|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 28, 2019 23:46:54 GMT
Who did Hollywood think should have been put on a space age Noah's Ark in 1951? Notice anything?
When Worlds Collide
|
|
|
|
Post by cynthiagreen on Jun 29, 2019 0:00:18 GMT
Who did Hollywood think should have been put on a space age Noah's Ark in 1951? Notice anything?
When World's Collide
Notice anything? I'm guessing Nipsey Russell and Dorothy Dandridge were in the powder room when that photo was taken?
|
|
|
|
Post by politicidal on Jun 29, 2019 0:01:47 GMT
They only had enough room for just one kid?
|
|
|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 29, 2019 0:30:25 GMT
They only had enough room for just one kid? The kid wasn't supposed to be there. They gathered a group of the supposedly most valuable people (special skills like engineers, doctors, etc), and then from those did a lottery. If I remember right, the orphaned kid made it on as a fluke at the last minute because they felt sorry for him.
|
|
|
|
Post by politicidal on Jun 29, 2019 0:43:55 GMT
They only had enough room for just one kid? The kid wasn't supposed to be there. They gathered a group of the supposedly most valuable people (special skills like engineers, doctors, etc), and then from those did a lottery. If I remember right, the orphaned kid made it on as a fluke at the last minute because they felt sorry for him. How noble.
|
|
|
|
Post by teleadm on Jun 29, 2019 14:58:45 GMT
I hadn't thought of this before, all passangers are caucasians, "The Master Race" bullshit ideology.
Well, without the Poles, Romanians, Indians and Lankeses., they would never figure out how to make things work, to do all the dirty work cheap.
Seriously I'ts a very good opinion, that somehow got lost over the years
|
|
|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 30, 2019 0:01:52 GMT
I hadn't thought of this before, all passangers are caucasians, "The Master Race" bullshit ideology. Well, without the Poles, Romanians, Indians and Lankeses., they would never figure out how to make things work, to do all the dirty work cheap. Seriously I'ts a very good opinion, that somehow got lost over the years I think it was probably subtler than that. Not necessarily so much a conscious, preserving "The Master Race" discrimination against those who were not caucasian, but rather a failure to see people who were not caucasian as having something important to contribute to humanity. There's a lot of talk about "diversity" in the US today, and the topic provokes resentment in certain quarters. But I think When Worlds Collide presents a perfect example of how failure to recognize diversity as a virtue can be a weakness. Suppose all farmers start planting one strain of food crops because it's popular with buyers and is very hardy. Now let's suppose that some unanticipated disaster occurs--maybe there is an epidemic outbreak of mold infestation that wipes out all the crops. People starve (Ireland's great potato blight). Far better to maintain a diversity of types of food and of strains of individual food plants. (This is a cardinal rule in investing. If you invest all your money in one stock and that stock's price drops precipitously, you could lose all your money. Never put all your eggs in one basket.) The same principle applies to animals, including humans. If your goal is giving human beings the highest chance of being able to survive in a new world that has never been explored, you want a diverse group of humans to be in the founder community.
|
|
|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 30, 2019 0:02:06 GMT
In terms of the politics & economics of moviemaking in 1951, though, there was also the issue of whether depicting a multiracial group of passengers on the spaceship would have been too controversial and hurt the film's profitability. African Americans at that time were still definitely considered second-class citizens in the US, where racial segregation by law was widespread and interracial marriage was illegal in many places. And with the US having only recently ended a cataclysmic war against Japan, and currently being involved in yet another brutal war against North Korea (and by proxy China), anti-Asian feelings were also widespread.
One other thought:
Another way to look at all of this is that the decisions about how the American space program would proceed were largely made by the scientist who proposed the project. So maybe, from the writers' and other filmmakers' point of view, the "blame" and "credit" for the design and execution of the program should be laid at his feet rather than at theirs. Maybe they sought to portray the prejudices of a person such as he was rather than to show how they would have designed the program if they were proposing an ideal escape program. Their portrayal of the eccentric billionaire who agreed to help fund the program on the condition that he be able to get a seat is clearly a bit of social commentary.
|
|
|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 30, 2019 0:06:20 GMT
Of course, more recent versions of this story look very different. 2012, for instance:  |
|
|
|
Post by Prime etc. on Jun 30, 2019 20:23:37 GMT
In 1950 the US film audience was majority European-white. The film was made for that audience only, in the same way most Indian films of the same period (and today) were not intended for European consumption. The film discriminates against rural and non-Americans too from what I remember-they don't suggest Europeans have a place on the ships--it's entirely an English American affair-in the same way aliens tended to land in Washington.
Furthermore, air travel was not was it is now--it could take 24 hours to travel from the West to East coast of the US-imagine how difficult it would have been to go from China to the US. It's not like they would have had an airlift from Senegal. I don't think it was malicious in intent-it's a sci-fi version of a lifeboat scenario.
If they added diversity it would be as harmonious as a United Nations meeting.
By contrast-look how problematic shoehorned diversity messages can be--i.e. the Miles Dyson character in Terminator 2. This African-American computer genius gets attacked by some crazy white woman and agrees to blow up his company--a non genius would see that he was going to ruin his life and that of his family--all because he sees a mechanical arm that matches one kept in a display case? That is a big leap of faith.
It makes him look like a selfless tool (the aim is to suggest how noble he is--but it is racially offensive--suggesting Dyson has no personal interests worth caring about-like his family).
|
|
|
|
Post by Eλευθερί on Jun 30, 2019 21:11:47 GMT
In 1950 the US film audience was majority European-white. The film was made for that audience only, in the same way most Indian films of the same period (and today) were not intended for European consumption. The film discriminates against rural and non-Americans too from what I remember-they don't suggest Europeans have a place on the ships--it's entirely an English American affair-in the same way aliens tended to land in Washington. Furthermore, air travel was not was it is now--it could take 24 hours to travel from the West to East coast of the US-imagine how difficult it would have been to go from China to the US. It's not like they would have had an airlift from Senegal. I don't think it was malicious in intent-it's a sci-fi version of a lifeboat scenario. If they added diversity it would be as harmonious as a United Nations meeting. The information about the need to escape from Earth was communicated to nations around the world. All of the governments ignored the warning until late in the game. The film focuses on the American experience because the American scientist and billionaire backer got involved in the game earlier--but other governments eventually had their own last-minute projects (doomed to fail because they had waited too long). That's why people from other countries are not shown. But even in 1950, 1 in 10 Americans was black. And while the numbers of Native Americans, Asians, and others who were not white accounted for only a small share of the total population, there were still many thousands of them in absolute numbers in the country. They had 8 months to plan, so travel time getting around the US was not the major limiting factor.
|
|
|
|
Post by Prime etc. on Jun 30, 2019 21:51:00 GMT
But even in 1950, 1 in 10 Americans was black. And while the numbers of Native Americans, Asians, and others who were not white accounted for only a small share of the total population, there were still many thousands of them in absolute numbers in the country. But it gets back to who the audience for the film is. Who says a film must represent all things at all times? That would only be a flaw if they filmmakers prided themselves on making films for the entire world--which I think is an impossible task. You cannot make a coherent movie story that registers equally with all audiences because everyone is different.
Ironically, I think Pal was seeking to be multicultural for the era either by his own desire or forced on him by the studio. Dr Lao is an example-since the foreigner is presented as a benevolent wise character and surrogate father to the orphan kid. That's only 10 years or so after WWC. Realistically, how would black or asian or Cherokee characters be inserted into the story in a way that seems plausible for 1951?
|
|
|
|
Post by marshamae on Jun 30, 2019 23:23:38 GMT
First, the audience in the US was the US population. You think Blacks and Latinos did not attend movies?
Second, one of the problems with Science Fiction as a genre is that it was peopled with whites . The presence of Ohura and Sulu in Star Trek were major steps toward more diverse sci fi as well as more diverse TV. The popularity of the Godzilla films made an impact too, encouraging sci fi to notice that the majority of the world’s population was Asian. Star wars’ universe peopled with humans, humanoids and robots presented a huge leap forward in diversity in sci fi.
|
|
|
|
Post by london777 on Jul 1, 2019 16:57:24 GMT
Interesting points made by all posters. Thanks, guys and gals.
|
|
