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Post by Rodney Farber on Apr 25, 2019 16:28:13 GMT
Well people pretty much send themselves there by their actions as God does not want to 'send' anyone to hell Himself (He actually wants people to be in Heaven with Him but since we all have free will we can either choose to cooperate with His grace and reject sin and live a decent life etc or reject His grace and prefer sin etc), but those who persist in their sin and fail to repent before dying, basically rejected God, and He simply confirms their choice. so since God is goodness itself, once you reject Him, all good ceases to exist for and in that person who ends up in hell. p.s. but apparently some people reject the truth that humanity has a fallen nature after the fall of Adam/Eve and not everything we see as good is actually good. we must resist stuff that's sinful even if it appears appealing to us etc. one could basically say that life here on earth is a test to see whether we will ultimately choose good over evil. but once someone rejects that basic truth it's just going to be that much easier for them to potentially fall into hell because then they won't really be concerned with rejecting sinful actions and will just assume they will probably make it to Heaven unless they commit murder but it does not automatically work this way as one does not need to be a murderer to end up in hell. So, a person who truly repents on their death bed goes to Heaven, even if they violated all ten commandments during their lifetime? Is that why priests give last rights to those headed to the electric chair? This is logical gobbledygook.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Apr 30, 2019 23:27:25 GMT
At the end of the day, God belief, or no God belief, it is all action and universal consequence. It does not matter what the belief is. It is how we contribute and act towards ourselves and treat others. Earth is the realm of suffering and hell or heaven will be created by ones own actions. It is neither a life or afterlife thing, consequence is what it is.
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Post by rizdek on May 1, 2019 8:35:40 GMT
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Post by Zos on May 1, 2019 8:59:29 GMT
Colin.
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Post by The Lost One on May 1, 2019 10:01:57 GMT
From the Calvinist perspective, no one sends herself or himself to Hell. They were already destined to Hell before they were born. Their time on Earth is just a temporary respite before their eternal damnation. Regardless of when they were committed to hell ... Who made the decision to send them to Hell and also had the power to enforce that decision? Is it the kind a benevolent Yahweh to whom you pray? And since Jehovah is omnipotent, why would she create someone that she has predestined to burn for all eternity? This is logical gobbledygook. The Calvinist idea is that due to the inherent sinfulness of mankind, no-one deserves salvation. God in his grace handpicks a select few to be saved. Those who are not chosen are therefore unlucky perhaps, but not unfairly treated since they deserved nothing more. Those who are saved are given more than they deserve however so even if God saves hardly any, he is still giving some more than they deserve whilst not giving anyone worse than they deserve therefore God is still good. Like much of Calvinist thought, it's got a cold and harsh logic to it. One of the major problems of Hell is how ill-defined it is. There are a number of theories within Christianity: 1. Hell is eternal torment 2. Hell is annihilation 3. Hell is temporary torment followed by annihilation 4. Hell is temporary torment followed by salvation 5. Hell is simply being without God (which to the religious person would feel like eternal torment if it were to happen to them) 6. Hell is living your life in a sinful manner rather than an afterlife per se The unfairness of Hell obviously varies a lot depending on which option you pick. Annihilation for instance is no different from what would be the case if no afterlife existed. Being without God could be argued not to be a punishment if it's what the person wants anyway and seeing it as punishment would only be true for those who don't experience it. The same could be said of the view of Hell as a sinful life. While I wouldn't say options 2, 5 and 6 completely solve the Problem of Hell they are definitely better answers. Options 3 and 4 are harder to reconcile with a Good God and Option 1 is very difficult indeed. It's crazy to think Calvin thought the inherent sinfulness of mankind doomed people to eternal suffering with no ability to change that, relying completely on God choosing them at random.
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