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Post by jon snow loves sansa on May 28, 2019 21:01:54 GMT
Dany chose to burn innocent children because she didnt feel the "love" on that side of westeros , she was jealous because they loved jon more than her , she wanted to punish the innocent in KL because they didnt love her or kiss her feet she didnt receive the treatment she was used to in other places she conquered , she was not welcomed and that stupid ilario guy who gave her the dragon eggs filled viserys head and her head full of lies , they never had support back in KL unless you consider tryion and varys who in the end turn on her "support" no one wanted her for their queen and only person who called her his queen killed her . Dany in books is just as arrogant as she is on the show . It does not make any sense, nor does Cersie being able to rule after blowing up the holiest church in the 7 kingdoms. Realistically, the small folk would be rioting every day and with only 3,200 Gold Cloaks/Lannister soldiers, she would never be able to stay in power. Dany would easily be welcomed into KL. And no, Dany is not arrogant in either. with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it .
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 28, 2019 21:34:20 GMT
It does not make any sense, nor does Cersie being able to rule after blowing up the holiest church in the 7 kingdoms. Realistically, the small folk would be rioting every day and with only 3,200 Gold Cloaks/Lannister soldiers, she would never be able to stay in power. Dany would easily be welcomed into KL. And no, Dany is not arrogant in either. with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it . "with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents" She killed lot's of innocents, and you forget, she was guilty. "blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it" And to the small people, he is cleaning up mass corruption, behavior that threatens the kingdom (yes, a Queen cheating is a threat to national security in a country run on inherited positions) , and many of them are fanatics because their faith is the only thing they have, and Cersie just blew up the most holy building in the land. "unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it ." Unless you believe the change made no logical sense, which many fans, and critics have pointed out.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on May 28, 2019 21:43:06 GMT
with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it . "with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents" She killed lot's of innocents, and you forget, she was guilty. "blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it" And to the small people, he is cleaning up mass corruption, behavior that threatens the kingdom (yes, a Queen cheating is a threat to national security in a country run on inherited positions) , and many of them are fanatics because their faith is the only thing they have, and Cersie just blew up the most holy building in the land. "unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it ." Unless you believe the change made no logical sense, which many fans, and critics have pointed out. have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city? the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how? by shaming people to walk naked in the streets? by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had .
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 28, 2019 22:09:49 GMT
"with the exception though cersei didnt blow up KL , she went after her enemies and the High Sparrow all those enemies wanted to punish her , she had a right to defend herself , she didnt kill innocents" She killed lot's of innocents, and you forget, she was guilty. "blowing up the septa was one of the greatest moments on GOT she took out a tyrant fundamentalist the High Sparrow who went after people who had affairs , gay , or whoever he thought sinned , cersei made a mistake a big mistake trusting the high sparrow and she acknowledged it" And to the small people, he is cleaning up mass corruption, behavior that threatens the kingdom (yes, a Queen cheating is a threat to national security in a country run on inherited positions) , and many of them are fanatics because their faith is the only thing they have, and Cersie just blew up the most holy building in the land. "unlike others ,dany no matter how much you are a fan or love her there is no excuse for what she did not one , when someone surrenders its over all she had to do was turn her dragon around and maybe then she had a chance being welcomed into KL , it does make sense dany has repeatedly said over and over in every season she will take what is hers with fire and blood and burn cities so when she finally does it her fans have a meltdown and whats funny here is dany had a good chance to redeem herself by not charging into KL and she blew it ." Unless you believe the change made no logical sense, which many fans, and critics have pointed out. have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city? the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how? by shaming people to walk naked in the streets? by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had . "have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city?" Nope, that's how the Dothraki came to recognize that Khals could be succeeded by their wives. It is an important social development for those chauvinistic barbarians. "the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how?" Partly by not being a Lannister creature unlike the previous head of the Church. "by shaming people to walk naked in the streets?" Yeah, that's one way to make someone hit rock bottom. It also makes an example of a guilty person, teaching others to not do something similar. "by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there" That brand was to join a religious order, plenty of people have gone through worse to join such a group. "if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert" I already explained this in my previous response. Did you actually read my response? "im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had ." She never killed innocent people nor killed indiscriminately prior to ep 5 of the final season when she goes on a genocidal campaign. Prior to that, she was always measured. So measure to genocide isn't a believable character development.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on May 28, 2019 22:24:52 GMT
have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city? the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how? by shaming people to walk naked in the streets? by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had . "have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city?" Nope, that's how the Dothraki came to recognize that Khals could be succeeded by their wives. It is an important social development for those chauvinistic barbarians. "the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how?" Partly by not being a Lannister creature unlike the previous head of the Church. "by shaming people to walk naked in the streets?" Yeah, that's one way to make someone hit rock bottom. It also makes an example of a guilty person, teaching others to not do something similar. "by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there" That brand was to join a religious order, plenty of people have gone through worse to join such a group. "if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert" I already explained this in my previous response. Did you actually read my response? "im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had ." She never killed innocent people nor killed indiscriminately prior to ep 5 of the final season when she goes on a genocidal campaign. Prior to that, she was always measured. So measure to genocide isn't a believable character development. i think you're the one who is not reading my responses i explained to you over and over how many innocents dany killed and you are ignoring it let me ask you this when dany was giving one of those speeches of hers on her dragon S6 how she was going to kill her enemies and tear down their stone houses , do you really think she was excluding innocents? you know innocent children live in those stone houses too , Daenerys burned thousands of innocent smallfolk alive, including children and she always said she would attack and take what is her with fire and blood.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 28, 2019 23:29:45 GMT
"have you forgotten that dany burned khals in their holy city?" Nope, that's how the Dothraki came to recognize that Khals could be succeeded by their wives. It is an important social development for those chauvinistic barbarians. "the high sparrow was cleaning mass corruption? how?" Partly by not being a Lannister creature unlike the previous head of the Church. "by shaming people to walk naked in the streets?" Yeah, that's one way to make someone hit rock bottom. It also makes an example of a guilty person, teaching others to not do something similar. "by afflicting pain on their foreheads by marking them? thats an evil thing to do unless you willingly want a tattoo there" That brand was to join a religious order, plenty of people have gone through worse to join such a group. "if you ask me he is a pervert , a cheating queen is a threat to a country? why does sparrow cares who cersei is sleeping with? he is a pervert" I already explained this in my previous response. Did you actually read my response? "im sorry i disagree with you , there was no change with daenryys she has always been who she is , i will agree with you that the writing sucked for every character but it still wouldn't change her ending no matter how many more episodes we had ." She never killed innocent people nor killed indiscriminately prior to ep 5 of the final season when she goes on a genocidal campaign. Prior to that, she was always measured. So measure to genocide isn't a believable character development. i think you're the one who is not reading my responses i explained to you over and over how many innocents dany killed and you are ignoring it let me ask you this when dany was giving one of those speeches of hers on her dragon S6 how she was going to kill her enemies and tear down their stone houses , do you really think she was excluding innocents? you know innocent children live in those stone houses too , Daenerys burned thousands of innocent smallfolk alive, including children and she always said she would attack and take what is her with fire and blood. "i think you're the one who is not reading my responses i explained to you over and over how many innocents dany killed" Khals are not innocent. They control armies filled with pillagers, rapist, and slave takers. "and you are ignoring it let me ask you this when dany was giving one of those speeches of hers on her dragon S6 how she was going to kill her enemies and tear down their stone houses , do you really think she was excluding innocents? you know innocent children live in those stone houses too , Daenerys burned thousands of innocent smallfolk alive, including children and she always said she would attack and take what is her with fire and blood." I think that's the kind of speech you give when you now control every Dothraki, a people famed for brutality, who only understand brutal warfare, but as she noted in the books, didn't understand anything beyond horses, let alone how to rule. Did she do any of that to the rebelling slave cities when she got back from the Dothraki capital? No. The writing was still consistent in S6.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 29, 2019 6:08:51 GMT
Dany chose to burn innocent children because she didnt feel the "love" on that side of westeros , she was jealous because they loved jon more than her , she wanted to punish the innocent in KL because they didnt love her or kiss her feet she didnt receive the treatment she was used to in other places she conquered , she was not welcomed and that stupid ilario guy who gave her the dragon eggs filled viserys head and her head full of lies , they never had support back in KL unless you consider tryion and varys who in the end turn on her "support" no one wanted her for their queen and only person who called her his queen killed her . Dany in books is just as arrogant as she is on the show . It does not make any sense, nor does Cersie being able to rule after blowing up the holiest church in the 7 kingdoms. Realistically, the small folk would be rioting every day and with only 3,200 Gold Cloaks/Lannister soldiers, she would never be able to stay in power. Dany would easily be welcomed into KL. And no, Dany is not arrogant in either. Absolutely not. Kings have destroyed churches in history and done very well. No invader is ever welcome, no matter what dirty little danidiots want to believe.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 29, 2019 6:26:35 GMT
It does not make any sense, nor does Cersie being able to rule after blowing up the holiest church in the 7 kingdoms. Realistically, the small folk would be rioting every day and with only 3,200 Gold Cloaks/Lannister soldiers, she would never be able to stay in power. Dany would easily be welcomed into KL. And no, Dany is not arrogant in either. Absolutely not. Kings have destroyed churches in history and done very well. No invader is ever welcome, no matter what dirty little danidiots want to believe. 1. Kings, not queens, let alone Dowager Queen. 2. Destroy a church, yes, destroyed the holiest church while filled with religious leaders and other major leaders awaiting to put the Dowager Queen on trial, no. Plus, she blew up her daughter in law, the actual Queen, who was very, very popular. 3. When St. Thomas Becket was killed in his church, you had a massive outcry. This fictional event far exceeds what happen to Becket. 4. 'No invader is ever welcome, no matter what dirty little danidiots want to believe.' Henry the 7th was welcome, granted I side with Richard III. The 'Glorious' Revolution lead by William of Orange and his English wife were also welcome.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 29, 2019 6:47:40 GMT
Absolutely not. Kings have destroyed churches in history and done very well. No invader is ever welcome, no matter what dirty little danidiots want to believe. 1. Kings, not queens, let alone Dowager Queen. 2. Destroy a church, yes, destroyed the holiest church while filled with religious leaders and other major leaders awaiting to put the Dowager Queen on trial, no. Plus, she blew up her daughter in law, the actual Queen, who was very, very popular. 3. When St. Thomas Becket was killed in his church, you had a massive outcry. This fictional event far exceeds what happen to Becket. Becket was not the leader of an extremist cult. We're talking Savonarole here, or the Anabaptists of Münster. The destruction of the Sept was not an attack on the Faith in its regular form nor was it followed by the enforcement of any religious rules which could have been unpopular. The "people" didn't care.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 29, 2019 7:41:25 GMT
1. Kings, not queens, let alone Dowager Queen. 2. Destroy a church, yes, destroyed the holiest church while filled with religious leaders and other major leaders awaiting to put the Dowager Queen on trial, no. Plus, she blew up her daughter in law, the actual Queen, who was very, very popular. 3. When St. Thomas Becket was killed in his church, you had a massive outcry. This fictional event far exceeds what happen to Becket. Becket was not the leader of an extremist cult. We're talking Savonarole here, or the Anabaptists of Münster. The destruction of the Sept was not an attack on the Faith in its regular form nor was it followed by the enforcement of any religious rules which could have been unpopular. The "people" didn't care. Except, in historical Europe, the High Sparrow wouldn't be viewed as an extremist, but rather as a much desired High Septon willing to reform the many abuses, such as the previous High Septon porking hookers dressed as the female members of the Seven. You and I might be against bans on gays, and religious police but that's a modern sensibility. His preaching equality, aiding the poor, living modestly (and actually living that way), cracking down on hookers/infidelity, and his use of the faith militant to protect pilgrims and holy sites during the chaotic times we see would all play well with both the common people and the higher classes. You know what wouldn't play well? Blowing up a church filled with religious leaders, high born nobles, and rich merchants, and doing this to avoid a trial on the charges that the Queen killed King Robert and had incestious relations with her cousin, Lancel. She is guilty both charges and the High Sparrow knows this because Lancel is a sparrow. Granted, the citizens of KL don't have our knowledge, but they don't need to in order to make the leap, Cersie must guilty since she just slaughtered 100s of people, including her daughter in law. Hell, many would assume she killed her son since the king kills himself on the same day. "The "people" didn't care." Because it was shit writing in this part of the setting. Remember the riots in the 2nd season. Things are worse now but no riots? Doesn't seem believable, especially if you stop and think, would the Tyrels keep delivering food after the Septon bombing.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 29, 2019 8:24:21 GMT
Becket was not the leader of an extremist cult. We're talking Savonarole here, or the Anabaptists of Münster. The destruction of the Sept was not an attack on the Faith in its regular form nor was it followed by the enforcement of any religious rules which could have been unpopular. The "people" didn't care. "The "people" didn't care." Because it was shit writing in this part of the setting. Remember the riots in the 2nd season. Things are worse now but no riots? Doesn't seem believable, especially if you stop and think, would the Tyrels keep delivering food after the Septon bombing. The riots of S2 were caused by famine. Dumb little idealists always believe the "people" cares more than it does.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 29, 2019 16:22:01 GMT
"The "people" didn't care." Because it was shit writing in this part of the setting. Remember the riots in the 2nd season. Things are worse now but no riots? Doesn't seem believable, especially if you stop and think, would the Tyrels keep delivering food after the Septon bombing. The riots of S2 were caused by famine. Dumb little idealists always believe the "people" cares more than it does. And now the Tyrels will stop sending food, so again, why no riots?
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 29, 2019 16:34:04 GMT
The riots of S2 were caused by famine. Dumb little idealists always believe the "people" cares more than it does. And now the Tyrels will stop sending food, so again, why no riots? The city was not under siege and control over the Reach was recovered. Now it's time for you to go display your stupidity elsewhere. I have no patience for your sort.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 29, 2019 17:20:09 GMT
And now the Tyrels will stop sending food, so again, why no riots? The city was not under siege and control over the Reach was recovered. Now it's time for you to go display your stupidity elsewhere. I have no patience for your sort. 1st, the Tyrels were not immediately defeated. 2nd, when they were defeated, Dani quickly wrecked the Lannister army, meaning food would stop coming. 3rd, Out of patience or are you tired of me kicking your ass? To review, you don't deny the common people would rightly assume Cercie was guilty, which means the whole War of Five kings was totally justify since the Lannister family will be viewed as illegitimate. You don't deny the High Sparrow would be largely in keeping with Medieval Europe and many would welcome him and his reforms. You don't deny that the capital would be cut off from food. You don't deny that some invaders have been welcome, normally happens when you have the rightful heir making a move, which is what Dany would be.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on May 29, 2019 19:46:23 GMT
The city was not under siege and control over the Reach was recovered. Now it's time for you to go display your stupidity elsewhere. I have no patience for your sort. 1st, the Tyrels were not immediately defeated. 2nd, when they were defeated, Dani quickly wrecked the Lannister army, meaning food would stop coming. 3rd, Out of patience or are you tired of me kicking your ass? To review, you don't deny the common people would rightly assume Cercie was guilty, which means the whole War of Five kings was totally justify since the Lannister family will be viewed as illegitimate. You don't deny the High Sparrow would be largely in keeping with Medieval Europe and many would welcome him and his reforms. You don't deny that the capital would be cut off from food. You don't deny that some invaders have been welcome, normally happens when you have the rightful heir making a move, which is what Dany would be. I've always been bothered by the way that entire plot line was handled. The people absolutely would've revolted, and it would've been worse with the death of the High Sparrow. There's no question the common folk would embrace an invader if the current monarch is shit, it's happened in history plenty of times. Blowing up the sept was done for shock value and an easy way out of that particular dilemma, the creative team was thinking ahead about as far as Cersei with that move.
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Post by lordarvidthexiii on May 29, 2019 20:03:05 GMT
1st, the Tyrels were not immediately defeated. 2nd, when they were defeated, Dani quickly wrecked the Lannister army, meaning food would stop coming. 3rd, Out of patience or are you tired of me kicking your ass? To review, you don't deny the common people would rightly assume Cercie was guilty, which means the whole War of Five kings was totally justify since the Lannister family will be viewed as illegitimate. You don't deny the High Sparrow would be largely in keeping with Medieval Europe and many would welcome him and his reforms. You don't deny that the capital would be cut off from food. You don't deny that some invaders have been welcome, normally happens when you have the rightful heir making a move, which is what Dany would be. I've always been bothered by the way that entire plot line was handled. The people absolutely would've revolted, and it would've been worse with the death of the High Sparrow. There's no question the common folk would embrace an invader if the current monarch is shit, it's happened in history plenty of times. Blowing up the sept was done for shock value and an easy way out of that particular dilemma, the creative team was thinking ahead about as far as Cersei with that move. "Blowing up the sept was done for shock value and an easy way out of that particular dilemma, the creative team was thinking ahead about as far as Cersei with that move." My thoughts as well, plus I imagine Jamie would have killed her. Might have blamed her for their son's death.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 30, 2019 6:44:17 GMT
I've always been bothered by the way that entire plot line was handled. The people absolutely would've revolted, and it would've been worse with the death of the High Sparrow. There's no question the common folk would embrace an invader if the current monarch is shit, it's happened in history plenty of times. The whole point was that the monarch wasn't "shit". The Lannister rule was never oppressive or even bad. All the aggressions they faced along the series were more than questionable. That's the whole moral of the story. That's why Tyrion is shown breaking down over Jaime and Cersei in the finale. They couldn't make it more obvious but for some reason, there are still those who don't understand.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 30, 2019 7:00:53 GMT
I've always been bothered by the way that entire plot line was handled. The people absolutely would've revolted, and it would've been worse with the death of the High Sparrow. There's no question the common folk would embrace an invader if the current monarch is shit, it's happened in history plenty of times. The whole point was that the monarch wasn't "shit". The Lannister rule was never oppressive or even bad. All the aggressions they faced along the series were more than questionable. That's the whole moral of the story. That's why Tyrion is shown breaking down over Jaime and Cersei in the finale. They couldn't make it more obvious but for some reason, there are still those who don't understand. In addition to this, we can of course complain about the execution not making sense in detail, the same way we can ask how Daenerys could be surprised by the Iron Fleet and how Rhaegal could be shot down but not Drogon. I don't think it applies in this case anyway, since the Faith was shown not to have a strong grip on people's lives in the first place. The people of King's Landing are far less religious than those of 15th century London would have been. GRRM shows a modern religious situation in which at least half the population ignores it altogether, and probably more. Only the needy and the funny resort to it. It doesn't matter. The overall "message" remains in spite of this: the resentment towards Cersei's rule is in the mind of her enemies but not shared within the people.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on May 30, 2019 12:01:09 GMT
The whole point was that the monarch wasn't "shit". The Lannister rule was never oppressive or even bad. All the aggressions they faced along the series were more than questionable. That's the whole moral of the story. That's why Tyrion is shown breaking down over Jaime and Cersei in the finale. They couldn't make it more obvious but for some reason, there are still those who don't understand. In addition to this, we can of course complain about the execution not making sense in detail, the same way we can ask how Daenerys could be surprised by the Iron Fleet and how Rhaegal could be shot down but not Drogon. I don't think it applies in this case anyway, since the Faith was shown not to have a strong grip on people's lives in the first place. The people of King's Landing are far less religious than those of 15th century London would have been. GRRM shows a modern religious situation in which at least half the population ignores it altogether, and probably more. Only the needy and the funny resort to it. It doesn't matter. The overall "message" remains in spite of this: the resentment towards Cersei's rule is in the mind of her enemies but not shared within the people. When things are going poorly for the nation, the leader takes the blame. They'd been through wars and famine, with rumors circulating the Queen had bastard children with her own brother and fornicated with other relatives among who knows how many others over the years. No matter how religious they are or aren't, the smallfolk would find her repulsive and blame her for their problems. The day that she's supposed to face judgment, she destroyed one of the most sacred places in the realm with all of her enemies inside it. If that isn't a tyrant, I don't know what is. The people would revolt under those circumstances; maybe not all of them, but enough to make a difference. There's no way blowing up the sept wouldn't turn at least a few Houses against her, let alone the common folk. (I also disagree with your assessment of the faith of the populace of Kings Landing, but that's neither here nor there.) The fact that the writers clearly didn't want to deal with this inevitable outcome doesn't make the outcome they came up with reasonable. Bringing up other examples of terrible writing won't sweep this under the rug, either. It only makes it worse, to my mind. But I'm not going to get into a huge back and forth over it. If you're fine with how they handled this aspect of the story, great. It didn't work for me, though.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on May 30, 2019 17:26:13 GMT
1st, the Tyrels were not immediately defeated. 2nd, when they were defeated, Dani quickly wrecked the Lannister army, meaning food would stop coming. 3rd, Out of patience or are you tired of me kicking your ass? To review, you don't deny the common people would rightly assume Cercie was guilty, which means the whole War of Five kings was totally justify since the Lannister family will be viewed as illegitimate. You don't deny the High Sparrow would be largely in keeping with Medieval Europe and many would welcome him and his reforms. You don't deny that the capital would be cut off from food. You don't deny that some invaders have been welcome, normally happens when you have the rightful heir making a move, which is what Dany would be. I've always been bothered by the way that entire plot line was handled. The people absolutely would've revolted, and it would've been worse with the death of the High Sparrow. There's no question the common folk would embrace an invader if the current monarch is shit, it's happened in history plenty of times. Blowing up the sept was done for shock value and an easy way out of that particular dilemma, the creative team was thinking ahead about as far as Cersei with that move. I don’t think it was for shock. I think blowing up the sept, a place that kept her imprisoned, shamed her, and was about to still place her on trial for something she was clearly guilty of was in her wheelhouse. Why wouldn’t it be? Cersei has a profound indifference to mankind and only cares about her inner circle and that’s only because they obey her. If there was a shock at all its Tommen killing himself but even that makes sense considering he is devout to the Seven, is an incest bastard, whose mom just killed the woman he loves..
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