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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Mar 26, 2019 9:47:33 GMT
White Walkers are to the Night King what dragons are to Daenerys, something they control and somehow take possession of. The Night King and Daenerys are tools of something else, of ice and fire, of freezing order and ebullient chaos (yes, it's just a common fantasy trope), gradually losing themselves to these things. The Night King was turned long ago and has completed submission. Daenerys turned in the pyre at the end of S1 and remains mostly herself but loses ground each time she uses her "power" (another trope). As the series goes on, she becomes less and less willing to listen to advice. She wants to "be a dragon". The whole story culminates in the violent opposition of these two extremes and ought to resolve in mankind pushing both aside and finding a middle ground. Cersei is right and Sansa will be queen. The whole saga is a depiction of the downsides of power, misused for a variety of reasons, with good or bad intentions. It must end in a situation in which inflated powers have come down crashing to something more modest and manageable. |
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Post by DSDSquared on Mar 26, 2019 11:53:16 GMT
White Walkers are to the Night King what dragons are to Daenerys, something they control and somehow take possession of. The Night King and Daenerys are tools of something else, of ice and fire, of freezing order and ebullient chaos (yes, it's just a common fantasy trope), gradually losing themselves to these things. The Night King was turned long ago and has completed submission. Daenerys turned in the pyre at the end of S1 and remains mostly herself but loses ground each time she uses her "power" (another trope). As the series goes on, she becomes less and less willing to listen to advice. She wants to "be a dragon". The whole story culminates in the violent opposition of these two extremes and ought to resolve in mankind pushing both aside and finding a middle ground. Cersei is right and Sansa will be queen. The whole saga is a depiction of the downsides of power, misused for a variety of reasons, with good or bad intentions. It must end in a situation in which inflated powers have come down crashing to something more modest and manageable. Cersei falls into the same tropes though. She wants absolute power and does not care what happens to the realm. How is she any better than Dany? If anything, she is more ruthless and less understanding. She seriously does not care about anyone or anything but herself.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Mar 26, 2019 13:11:52 GMT
White Walkers are to the Night King what dragons are to Daenerys, something they control and somehow take possession of. The Night King and Daenerys are tools of something else, of ice and fire, of freezing order and ebullient chaos (yes, it's just a common fantasy trope), gradually losing themselves to these things. The Night King was turned long ago and has completed submission. Daenerys turned in the pyre at the end of S1 and remains mostly herself but loses ground each time she uses her "power" (another trope). As the series goes on, she becomes less and less willing to listen to advice. She wants to "be a dragon". The whole story culminates in the violent opposition of these two extremes and ought to resolve in mankind pushing both aside and finding a middle ground. Cersei is right and Sansa will be queen. The whole saga is a depiction of the downsides of power, misused for a variety of reasons, with good or bad intentions. It must end in a situation in which inflated powers have come down crashing to something more modest and manageable. Cersei falls into the same tropes though. She wants absolute power and does not care what happens to the realm. How is she any better than Dany? If anything, she is more ruthless and less understanding. She seriously does not care about anyone or anything but herself. Cersei acts in defence. Idiots of your kind don't see a difference and I wish we could get them all flushed.
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Post by DSDSquared on Mar 26, 2019 13:26:43 GMT
Cersei falls into the same tropes though. She wants absolute power and does not care what happens to the realm. How is she any better than Dany? If anything, she is more ruthless and less understanding. She seriously does not care about anyone or anything but herself. Cersei acts in defence. Idiots of your kind don't see a difference and I wish we could get them all flushed. In defense? You live in an delusion. Cersei ahs created 99% of her problems herself. She is conniving and selfish. She never gives any concern to the good of the realm. She only cares about herself. She killed Robert. She arm the Faith Militant and gave the High Sparrow power. She has burned every bridge she has ever had and would burn the entire world to the ground if she could rule over its ashes. Yes, I know that line is reserved for Littlefinger, but it applies to her as well. She can act very childish too like she does with Jamie when he finally returns from captivity or the way she treats the Tyrells. Cersei is not a good person in the slightest. I love the character. The Lannisters are by far my favorite characters, but I know who they are. You do not. You live in a fantasy world where womehow Cersei is just.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 14, 2019 17:46:41 GMT
Cersei acts in defence. Idiots of your kind don't see a difference and I wish we could get them all flushed. In defense? You live in an delusion. Cersei ahs created 99% of her problems herself. She is conniving and selfish. She never gives any concern to the good of the realm. She only cares about herself. She killed Robert. She arm the Faith Militant and gave the High Sparrow power. She has burned every bridge she has ever had and would burn the entire world to the ground if she could rule over its ashes. Yes, I know that line is reserved for Littlefinger, but it applies to her as well. She can act very childish too like she does with Jamie when he finally returns from captivity or the way she treats the Tyrells. Cersei is not a good person in the slightest. I love the character. The Lannisters are by far my favorite characters, but I know who they are. You do not. You live in a fantasy world where womehow Cersei is just. Great post. That's exactly how I see it, and most of the viewers who are not delusional. |
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 14, 2019 18:15:27 GMT
In defense? You live in an delusion. Cersei ahs created 99% of her problems herself. She is conniving and selfish. She never gives any concern to the good of the realm. She only cares about herself. She killed Robert. She arm the Faith Militant and gave the High Sparrow power. She has burned every bridge she has ever had and would burn the entire world to the ground if she could rule over its ashes. Yes, I know that line is reserved for Littlefinger, but it applies to her as well. She can act very childish too like she does with Jamie when he finally returns from captivity or the way she treats the Tyrells. Cersei is not a good person in the slightest. I love the character. The Lannisters are by far my favorite characters, but I know who they are. You do not. You live in a fantasy world where womehow Cersei is just. Great post. That's exactly how I see it One situation that I recall where Cersei seemed nice was when she consoled Lady Catelyn over Bran's accident.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 14, 2019 18:55:02 GMT
Great post. That's exactly how I see it One situation that I recall where Cersei seemed nice was when she consoled Lady Catelyn over Bran's accident. Lol |
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 14, 2019 19:09:22 GMT
Great post. That's exactly how I see it One situation that I recall where Cersei seemed nice was when she consoled Lady Catelyn over Bran's accident. Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 14, 2019 19:29:27 GMT
One situation that I recall where Cersei seemed nice was when she consoled Lady Catelyn over Bran's accident. Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
And especially when we all knew at the time that she absolutely did not want Bran to be returned to Kat. And found out later that she learned at a young age that praying gets you nowhere. Such a two-faced bitch. |
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Post by Marendil on Apr 14, 2019 19:59:37 GMT
Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
And especially when we all knew at the time that she absolutely did not want Bran to be returned to Kat. And found out later that she learned at a young age that praying gets you nowhere. Such a two-faced bitch. In the books she murdered the child rather than let anything of Robert's live, so show Cersei is somewhat better than book Cersei.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 14, 2019 20:38:29 GMT
And especially when we all knew at the time that she absolutely did not want Bran to be returned to Kat. And found out later that she learned at a young age that praying gets you nowhere. Such a two-faced bitch. In the books she murdered the child rather than let anything of Robert's live, so show Cersei is somewhat better than book Cersei. Oh, of course. Book Cersei has done a dozen heinous things that aren't in the show. Even still, show Cersei has racked up a lot of "debt" with her poor decisions and a lot of "debt" with how she avoided the consequences of her poor decisions. I expect that "debt" to come due this season, and a Lannister always... |
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 14, 2019 20:59:25 GMT
In the books she murdered the child rather than let anything of Robert's live, so show Cersei is somewhat better than book Cersei. Oh, of course. Book Cersei has done a dozen heinous things that aren't in the show. Even still, show Cersei has racked up a lot of "debt" with her poor decisions and a lot of "debt" with how she avoided the consequences of her poor decisions. I expect that "debt" to come due this season, and a Lannister always... Ironic that you mention that now, they're currently playing the scene where Euron is asking for Cersei's hand...which she will later promise...
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 14, 2019 22:17:29 GMT
One situation that I recall where Cersei seemed nice was when she consoled Lady Catelyn over Bran's accident. Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
We had a good discussion on this topic on this board. IMO, Cersei is not a very good speaker like Margaery but her intent was to console Catelyn. She had no choice when it came to revealing what had happened. A revelation about her affair with Jaime and the king would have killed her & Jaime and if he suspected the kids then them too. Initially, it was Jaime's decision to throw Bran. It's not that I am sure that Cersei was being good but I am just giving her doubt regarding her meeting with Cat.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 14, 2019 23:13:55 GMT
Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
We had a good discussion on this topic on this board. IMO, Cersei is not a very good speaker like Margaery but her intent was to console Catelyn. She had no choice when it came to revealing what had happened. A revelation about her affair with Jaime and the king would have killed her & Jaime and if he suspected the kids then them too. Initially, it was Jaime's decision to throw Bran. It's not that I am sure that Cersei was being good but I am just giving her doubt regarding her meeting with Cat. Though, in truth, the fact that Cat never knew there was a black-haired beauty (the king had a Male heir and the lady of Winterfell, married to the Warden of the North, didn't know???) combined with the Frog's prophecy indicate Cercei (surprise!) lied. There was no black haired beauty, and Cersei was merely trying to dissuade Cat from keeping him alive ("it's no mercy letting a child linger in such pain") by telling her the story of how hard *she* fought and prayed to keep her "fighter" alive. "I pray to the mother every morning and night that she will return your child to you" Lie "Perhaps this time she'll listen." Lie, hoping to break Cat's hope. |
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 15, 2019 0:49:20 GMT
We had a good discussion on this topic on this board. IMO, Cersei is not a very good speaker like Margaery but her intent was to console Catelyn. She had no choice when it came to revealing what had happened. A revelation about her affair with Jaime and the king would have killed her & Jaime and if he suspected the kids then them too. Initially, it was Jaime's decision to throw Bran. It's not that I am sure that Cersei was being good but I am just giving her doubt regarding her meeting with Cat. Though, in truth, the fact that Cat never knew there was a black-haired beauty (the king had a Male heir and the lady of Winterfell, married to the Warden of the North, didn't know???) combined with the Frog's prophecy indicate Cercei (surprise!) lied. There was no black haired beauty, and Cersei was merely trying to dissuade Cat from keeping him alive ("it's no mercy letting a child linger in such pain") by telling her the story of how hard *she* fought and prayed to keep her "fighter" alive. "I pray to the mother every morning and night that she will return your child to you" Lie "Perhaps this time she'll listen." Lie, hoping to break Cat's hope. Oh, the book wanker refuses to accept that characters are changed in the show and clings to his misplaced perception. He also fails to understand the role of prophecy in the books. Go flush yourself, idiot.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 15, 2019 0:55:25 GMT
Yes, wasn't that nice of her to tell that heart-breaking story of how all her praying was for naught and the poor baby died to the grieving mother of a comatose child?
Especially when she knew full well why Bran was in a coma!
We had a good discussion on this topic on this board. IMO, Cersei is not a very good speaker like Margaery but her intent was to console Catelyn. She had no choice when it came to revealing what had happened. A revelation about her affair with Jaime and the king would have killed her & Jaime and if he suspected the kids then them too. Initially, it was Jaime's decision to throw Bran. It's not that I am sure that Cersei was being good but I am just giving her doubt regarding her meeting with Cat. That scene was there to expose the duality of the character, the inner conflict which powers the drama in about every one of them. GRRM has said it, the show has translated it to Cersei. She cannot be what she wants, she feels for Catelyn but cannot afford telling anything that would not help anyway. In the next episode, she will scold Jaime for what he did, apparently confirming both the feeling she expressed to Catelyn and distress at what would happen if Bran speaks. She is torn by the situation. The scene was also there to prepare the following one with Robert in which we learn Cersei wanted to bear his children and be a loving wife. No point debating with prejudiced dumbfucks about it, though.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 15, 2019 1:01:11 GMT
Though, in truth, the fact that Cat never knew there was a black-haired beauty (the king had a Male heir and the lady of Winterfell, married to the Warden of the North, didn't know???) combined with the Frog's prophecy indicate Cercei (surprise!) lied. There was no black haired beauty, and Cersei was merely trying to dissuade Cat from keeping him alive ("it's no mercy letting a child linger in such pain") by telling her the story of how hard *she* fought and prayed to keep her "fighter" alive. "I pray to the mother every morning and night that she will return your child to you" Lie "Perhaps this time she'll listen." Lie, hoping to break Cat's hope. Oh, the book wanker refuses to accept that characters are changed in the show and clings to his misplaced perception. He also fails to understand the role of prophecy in the books. Go flush yourself, idiot. Ok |
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 15, 2019 2:59:44 GMT
Though, in truth, the fact that Cat never knew there was a black-haired beauty (the king had a Male heir and the lady of Winterfell, married to the Warden of the North, didn't know???) combined with the Frog's prophecy indicate Cercei (surprise!) lied. There was no black haired beauty, and Cersei was merely trying to dissuade Cat from keeping him alive ("it's no mercy letting a child linger in such pain") by telling her the story of how hard *she* fought and prayed to keep her "fighter" alive. "I pray to the mother every morning and night that she will return your child to you" Lie "Perhaps this time she'll listen." Lie, hoping to break Cat's hope. Oh, the book wanker refuses to accept that characters are changed in the show and clings to his misplaced perception. He also fails to understand the role of prophecy in the books. Go flush yourself, idiot. Now that I've watched the episode twice, I can get back to this little ditty. 1) ad hominem fallacy. You attacked me and not my point. You, predictably, will roar back that I have no point. Cat not knowing a Male heir was born is a fooking fantastic point. You are very wise not to try to debate it. 2) I've never read the books, so your ad hominem fallacy doubles as a straw-man. 3) You say the show and books are seperate, but then you chastise me for not knowing the role of the prophecy in the books. So congratulations, your post is idiotic in 3 different ways. |
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 15, 2019 4:55:59 GMT
Oh, the book wanker refuses to accept that characters are changed in the show and clings to his misplaced perception. He also fails to understand the role of prophecy in the books. Go flush yourself, idiot. Now that I've watched the episode twice, I can get back to this little ditty. 1) ad hominem fallacy. You attacked me and not my point. You, predictably, will roar back that I have no point. Cat not knowing a Male heir was born is a fooking fantastic point. You are very wise not to try to debate it. I'm done discussing with idiots. I only tell them to fuck off. Do not expect me to argue anything with you. Nothing you say is worth it.
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Post by hehatesshe on Apr 15, 2019 4:57:54 GMT
Now that I've watched the episode twice, I can get back to this little ditty. 1) ad hominem fallacy. You attacked me and not my point. You, predictably, will roar back that I have no point. Cat not knowing a Male heir was born is a fooking fantastic point. You are very wise not to try to debate it. I'm done discussing with idiots. I only tell them to fuck off. Do not expect me to argue anything with you. Nothing you say is worth it. Most feel the same about your pompous act. |
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