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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 13:37:24 GMT
She can solve a lot of problems by just marrying him, she doesn't need to kill him. i dont think you get it , dany does NOT want to share any power that would mean she would have to step aside not be queen and jon king it would mean jon ruling the way he wants to which is NOT danys way (bend the knee or burn) she wants the iron chair more than she wants jon if she truly loves him like she claimed to sansa she would step aside and let him rule But she cannot do that in a "progressive" show trying to shove feminist themes down its viewer's throats at every turn. She would no longer be the strong woman winning over the "patriarchy" and "conventions". So no, it won't happen, she'll die instead so her fans can still believe in her as some sort of hero.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Apr 22, 2019 13:39:58 GMT
[/div][/quote] But she is his cousin. I think that's still considered weird in this universe, no? I have noticed Sansa seems almost jealous of Dany, although this episode kind of played it off as political. But everything in this and the previous episode seems to be pointing to Dany and Jon not working out either way. Anyone think she might turn on him in the upcoming battle? She definitely wasn't happy about him having a claim, and seemed to check down everyone that knows. Good opportunity to eliminate them, then it's Battle of the Mad Queens. [/quote] She would definitely be a mad queen if, after Jon surviving a long battle, she were to kill him for no other reason than he is a male Targaryen. I don't see it happening. But I'm just "an idiot turd who should have been flushed a long time ago." If/when it doesn't happen next week, the Mad Dany theories take a big hit. [/quote] It really doesnt matter if sansa is his cousin like other posters pointed out in the thread cousins marry all the time is more accepted in their times NEDS STARKS parents were COUSINS also jon/sansa NEVER shared a real close sibling relationship growing up jon was just there in their family this is why sansa apologized to jon when they reunited i know i said this a thousand times and some of you dont get it or want to believe it but jon loves sansa in a romantic way his behavior from S6 has been off around her the way he looked and talked to her is more like a girlfriend and not a sister he almost choked LF to death when he told him he loves sansa , and he couldnt even answer sansas questions if he loved dany , and you know what? i think davos knows it and this is why he is really pushing a marriage between dany/jon ,if dany senses any of that if i were jon or sansa i would be really scared ,the mad dany theory has been in places for many seasons shes a full blown targaryen odds are against her, define mad to me? some of the things dany has done are already mad , people are quick to judge cersei for blowing up the septa but yet find every excuse in the book to excuse dany burning people alive .
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Apr 22, 2019 13:41:31 GMT
People had doubts about gendry ( arya/gendry) but it happened as i always knew it would Let me guess, early seasons kept hinting at a potential future romance between them and it ended as an escapist fuck before they go facing death, right? not only that, its given gendry will die ,maybe arya will be the future baratheon baby jonerys fans really wanted gendry with sansa so she wouldnt be a thread to dany/jon LOL
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 13:44:32 GMT
the mad dany theory has been in places for many seasons shes a full blown targaryen odds are against her, define mad to me? some of the things dany has done are already mad , people are quick to judge cersei for blowing up the septa but yet find every excuse in the book to excuse dany burning people alive . People who call Cersei mad for saving her life the only way she could are just complete idiots or the worst shit ever. Daenerys is not mad, she hasn't lost control of her acts, feelings or perceptions. That would be "mad" in my understanding. She is a tyrannical egomaniac, yes. That's different.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Apr 22, 2019 13:48:34 GMT
i dont think you get it , dany does NOT want to share any power that would mean she would have to step aside not be queen and jon king it would mean jon ruling the way he wants to which is NOT danys way (bend the knee or burn) she wants the iron chair more than she wants jon if she truly loves him like she claimed to sansa she would step aside and let him rule But she cannot do that in a "progressive" show trying to shove feminist themes down its viewer's throats at every turn. She would no longer be the strong woman winning over the "patriarchy" and "conventions". So no, it won't happen, she'll die instead so her fans can still believe in her as some sort of hero. i just hate it how meak and powerless they make men seem especially this season so unrealistic especially for those times , can they make jon anymore dense i mean i love him but why in the world did he tell her who he is before an important battle? that was not a smart move , if dany dies question is how ? if its north of the wall it should happen in episode 3 while fighting the NK thats only way she can die a hero , any other way of her dying ties in with the mad theory and goes after jon and everyone else who may side with him another hint for me at last night episode that jorah will be the one to kill dany was when sam gave him the heartsbane sword hope i typed that right i always said to myself if jorah gets the sword thats the sword he will end dany with , but before she dies in her madness she may do a lot of bad things or even kill jon it was foreshadowed S7 when dany asked him about taking the knife for his people and its already proven jon has given up the north to protect his people he may do it against dany this time to protect the starks most likely sansa, jorah wont have any choice but to end dany who he knew as a child and loved to this day .
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 13:59:42 GMT
But she cannot do that in a "progressive" show trying to shove feminist themes down its viewer's throats at every turn. She would no longer be the strong woman winning over the "patriarchy" and "conventions". So no, it won't happen, she'll die instead so her fans can still believe in her as some sort of hero. i just hate it how meak and powerless they make men seem especially this season so unrealistic especially for those times , can they make jon anymore dense i mean i love him but why in the world did he tell her who he is before an important battle? They shall all be shamed and led by little Lyanna Mormont. This really started in S6 and never stopped. The thing has turned into a caricature.
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 22, 2019 14:36:25 GMT
She can solve a lot of problems by just marrying him, she doesn't need to kill him. i dont think you get it , dany does NOT want to share any power that would mean she would have to step aside not be queen and jon king it would mean jon ruling the way he wants to which is NOT danys way (bend the knee or burn) she wants the iron chair more than she wants jon if she truly loves him like she claimed to sansa she would step aside and let him rule and if they marry as you say it still wouldnt work out , dany knows westeros wont ever accept a female queen over a king he has the male claim those were not modern times plus they would love jon more than her , she has always been power hungry she really believes she is entitled to rule and her reaction to jon news was anything but friendly . Jon actually has to make a claim, (Dany included this exposition in her shocked denial) he's going to need bigtime backing--i.e. more than Sam and Bran--especially when the circumstances are this bizarre. He has no army capable of defeating Cersei or for that matter defending the North against the Golden Company, the Unsullied and Dothraki are loyal to Dany personally. He could, like Aemon Targaryen, simply let it pass to the next in line or in this case just shut up about it and marry her, making their child the heir--presuming the Lamb Witch was wrong/lying.
It was Dany's reaction which was most important, contrast it to Sansa who actually became Lady of Winterfell as Ramsey's wife (but as Lady Bolton and essentially powerless with Roose Bolton as Warden of the North and Ramsey as regnant--the one with the real power--Lord of Winterfell) and suffered mightily to attain that position, but offered it to Jon after the Battle of the Bastards ('I'm not a Stark'--'you are to me') and to Bran pretty much the moment he returned, because in her mind they outranked her and the proper thing to do was offer the title to them. Both, like Aemon Targaryen, declined, thus Sansa retained the title and power. Dany on the other hand was immediately worried about the possibility Jon might make a claim, when Jon did nothing of the sort and just told her a nice love story where her brother was actually not a rapist.
I think this will be divisive and perhaps Dany will love to regret her reaction, not because Jon wants her throne but because she immediately saw him as a threat to it implying she loved that more than him--and kinda proved Sam right.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Apr 22, 2019 14:49:20 GMT
i dont think you get it , dany does NOT want to share any power that would mean she would have to step aside not be queen and jon king it would mean jon ruling the way he wants to which is NOT danys way (bend the knee or burn) she wants the iron chair more than she wants jon if she truly loves him like she claimed to sansa she would step aside and let him rule and if they marry as you say it still wouldnt work out , dany knows westeros wont ever accept a female queen over a king he has the male claim those were not modern times plus they would love jon more than her , she has always been power hungry she really believes she is entitled to rule and her reaction to jon news was anything but friendly . Jon actually has to make a claim, (Dany included this exposition in her shocked denial) he's going to need bigtime backing--i.e. more than Sam and Bran--especially when the circumstances are this bizarre. He has no army capable of defeating Cersei or for that matter defending the North against the Golden Company, the Unsullied and Dothraki are loyal to Dany personally. He could, like Aemon Targaryen, simply let it pass to the next in line or in this case just shut up about it and marry her, making their child the heir--presuming the Lamb Witch was wrong/lying.
It was Dany's reaction which was most important, contrast it to Sansa who actually became Lady of Winterfell as Ramsey's wife (but as Lady Bolton and essentially powerless with Roose Bolton as Warden of the North and Ramsey as regnant--the one with the real power--Lord of Winterfell) and suffered mightily to attain that position, but offered it to Jon after the Battle of the Bastards ('I'm not a Stark'--'you are to me') and to Bran pretty much the moment he returned, because in her mind they outranked her and the proper thing to do was offer the title to them. Both, like Aemon Targaryen, declined, thus Sansa retained the title and power. Dany on the other hand was immediately worried about the possibility Jon might make a claim, when Jon did nothing of the sort and just told her a nice love story where her brother was actually not a rapist.
I think this will be divisive and perhaps Dany will love to regret her reaction, not because Jon wants her throne but because she immediately saw him as a threat to it implying she loved that more than him--and kinda proved Sam right.
dany can be her worst enemy her reactions are always impulsive if it wasn't for jorah who always seem to calm her down SOMETIMES and advice her what to do things would have been worse , jon went to her i guess first to clear the air i still think it was a dumb move , she should have given jon the benefit of the doubt but she got all defensive ,no one knows this story except 4 people now jon,sam,bran and dany i think maybe jon told her to test her and she failed .
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 22, 2019 15:18:49 GMT
Jon actually has to make a claim, (Dany included this exposition in her shocked denial) he's going to need bigtime backing--i.e. more than Sam and Bran--especially when the circumstances are this bizarre. He has no army capable of defeating Cersei or for that matter defending the North against the Golden Company, the Unsullied and Dothraki are loyal to Dany personally. He could, like Aemon Targaryen, simply let it pass to the next in line or in this case just shut up about it and marry her, making their child the heir--presuming the Lamb Witch was wrong/lying.
It was Dany's reaction which was most important, contrast it to Sansa who actually became Lady of Winterfell as Ramsey's wife (but as Lady Bolton and essentially powerless with Roose Bolton as Warden of the North and Ramsey as regnant--the one with the real power--Lord of Winterfell) and suffered mightily to attain that position, but offered it to Jon after the Battle of the Bastards ('I'm not a Stark'--'you are to me') and to Bran pretty much the moment he returned, because in her mind they outranked her and the proper thing to do was offer the title to them. Both, like Aemon Targaryen, declined, thus Sansa retained the title and power. Dany on the other hand was immediately worried about the possibility Jon might make a claim, when Jon did nothing of the sort and just told her a nice love story where her brother was actually not a rapist.
I think this will be divisive and perhaps Dany will love to regret her reaction, not because Jon wants her throne but because she immediately saw him as a threat to it implying she loved that more than him--and kinda proved Sam right.
dany can be her worst enemy her reactions are always impulsive if it wasn't for jorah who always seem to calm her down SOMETIMES and advice her what to do things would have been worse , jon went to her i guess first to clear the air i still think it was a dumb move , she should have given jon the benefit of the doubt but she got all defensive ,no one knows this story except 4 people now jon,sam,bran and dany i think maybe jon told her to test her and she failed . I think ultimately the real difference between Daenerys and Sansa is Sansa grew up under Ned Stark and Caitlyn Stark with duty, honor and preparedness as primary virtues in their family ('Family, Duty, Honor' & 'Winter is Coming') and Dany had Viserys and forlorn hopes of bringing vengeance ('Fire and Blood') to the ones who destroyed their family.
I think Jon told her because he couldn't keep brushing her off and avoiding her and couldn't keep withholding the truth from the woman who gave up her life's ambition and one of her dragons to save him and his people. I don't think he was impressed with her response.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Apr 22, 2019 15:28:43 GMT
dany can be her worst enemy her reactions are always impulsive if it wasn't for jorah who always seem to calm her down SOMETIMES and advice her what to do things would have been worse , jon went to her i guess first to clear the air i still think it was a dumb move , she should have given jon the benefit of the doubt but she got all defensive ,no one knows this story except 4 people now jon,sam,bran and dany i think maybe jon told her to test her and she failed . I think ultimately the real difference between Daenerys and Sansa is Sansa grew up under Ned Stark and Caitlyn Stark with duty, honor and preparedness as primary virtues in their family ('Family, Duty, Honor' & 'Winter is Coming') and Dany had Viserys and forlorn hopes of bringing vengeance ('Fire and Blood') to the ones who destroyed their family.
I think Jon told her because he couldn't keep brushing her off and avoiding her and couldn't keep withholding the truth from the woman who gave up her life's ambition and one of her dragons to save him and his people. I don't think he was impressed with her response.
i agree with you dany never really had a real family or knows what it is to be part of one , her brother sold her to the drothraki and before that she thought she was going to marry him , so dany doesnt understand how when a son stands by his father to die together ( tarlys) means or when she threatens sansa to jon i mean does she actually believe jon can make sansa respect her and punish her for not doing so , this is why dany is a very tragic figure in this story whether you like her or not.
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 22, 2019 15:54:14 GMT
I think ultimately the real difference between Daenerys and Sansa is Sansa grew up under Ned Stark and Caitlyn Stark with duty, honor and preparedness as primary virtues in their family ('Family, Duty, Honor' & 'Winter is Coming') and Dany had Viserys and forlorn hopes of bringing vengeance ('Fire and Blood') to the ones who destroyed their family.
I think Jon told her because he couldn't keep brushing her off and avoiding her and couldn't keep withholding the truth from the woman who gave up her life's ambition and one of her dragons to save him and his people. I don't think he was impressed with her response.
i agree with you dany never really had a real family or knows what it is to be part of one , her brother sold her to the drothraki and before that she thought she was going to marry him , so dany doesnt understand how when a son stands by his father to die together ( tarlys) means or when she threatens sansa to jon i mean does she actually believe jon can make sansa respect her and punish her for not doing so , this is why dany is a very tragic figure in this story whether you like her or not. I don't think she's nearly as awful as you pretend, but I do suspect her story ends tragically--as does Jon's. I think both killing the masters in Meereen and feeding some to dragons were far worse injustices than what happened to the Tarlys, even though the former weren't really characters and I kinda liked the Tarlys. However I very much liked the Meereen storyline and Randyl Tarly because of the realism they brought to the saga. Once upon a time this wasn't a comic book movie story--which I also like but enjoy more serious fare as well.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 15:56:16 GMT
I think ultimately the real difference between Daenerys and Sansa is Sansa grew up under Ned Stark and Caitlyn Stark with duty, honor and preparedness as primary virtues in their family Sansa was anything but prepared by her family. Cersei rightly remarked on it in S2. The Starks were a complete failure.
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 22, 2019 16:02:33 GMT
People had doubts about gendry ( arya/gendry) but it happened as i always knew it would Let me guess, early seasons kept hinting at a potential future romance between them and it ended as an escapist fuck before they go facing death, right? It's awesome to fuck someone you desire to fuck than someone you don't. Moonboy....and now Euron.
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 22, 2019 16:02:51 GMT
I think ultimately the real difference between Daenerys and Sansa is Sansa grew up under Ned Stark and Caitlyn Stark with duty, honor and preparedness as primary virtues in their family Sansa was anything but prepared by her family. Cersei rightly remarked on it in S2. The Starks were a complete failure. She knew how to prepare for winter though, that sort of long-term thinking is what I was getting at. On a personal level she knew how to sit tight and wait out the storm, rather than do something rash.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 16:03:34 GMT
Let me guess, early seasons kept hinting at a potential future romance between them and it ended as an escapist fuck before they go facing death, right? It's awesome to fuck someone you desire to fuck than someone you don't. Moonboy....and now Euron. Yes, it seems fucking is all there is to some.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Apr 22, 2019 16:04:33 GMT
Sansa was anything but prepared by her family. Cersei rightly remarked on it in S2. The Starks were a complete failure. She knew how to prepare for winter though, that sort of long-term thinking is what I was getting at. On a personal level she knew how to sit tight and wait out the storm, rather than do something rash. I don't think she learned this from her stupid parents. Arya didn't.
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 22, 2019 16:07:17 GMT
It's awesome to fuck someone you desire to fuck than someone you don't. Moonboy....and now Euron. Yes, it seems fucking is all there is to some. Sure it is to someone.
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 22, 2019 16:09:41 GMT
Is there any chance of Jonsa happening?
Hey jon snow loves sansa , I do believe there is some minute chance of Jonsa in case Dany dies. What are your current feelings? My question is for everyone.
I believe if Dany dies then Jon has no obligation not to marry Sansa because she ain't his sister. And it will also soon be known that he is the true king.
Nice to know you think so AJ because no matter if my jonsa theory is endgame as king/queen or not there will be some type of union between jon and sansa a declaration of feelings and its only a matter of time , were not even halfway there if anything episode 2 confirmed to me the show is going with a succession fight and if not a fight definitely a struggle between powers with houses taking sides , and jons disappointing look on his face how dany reacted when he told her who he really is was very telling i also find interesting both jon/dany brought up or talked about their relationship to Sansa is all falling into place slowly. People had doubts about gendry ( arya/gendry) but it happened as i always knew it would Just to clarify I only see it as a possibility if Dany dies. It's something that I am indifferent about. It wouldn't bother me nor I am very eager to see it happen. Although I am fine with Dany's death. But the fact is that I also want Jon to die.
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Post by Aj_June on Apr 22, 2019 16:17:33 GMT
i dont think you get it , dany does NOT want to share any power that would mean she would have to step aside not be queen and jon king it would mean jon ruling the way he wants to which is NOT danys way (bend the knee or burn) she wants the iron chair more than she wants jon if she truly loves him like she claimed to sansa she would step aside and let him rule and if they marry as you say it still wouldnt work out , dany knows westeros wont ever accept a female queen over a king he has the male claim those were not modern times plus they would love jon more than her , she has always been power hungry she really believes she is entitled to rule and her reaction to jon news was anything but friendly . Jon actually has to make a claim, (Dany included this exposition in her shocked denial) he's going to need bigtime backing--i.e. more than Sam and Bran--especially when the circumstances are this bizarre. He has no army capable of defeating Cersei or for that matter defending the North against the Golden Company, the Unsullied and Dothraki are loyal to Dany personally. He could, like Aemon Targaryen, simply let it pass to the next in line or in this case just shut up about it and marry her, making their child the heir--presuming the Lamb Witch was wrong/lying.
It was Dany's reaction which was most important, contrast it to Sansa who actually became Lady of Winterfell as Ramsey's wife (but as Lady Bolton and essentially powerless with Roose Bolton as Warden of the North and Ramsey as regnant--the one with the real power--Lord of Winterfell) and suffered mightily to attain that position, but offered it to Jon after the Battle of the Bastards ('I'm not a Stark'--'you are to me') and to Bran pretty much the moment he returned, because in her mind they outranked her and the proper thing to do was offer the title to them. Both, like Aemon Targaryen, declined, thus Sansa retained the title and power. Dany on the other hand was immediately worried about the possibility Jon might make a claim, when Jon did nothing of the sort and just told her a nice love story where her brother was actually not a rapist.
I think this will be divisive and perhaps Dany will love to regret her reaction, not because Jon wants her throne but because she immediately saw him as a threat to it implying she loved that more than him--and kinda proved Sam right.
I didn't read too much into Dany's reaction to Jon's revelations. To me the shock of hearing that you have a relative or a person from your bloodline after years of believing you were the only one from a great family is stressful and shocking enough. I wouldn't judge her from her initial reaction. She is a kind of person who needs a bit of respect and admiration from others. But she is kind as well, which of course you know very well as you aptly point out to her own sacrifices for Jon. In the long run she would be fine with the fact that Jon is a legit heir of Targaryen dynasty. The only thing is that I believe she will die so it won't likely matter. Just a thought - the show is full of surprises.
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Marendil
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Post by Marendil on Apr 22, 2019 16:28:45 GMT
Jon actually has to make a claim, (Dany included this exposition in her shocked denial) he's going to need bigtime backing--i.e. more than Sam and Bran--especially when the circumstances are this bizarre. He has no army capable of defeating Cersei or for that matter defending the North against the Golden Company, the Unsullied and Dothraki are loyal to Dany personally. He could, like Aemon Targaryen, simply let it pass to the next in line or in this case just shut up about it and marry her, making their child the heir--presuming the Lamb Witch was wrong/lying.
It was Dany's reaction which was most important, contrast it to Sansa who actually became Lady of Winterfell as Ramsey's wife (but as Lady Bolton and essentially powerless with Roose Bolton as Warden of the North and Ramsey as regnant--the one with the real power--Lord of Winterfell) and suffered mightily to attain that position, but offered it to Jon after the Battle of the Bastards ('I'm not a Stark'--'you are to me') and to Bran pretty much the moment he returned, because in her mind they outranked her and the proper thing to do was offer the title to them. Both, like Aemon Targaryen, declined, thus Sansa retained the title and power. Dany on the other hand was immediately worried about the possibility Jon might make a claim, when Jon did nothing of the sort and just told her a nice love story where her brother was actually not a rapist.
I think this will be divisive and perhaps Dany will love to regret her reaction, not because Jon wants her throne but because she immediately saw him as a threat to it implying she loved that more than him--and kinda proved Sam right.
I didn't read too much into Dany's reaction to Jon's revelations. To me the shock of hearing that you have a relative or a person from your bloodline after years of believing you were the only one from a great family is stressful and shocking enough. I wouldn't judge her from her initial reaction. She is a kind of person who needs a bit of respect and admiration from others. But she is kind as well, which of course you know very well as you aptly point out to her own sacrifices for Jon. In the long run she would be fine with the fact that Jon is a legit heir of Targaryen dynasty. The only thing is that I believe she will die so it won't likely matter. Just a thought - the show is full of surprises. I agree, but do suspect Jon's expression meant something too. She snaps, but she usually mellows. This time she might not get the chance until one or both are on their deathbed--kinda like Thorin Oakenshield (from "The Hobbit") or Robert Baratheon regarding her assassination in this story.
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