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Post by Leo of Red Keep on May 26, 2019 15:33:02 GMT
Littlefinger is not killed at the end of S7. He remains as an advisor around Sansa all along. She tells him about Jon's parentage and he decides to push Jon's claim, informing Tyrion. He hopes to use Jon against Daenerys, the same way he would have used Ned as a fool against Joffrey as he proposed in S1. Sansa is using him the same way. Tyrion has a change of heart about Daenerys and Varys sacrifices him. Tyrion is executed by dragon. Varys is connected to Qyburn through the "little birds" and they plan to undermine the defence of the city by triggering surrender behind Cersei's back. Varys frees Jaime and convinces him to help by organising Cersei's escape and exile. After King's Landing has fallen, Varys recognises his mistake but does not resign. He merely talks to Jon the same way, convincing him to kill Daenerys. Drogon does not take the body away. Unsullied kill Jon afterwards, based on the evidence. Greyworm holds the city against the northern army, Davos and Varys call for a council of Lords to resolve the situation. Greyworm is implicitly on trial for the execution of Jon but found justified. With no Lannisters or Targaryens left, the Council has to choose a new king. Gendry Baratheon is not elected by the true highborn. They choose Robin Arryn under the promise of a marital alliance with Sansa Stark. Littlefinger looks at her with a creepy smile. There is no dumb talk about elections making things better by some sort of unexplained magic in a time where private armies are common place, no stupidities about Bran having the better story which would unite the world, no patricide rewarded with a top position after joining a foreign invader. There is no independent North in the face of Dorne or the Iron Islands. Bran becomes Lord of Winterfell and can spend the rest of his life in the Godswood, watching his sister and Sweetrobin in bed. Arya can still go jump off the edge of the world as she likes. Varys and Littlefinger resume their positions at the Small Council. King Robin surprises everyone by choosing Davos as Hand on Sansa's advice. Littlefinger makes a cryptic face which has everyone scream for a sequel. Epilogue: there is no silly Cleganebowl, no fight with Euron, Jaime comes in time to help Cersei escape and the epilogue shows them both at a rich party in Pentos.
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maxwellperfect
Junior Member
@maxwellperfect
Posts: 3,966
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Post by maxwellperfect on Jun 1, 2019 3:02:22 GMT
I thought Robyn Arryn had an outside chance of being the one of the Iron Throne when all was said and done.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 1, 2019 6:34:41 GMT
In a politically realistic situation, making Robyn king should have been Littlefinger's goal for a long time.
It would have been acceptable to others because they would see themselves more independent under a theoretical rule from the Vale than under that of any of their closer, larger neighbours. The Vale might be impregnable but it is a small force, unlikely to enforce anything on others. So while none of the other kingdoms would really want any other ruler than themselves, young and frail Robyn of the Vale with his bunch of knights would look like the lesser evil to most. Even the northern alliance would be acceptable, considering the big unwieldy North would be a fair defensive ally but unlikely an offensive one coming down south to police the Reach, the Stormlands or any other place. The only close neighbour is the Riverlands, becoming a second ally through the Tully-Stark relation alone.
A sadly missed opportunity to show how things would really work and especially how things in the Small Council would remain unchanged. Littlefinger and Varys were principles more than characters, always renewed, always present. I suppose it is somewhat illustrated through Bronn and Davos in the actual ending, but not as well.
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Post by jon snow loves sansa on Jun 1, 2019 22:16:52 GMT
LF needed to die if it wasn't by Sansa it would have been by cersei , I wish we did get a showdown between Jon /greyworm and I want Jon to have won Fact Tyrion survived is a miracle I did wish Varys made it though
GRRM Left one Lannister alive(Tyrion) one geryjoy(Yara) , 1/2 Targaryen (Jon) , have no idea who the prince in dorne is , Sweet little Robin lord of the vale and the pack of Starks survived although separated .
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Jun 3, 2019 2:39:03 GMT
I'm always down for Littlefinger surviving and ultimately winning.
Unceremoniously killing Tyrion and then having Varys fill the exact same role but without the emotional stakes seems kinda arbitrary.
Cersei's escape would last 20 minutes before she's IDed, captured, and or killed.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 3, 2019 4:15:32 GMT
Unceremoniously killing Tyrion and then having Varys fill the exact same role but without the emotional stakes seems kinda arbitrary. The "emotional stakes" are what kills the story. Tyrion has been doubted and one more half suspect move getting him killed by Daenerys would indeed show her arbitrary side to all before the slaughter starts. It would also shake the audience a lot more than grilling the Spider. Seeing this, Varys would take action just to avoid the escalation he sees happening already. Using Jaime as a willing candidate is the best choice: Varys doesn't care for him and can trust his motivation. Anyway, there are new developments. We have been lied to:
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 3, 2019 4:38:26 GMT
I'm always down for Littlefinger surviving and ultimately winning. I like the idea of both snakes surviving. Better than that shitty Stark happy ending. Winning is another matter. Littlefinger getting close to controlling the new king but finding out he has competition would have been fitting. It would have made for a meaningful statement instead of a dumb fantasy.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Jun 3, 2019 5:22:33 GMT
Unceremoniously killing Tyrion and then having Varys fill the exact same role but without the emotional stakes seems kinda arbitrary. The "emotional stakes" are what kills the story. Tyrion has been doubted and one more half suspect move getting him killed by Daenerys would indeed show her arbitrary side to all before the slaughter starts. It would also shake the audience a lot more than grilling the Spider. Seeing this, Varys would take action just to avoid the escalation he sees happening already. In that case, I'd rather him executed for freeing Jaime, which went oddly unnoticed and undealt with in the actual show.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Jun 3, 2019 7:03:10 GMT
The "emotional stakes" are what kills the story. Tyrion has been doubted and one more half suspect move getting him killed by Daenerys would indeed show her arbitrary side to all before the slaughter starts. It would also shake the audience a lot more than grilling the Spider. Seeing this, Varys would take action just to avoid the escalation he sees happening already. In that case, I'd rather him executed for freeing Jaime, which went oddly unnoticed and undealt with in the actual show. As usual, the writing was devoid of any logic and centred on the emotional. Tyrion could have made a point of Jaime getting the city to surrender. He sent him to ring the bells. He was helping securing victory for his queen. That was calculated tactics, not treason. Instead of that, he was made to pull a stupidly dramatic resignation and was allowed to receive visits in his cell. But back to the point, the poisoning could still have been Varys' work but with Tyrion falling instead. Having him executed on a false suspicion rather than for an actual fact like freeing his brother would have painted a different Daenerys, less reliable, more obviously tyrannical even before she committed slaughter. Having Varys then free Jaime unnoticed would have explained his being able to freely talk to Jon later on.
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