Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 23, 2019 9:37:13 GMT
Daenerys and Tyrion, S5E08:
Daenerys : Lannister, Targaryen, Baratheon, Stark, Tyrell. They're all just spokes on a wheel. This one's on top, then that one's on top. And on and on it spins, crushing those on the ground.
Tyrion: It's a beautiful dream, stopping the wheel. You're not the first person who's ever dreamt it.
Daenerys : I'm not going to stop the wheel. I'm going to break the wheel.
So the wheel is the structure that allows power to shift from a party to another. It crushes because this shift comes through war. Stopping the wheel, as Tyrion dreams, implies fixing the ownership of power to a stable party, certain of keeping it. Breaking it is more drastic, it requires suppressing the parties altogether. This is what Daenerys would go for and she says this as early as S5E08.
Hereditary transmission of power, from father to son and failing this to the closest relative, is the earliest known attempt at "stopping the wheel". The ruler is not chosen but the absence of a choice also removes a justification for strife. This is why it always was popular with the power holders supporting kings.
In the series finale, Tyrion says otherwise:
Tyrion, S8E06: "Sons of kings can be cruel and stupid, as you well know. His will never torment us. That is the wheel our queen wanted to break. From now on, rulers will not be born. They will be chosen on this spot by the lords and ladies of Westeros... to serve the realm."
Suddenly "the wheel" is no longer the possibility of choice, but its absence, because "the sons of kings" are not a safe bet, as if war had come through one of these. On the contrary, the wheel came to turn through the apparent choice the claimed illegitimacy of the new king opened.
Tyrion proposes an elective monarchy as a solution, which basically means that the death of every ruler will open such a choice, a choice between factually independent power holders with control over lands, resources and population. This is a recipe for recurring civil war . Tyrion is not "breaking the wheel", he is turning it into an institution and hopes that its turns will be painless, that it will not crush anything thanks to the unanimity of the power holders to nicely sit together and make a civilised choice. A pious wish. Not one likely to be fulfilled.
Anyone who read a bit of history knows that the choosing of Roman emperors or the election of those of that Holy German Roman Thingy in its early centuries were anything but a stable affair.
Once again, Tyrion is talking shit. His solution is neither what he says it is, nor is it serving the purpose he claims. Once again, the show is blathering a nonsensical message to its audience, based on the naivety that choice can only be a good thing.
Daenerys : Lannister, Targaryen, Baratheon, Stark, Tyrell. They're all just spokes on a wheel. This one's on top, then that one's on top. And on and on it spins, crushing those on the ground.
Tyrion: It's a beautiful dream, stopping the wheel. You're not the first person who's ever dreamt it.
Daenerys : I'm not going to stop the wheel. I'm going to break the wheel.
So the wheel is the structure that allows power to shift from a party to another. It crushes because this shift comes through war. Stopping the wheel, as Tyrion dreams, implies fixing the ownership of power to a stable party, certain of keeping it. Breaking it is more drastic, it requires suppressing the parties altogether. This is what Daenerys would go for and she says this as early as S5E08.
Hereditary transmission of power, from father to son and failing this to the closest relative, is the earliest known attempt at "stopping the wheel". The ruler is not chosen but the absence of a choice also removes a justification for strife. This is why it always was popular with the power holders supporting kings.
In the series finale, Tyrion says otherwise:
Tyrion, S8E06: "Sons of kings can be cruel and stupid, as you well know. His will never torment us. That is the wheel our queen wanted to break. From now on, rulers will not be born. They will be chosen on this spot by the lords and ladies of Westeros... to serve the realm."
Suddenly "the wheel" is no longer the possibility of choice, but its absence, because "the sons of kings" are not a safe bet, as if war had come through one of these. On the contrary, the wheel came to turn through the apparent choice the claimed illegitimacy of the new king opened.
Tyrion proposes an elective monarchy as a solution, which basically means that the death of every ruler will open such a choice, a choice between factually independent power holders with control over lands, resources and population. This is a recipe for recurring civil war . Tyrion is not "breaking the wheel", he is turning it into an institution and hopes that its turns will be painless, that it will not crush anything thanks to the unanimity of the power holders to nicely sit together and make a civilised choice. A pious wish. Not one likely to be fulfilled.
Anyone who read a bit of history knows that the choosing of Roman emperors or the election of those of that Holy German Roman Thingy in its early centuries were anything but a stable affair.
Once again, Tyrion is talking shit. His solution is neither what he says it is, nor is it serving the purpose he claims. Once again, the show is blathering a nonsensical message to its audience, based on the naivety that choice can only be a good thing.
