chasallnut
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Post by chasallnut on Apr 10, 2017 13:01:18 GMT
There are no scientologists here, so that part os pretty accurate. Bigotry doesn't change based on whether someone is accused of it so the point is irrelevant. If anything, the OP shows he's a moron by mocking people that have to experience the pain of cancer to compare to his idiotic and irrational fear of something that probably hasn't harmed him. Who knows since he may be too stupid to state more than a sentence or two? There are no Muslims who post here either (are there? I haven't seen DramatisPersonae around). Christians would fain defend their own faith by accusing its detractors of bigotry, but most atheists would not do the same. And what is done to non-believers in Islamic nations is comparable to having anal cancer (if such a thing exists). Cancer affects unlucky individuals, but Islam has the potential to be more than just 'a pain in the butt' for Europe going forward. Bowel cancer, colon cancer are all more than just "a pain in the butt" and in many cases are fatal with awful symptoms. The whole premise of which is worse is disgusting to begin with, but that isn't surprising seeing as who the OP is.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Apr 10, 2017 13:02:30 GMT
@miccee
Not sure. However, the difference is that we know very little about Scientology in general, which is why they are hardly talked about except in relation to what may be an irrational disdain for them as well.
Plenty of people here may not be Muslims but assiciate with Muslims enough to know that they are no dangerous than anyone else.
It's always been a bit silly of a rationale to think that Muslims killing someone is somehow worse than a gun nutter shooting up a bunch of people. The world can be a dangerous place and people should prepare for the possible reality that they could die without demonizing an entire group which is just a sign of retardation. If the OP is one of those people, then maybe he has my apologies as that would be a different conversation.
If he is in a less sucky country, then it would likely be worse to have the cancer.
Maybe he needs to have both happen just to make sure? He should start smoking from his butt.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:07:26 GMT
I've never seen or heard a non-Scientologist standing up for Scientology. And documentaries that are made about the harms of Scientology do not provoke mass protests and accusations of racism; the media is not required to be respectful or politically correct. If you started a thread comparing scientology with anal cancer, then you'd get pretty much the same responses as you see here. The thing is, no one's comparing scientology with cancer. I haven't seen anyone compare Christianity with cancer, either. I've seen and heard people compare religion in general with cancer, and I have myself spoken out against that. I have seen Islam compared with cancer, too. But never Christianity. But try it, see what reponses you get. There would be people saying that it was a stupid question, but nobody would be accusing anyone of bigotry against rich, white Hollywood actors. And comedians can make fun of Christianity freely here in the west, but the only ones who would dare mock Islam are those who had already cultivated a reputation for racism, such as Roy Chubby-Brown. Here's an example of the demurral of a couple of comedians with respect to why they don't make fun of Islam:
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:12:05 GMT
There are no Muslims who post here either (are there? I haven't seen DramatisPersonae around). Christians would fain defend their own faith by accusing its detractors of bigotry, but most atheists would not do the same. And what is done to non-believers in Islamic nations is comparable to having anal cancer (if such a thing exists). Cancer affects unlucky individuals, but Islam has the potential to be more than just 'a pain in the butt' for Europe going forward. Bowel cancer, colon cancer are all more than just "a pain in the butt" and in many cases are fatal with awful symptoms. The whole premise of which is worse is disgusting to begin with, but that isn't surprising seeing as who the OP is. I understand that. The two cannot be fairly compared because cancer affects individuals unlucky enough to be afflicted, whereas Islam carries the threat of casting a general pall over the lives of many (as well as being very harmful to individuals in Islamic nations who don't fit into that culture).
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Apr 10, 2017 13:13:33 GMT
Bowel cancer, colon cancer are all more than just "a pain in the butt" and in many cases are fatal with awful symptoms. The whole premise of which is worse is disgusting to begin with, but that isn't surprising seeing as who the OP is. I understand that. The two cannot be fairly compared because cancer affects individuals unlucky enough to be afflicted, whereas Islam carries the threat of casting a general pall over the lives of many (as well as being very harmful to individuals in Islamic nations who don't fit into that culture). That pall you describe is an irrational fear of them and that is not the typical Muslim's problem until they are harmed by it.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Apr 10, 2017 13:20:33 GMT
If you started a thread comparing scientology with anal cancer, then you'd get pretty much the same responses as you see here. The thing is, no one's comparing scientology with cancer. I haven't seen anyone compare Christianity with cancer, either. I've seen and heard people compare religion in general with cancer, and I have myself spoken out against that. I have seen Islam compared with cancer, too. But never Christianity. But try it, see what reponses you get. There would be people saying that it was a stupid question, but nobody would be accusing anyone of bigotry against rich, white Hollywood actors. And comedians can make fun of Christianity freely here in the west, but the only ones who would dare mock Islam are those who had already cultivated a reputation for racism, such as Roy Chubby-Brown. Here's an example of the demurral of a couple of comedians with respect to why they don't make fun of Islam: There's a difference between making fun of a religion - and people do that all the time, regardless of religion - and comparing them with cancer. Or vermin. If you look at the nazi propaganda film "The Eternal Jew", there is not a single joke to be had. When they compare Jews to rats they don't expect the audience to laugh: they are absolutely serious. Same thing when you compare something with cancer: it's not a "ha ha" thing, it is always said with a straight face. I only watched the Dara video, by the way. Not entirely sure why you even posted that - I suspect you think he's saying something quite different from what he was actually saying.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:25:08 GMT
Not sure. However, the difference is that we know very little about Scientology in general, which is why they are hardly talked about except in relation to what may be an irrational disdain for them as well. Plenty of people here may not be Muslims but assiciate with Muslims enough to know that they are no dangerous than anyone else. It's always been a bit silly of a rationale to think that Muslims killing someone is somehow worse than a gun nutter shooting up a bunch of people. The world can be a dangerous place and people should prepare for the possible reality that they could die without demonizing an entire group which is just a sign of retardation. If the OP is one of those people, then maybe he has my apologies as that would be a different conversation. If he is in a less sucky country, then it would likely be worse to have the cancer. Maybe he needs to have both happen just to make sure? He should start smoking from his butt. I know enough Muslims to know that individual Muslims are not threatening to me, and I don't show my disdain for individual Muslims. My personal truck with Islam is not with terrorism (and like you've stated, it is silly to think that a crime is worse just because it's a Muslim doing it). It's the conservative beliefs of Muslims and the birth rate of Muslim communities over here, especially their intolerance of freedom of speech and willingness to use violence and protest to shut down freedom of speech. To relate one of the comments that I recently read on a (very left wing) newspaper's online site - Islam is like a Japanese Knotweed of religion. It's also one that cannot be openly ridiculed without accusation of racism, even though Christianity is mocked and ridiculed by the mainstream on those same terms by some of the very people who wish to shut down any mockery of Islam. And you can't compare something which effects individuals acutely to something which casts a pall over society in general, so I agree that it is a poor comparison.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:27:48 GMT
I understand that. The two cannot be fairly compared because cancer affects individuals unlucky enough to be afflicted, whereas Islam carries the threat of casting a general pall over the lives of many (as well as being very harmful to individuals in Islamic nations who don't fit into that culture). That pall you describe is an irrational fear of them and that is not the typical Muslim's problem until they are harmed by it. The conservative beliefs, and the blasphemy laws (sometimes self-imposed) that prevent us from even making fun of the religion are what constitutes the 'pall'. Also the fact that Muslim terrorism grants governments the license to use invasive surveillance techniques against its population in the name of safety. So a large part of the harm caused by Islam in our society comes from our own government's response to the threat.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 13:33:54 GMT
There would be people saying that it was a stupid question, but nobody would be accusing anyone of bigotry against rich, white Hollywood actors. And comedians can make fun of Christianity freely here in the west, but the only ones who would dare mock Islam are those who had already cultivated a reputation for racism, such as Roy Chubby-Brown. Here's an example of the demurral of a couple of comedians with respect to why they don't make fun of Islam: There's a difference between making fun of a religion - and people do that all the time, regardless of religion - and comparing them with cancer. Or vermin. If you look at the nazi propaganda film "The Eternal Jew", there is not a single joke to be had. When they compare Jews to rats they don't expect the audience to laugh: they are absolutely serious. Same thing when you compare something with cancer: it's not a "ha ha" thing, it is always said with a straight face. I only watched the Dara video, by the way. Not entirely sure why you even posted that - I suspect you think he's saying something quite different from what he was actually saying. People don't really 'make fun' of Islam, because it is too sensitive. You've either got people who are trying to protect it from either mockery or criticism, or you have the po-faced ranks of the little-Englanders who are angry about Islam. It's a case of both sides repelling each other, with not much humour. If the comedians are going to weigh in on the subject at all, they'll usually only go after the little-Englanders. And I am aware that the OP wasn't particularly funny and that comparison of religion to a cancer is not particularly funny (it is a good simile to compare it either to a cancer or a virus). I assure you that I'm capable of comprehending what Dara O'Briain said in his video. But my point is that comedians freely ridicule Christianity, but then when it comes to Islam they have a lot of excuses for why they can't do so.
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Post by Karl Aksel on Apr 10, 2017 13:53:03 GMT
There's a difference between making fun of a religion - and people do that all the time, regardless of religion - and comparing them with cancer. Or vermin. If you look at the nazi propaganda film "The Eternal Jew", there is not a single joke to be had. When they compare Jews to rats they don't expect the audience to laugh: they are absolutely serious. Same thing when you compare something with cancer: it's not a "ha ha" thing, it is always said with a straight face. I only watched the Dara video, by the way. Not entirely sure why you even posted that - I suspect you think he's saying something quite different from what he was actually saying. People don't really 'make fun' of Islam, because it is too sensitive. I see people making fun of Islam all the time. That's what all those cartoons are about, after all. The only reason I - and people like me - defend Islam is because of the lacklustre quality of the attacks against Islam. If people who claim to be merely "critical" of Islam could argue rationally against Islam, a lot of the defence of Islam would go away. Why is it a good comparison? Dara was on point - a comedian bases his routine on what he knows. And also what the audience knows. If a subject is little known by either comedian or audience, the subject will be avoided. Simple as that. It's not a coincidence that eg. Portugese politicians do not feature very often in the material of American stand up comedians.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Apr 10, 2017 13:54:25 GMT
@miccee
Their conservative beliefs are not your concern. I've never had to follow a Muslim practice or belief.
You are allowed to make fun of any religion you want.
The thing about humor is in order for it to be funny, people need to at least pretend to understand what they are laughing at. Most comedians, something the OP is clearly not anyway, don;t know Islam and so there's no reason to waste material on it.
If you are talking about vandalism and trespassing in connection with that mockery, then this may be a different topic as a person who does this deserves to be in jail. I'm not sure I've ever had invasive surveillance so I would need clarification as to what that is. However, Muslims are being observed too making this a moot point.
Further you seem to be blaming the governments irrational fears toward all Muslims as the reason everyone else should be irrationally fearful of them. Correct?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 14:57:44 GMT
I see, so not liking a religion is bigotry now. Nice try. You didn't open a dialogue with " I don't like Islam"... you opened it with " Which is worse, Islam or anal cancer? This is a tough call for me." That's a trolling inflammatory desire to express an incontrovertible hatred towards a religion.
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vernuf
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Post by vernuf on Apr 10, 2017 15:49:39 GMT
So you believe that everyone should like Islam? What should people like about it? Straw man.
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vernuf
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Post by vernuf on Apr 10, 2017 15:51:28 GMT
I see, so not liking a religion is bigotry now. What are your thoughts on Scientology? Fuck, you're a dumbshit. It's not that you don't like Islam. It's the FUCKING COMPARISON of it to anal cancer.
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Post by phludowin on Apr 10, 2017 15:52:11 GMT
Islam is a religion, anal cancer is a disease. In my opinion, a disease is worse than a religion.
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vernuf
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Post by vernuf on Apr 10, 2017 15:52:59 GMT
So the only alternative to liking Islam is to think of it as worse than anal cancer? There is no middle ground? And to point out the bigotry behind the thinking that a religion is worse than anal cancer, is the same as believing everyone should like that religion instead? What's the matter with you? Like the OP said, there would probably have been no accusations of bigotry if someone had asked the same question of Scientology, or even Christianity. I'm going to go out on a limb and say, yeah, it would be bigoted to ask the same question of Scientology or Christianity, so fuck you.
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Post by captainbryce on Apr 10, 2017 16:58:23 GMT
Islam, because it affects more people.
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Post by Edward-Elizabeth-Hitler on Apr 10, 2017 17:23:42 GMT
This is a tough call for me. What happened to you mate? You used to be a serious poster.
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Post by Cinemachinery on Apr 10, 2017 18:09:22 GMT
Well I've got upwards of thousands of Muslims in my immediate area of the city, interact with many daily, and they all seem decent sorts. We talk about saving for kids college, retirement, the state of the world, etc.
I've known several, too many but not many, people with cancer and they're dead so... I'm going with cancer.
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Post by OldSamVimes on Apr 10, 2017 18:29:00 GMT
This is a tough call for me. Hope your anal cancer gets better. Not much you can do about it. Look at the bright side, if you die of anal cancer you don't have to worry about Muslims anymore. I realize you don't really need to worry about Muslims now, but you've made the choice to spend your time worrying so I hope you enjoy yourself.
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