed his history with Sue Storm no longer being brother and sister. That movie also bombed. Aquaman doesn't really even count. The man is half white and half Hawaiian, he isn't exactly black or asian himself. Black Panther is a lead no? He's black. They've race swapped plenty of characters. Isn't Mary Jane in the Spider-Man movies now black? Nick Fury is black. Baron Mordo is black. People lose their shit when a non white character is made white but now people are complaining that not enough white characters are made non white? You mean Carol Danvers and not Captain Marvel, right? Monica Rambeau (black female Captain Marvel in the comics) was in the movie.
Also, Human Torch wasn't the lead in the movie.
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Post by ThatGuy on Mar 18, 2019 19:41:32 GMT
People lose their shit when a non white character is made white but now people are complaining that not enough white characters are made non white? PC thugs for you. And aquaman does count, hes white as white with blonde hair but portrayed by a Samoan with brown hair. Id say thats a pretty big difference With blonde highlights. That's not his natural hair color so they changed that for the movie.
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Post by bud47 on Mar 18, 2019 19:45:00 GMT
Not sure why that's a problem. Captain America is white his sidekick Falcon is black. Iron Man is white, his sidekick War Machine is black. They're mostly white characters in the comics, if they didn't have a black sidekick then they wouldn't really be having much of anyone. Blade is black and he has a white sidekick. Black Panther is black and you had...what's his name? The guy from The Hobbit? He was white. Characters like Heimdall and Valkyrie weren't even black in the comic, they did that for the movie to make it more diverse and now they're complaining about it but they'd be complaining more if there were no black people in the movie. What the author is implying is that MCU doesn't have the courage to either race swap some leads like DC has done with Aquaman, Fox did with Catwoman and Human Torch or go with coloured lead alternatives like Miles Morales instead of parker. I'm glad the MCU had the courage to remain faithful to the source material when it comes to the races of it's lead characters instead of pandering. Feige understands that as fans, we deserve that, at least for their first go-around with these characters. If they want to change things up, race-swap or go with alternate versions of characters with reboots or spin-offs later, I'm fine with that. We can still say we had Iron Man, Thor, Captain America, etc. depicted on screen with great success as they were originally intended at least once.
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Post by DC-Fan on Mar 18, 2019 20:13:21 GMT
Not sure why that's a problem. Captain America is white his sidekick Falcon is black. Iron Man is white, his sidekick War Machine is black. They're mostly white characters in the comics, if they didn't have a black sidekick then they wouldn't really be having much of anyone. Blade is black and he has a white sidekick. Black Panther is black and you had...what's his name? The guy from The Hobbit? He was white. Characters like Heimdall and Valkyrie weren't even black in the comic, they did that for the movie to make it more diverse and now they're complaining about it but they'd be complaining more if there were no black people in the movie. The complaint is that in almost all of their movies, the lead character is a white male (the kind that Brie Larson hates) with a non-white as a sidekick/subordinate.
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