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Post by 尺ロㄈにモイ州凡几 on Mar 18, 2020 23:20:07 GMT
Let's do AFC North and NFC South AFC North/NFC South ranking (out of 8) 2019: 7 / T5 2018: T1 / 6 2017: 8 / 1 2016: 5 / T3 2015: 6 / 5 2014: 1 / 7 2013: 4 / 6 2012: 2 / T4 2011: 1 / T5 2010: T5 / 1 2009: T2 / T5 2008: 5 / 1 So the AFC North had a top 3 division 5 times, and finished last or tied for last 1 time So the NFC South had a top 3 division 4 times and finished last or tied for last 0 times. And as a reminder, the AFC East, the "weakest division," had a top 3 division *6 times and finished last or tied for last 1 time. *not 7 like previously stated, found an error in 2009, they were 4th, not 3rd So according to the numbers, the AFC East had the better teams more often over the last 12 years than the NFC West, NFC South, and AFC North. Well I guess having the Browns in the same division would diminish the average winning percentage of any division. ☹️
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 18, 2020 23:40:52 GMT
AFC North/NFC South ranking (out of 8) 2019: 7 / T5 2018: T1 / 6 2017: 8 / 1 2016: 5 / T3 2015: 6 / 5 2014: 1 / 7 2013: 4 / 6 2012: 2 / T4 2011: 1 / T5 2010: T5 / 1 2009: T2 / T5 2008: 5 / 1 So the AFC North had a top 3 division 5 times, and finished last or tied for last 1 time So the NFC South had a top 3 division 4 times and finished last or tied for last 0 times. And as a reminder, the AFC East, the "weakest division," had a top 3 division *6 times and finished last or tied for last 1 time. *not 7 like previously stated, found an error in 2009, they were 4th, not 3rd So according to the numbers, the AFC East had the better teams more often over the last 12 years than the NFC West, NFC South, and AFC North. Well I guess having the Browns in the same division would diminish the average winning percentage of any division. ☹️ Oh no doubt. Every division has a door mat. In some divisions the door mat changes year to year. Doesn't change the fact that Brady has consistently had to beat a better division than (so far) the AFC North, NFC South, and the NFC West. 0-3. Would you care to take another guess? Surely there must be A division that has consistently been tougher than the AFC LEast?
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Post by movieliker on Mar 18, 2020 23:50:02 GMT
AFC North/NFC South ranking (out of 8) 2019: 7 / T5 2018: T1 / 6 2017: 8 / 1 2016: 5 / T3 2015: 6 / 5 2014: 1 / 7 2013: 4 / 6 2012: 2 / T4 2011: 1 / T5 2010: T5 / 1 2009: T2 / T5 2008: 5 / 1 So the AFC North had a top 3 division 5 times, and finished last or tied for last 1 time So the NFC South had a top 3 division 4 times and finished last or tied for last 0 times. And as a reminder, the AFC East, the "weakest division," had a top 3 division *6 times and finished last or tied for last 1 time. *not 7 like previously stated, found an error in 2009, they were 4th, not 3rd So according to the numbers, the AFC East had the better teams more often over the last 12 years than the NFC West, NFC South, and AFC North. Well I guess having the Browns in the same division would diminish the average winning percentage of any division. ☹️ Everybody knows the AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL. Patriot fans are just in denial. You're wasting your time with hehatesshe. He would deny the Earth was round if it meant the Patriots weren't superhuman.
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 18, 2020 23:57:08 GMT
Well I guess having the Browns in the same division would diminish the average winning percentage of any division. ☹️ Everybody knows the AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL. Patriot fans are just in denial. You're wasting your time with hehatesshe. He would deny the Earth was round if it meant the Patriots weren't superhuman. You would deny the Sun rises in the east but be to lazy to see for yourself!!! My numbers are indisputable. That's why y'all don't even try.
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Post by movieliker on Mar 18, 2020 23:59:19 GMT
Everybody knows the AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL. Patriot fans are just in denial. You're wasting your time with hehatesshe. He would deny the Earth was round if it meant the Patriots weren't superhuman. You would deny the Sun rises in the east but be to lazy to see for yourself!!! My number are indisputable. That's why y'all don't even try. Tsk, tsk, tsk . . . So pathetic. 6 championships isn't enough? Wow
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 19, 2020 0:19:29 GMT
You would deny the Sun rises in the east but be to lazy to see for yourself!!! My number are indisputable. That's why y'all don't even try. Tsk, tsk, tsk . . . So pathetic. 6 championships isn't enough? Wow Championships are already won. No, it is spreading the truth now that interest me, and combating fake news and fact-less gut-feelings.
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Post by movieliker on Mar 19, 2020 0:35:09 GMT
Tsk, tsk, tsk . . . So pathetic. 6 championships isn't enough? Wow Championships are already won. No, it is spreading the truth now that interest me, and combating fake news and fact-less gut-feelings. The AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL for decades. And the Patriots have benefited from that. Those are facts. That is the truth. And you bending and spinning obscure statistics isn't going to change anybody's mind.
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 19, 2020 0:51:46 GMT
Championships are already won. No, it is spreading the truth now that interest me, and combating fake news and fact-less gut-feelings. The AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL for decades. And the Patriots have benefited from that. Those are facts. That is the truth. And you bending and spinning obscure statistics isn't going to change anybody's mind. Then why, dear baby Jesus why, do MiamiNJYBuffalo have more wins the past 12 seasons (258 total) than the other 7 division's non- division winners??? AFC North - 245 AFC South - 230 AFC East - 258 AFC West - 243 NFC North - 250 NFC South - 219 NFC East - 249 NFC West - 239 If you go by wins, the Patriots have actually had the HARDEST division the past 12 years, because the teams that don't win the AFC East have combined for the most wins over the last 12 years. Look for yourself (I know you won't.) Count up the MiamiNJYBuffalo wins for the past 12 years. Compare that with the win totals of all the other non-division winners for each division, for each year. You won't, BECAUSE THE TRUTH SCARES YOU!!! Lol. Obscure statistics. Like wins and losses. LOL
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Post by President Ackbar™ on Mar 19, 2020 0:55:06 GMT
The AFC East has been the doormat of the NFL for decades. And the Patriots have benefited from that. Those are facts. That is the truth. And you bending and spinning obscure statistics isn't going to change anybody's mind. Then why, dear baby Jesus
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Mar 19, 2020 1:58:30 GMT
And the Jets went to the AFC Championship twice in a row, while the Patriots kept on posting winning seasons. The NFC South takes turns having 6-10 seasons while the bum of the month makes a Super Bowl (and loses to the Patriots) every ten years and immediately sinks back into mediocrity. I posted the Patriots record vs. the NFC South in a previous post. That says it all. There's no way around it, which is why you chose not to address it. Look at those numbers along with their overall winning percentage in and out of the division since 2003. Case closed. Case isn't closed though, my dude. All you managed to do was continue to address the points I was already agreeing with you about. Yes, the Patriots have lost to the teams in their division, yes, the Patriots have a great record against pretty much every other team in the NFL, yes yes yes, it's all true. You're a genius Boston sports fan and we all should bow to how superior you are to the rest of us. Because you've spent decades defending your Pats, you're some kind of master at making arguments for why the Patriots are the greatest dynasty and why Tom Brady is the greatest QB in NFL history. BUT what in the holy fuck was the other AFC east teams' records against the other teams in the NFL? Not very good, right? Not being able to beat teams outside of ones division does tend to prevent a team from having much success and getting to the post season. You can have a team have a good record against another team in their division, but have a pretty lousy overall record against other teams outside their division. In case you don't remember, the other teams in the AFC East don't only play teams in their division. What does that have to do with anything at all? You said they benefit from playing in a weak division, and I proved they don't. Now you're asking what the AFC East's record is outside of its own division? That isn't moving the goal post, that's changing the field. The other team's success outside of its division has no bearing on what the Patriots are doing. The winning percentage is almost identical across the board for the Pats, so clearly the division is irrelevant. You've admitted as much in this post, now to save face you're shifting into some random argument about how the Jets do outside of their division.
Nobody is bent out of shape, get over yourself. I get a kick out of casual fans making excuses for the Patriots' success, and the alternative is talking about coronavirus.
Here's a recap of this conversation:
You: "The Patriots benefit from a weak division."
Me: "No they don't, here's proof."
You: "That's all true, but how about the Bills outside of their division? Talk about a non sequitur, right? Also, why are you replying to me with facts and stuff? Just let me make shit up and call it a night. If you reply to me with anything more than incoherent babble, you must be 'bent out of shape.'"
Good stuff. I'll let you know when I get 'bent out of shape.' You let me know when you come up with some numbers that show how easy it is to go to five super bowls and win three of them. (This decade only, right?)
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Post by 尺ロㄈにモイ州凡几 on Mar 19, 2020 3:19:11 GMT
Case isn't closed though, my dude. All you managed to do was continue to address the points I was already agreeing with you about. Yes, the Patriots have lost to the teams in their division, yes, the Patriots have a great record against pretty much every other team in the NFL, yes yes yes, it's all true. You're a genius Boston sports fan and we all should bow to how superior you are to the rest of us. Because you've spent decades defending your Pats, you're some kind of master at making arguments for why the Patriots are the greatest dynasty and why Tom Brady is the greatest QB in NFL history. BUT what in the holy fuck was the other AFC east teams' records against the other teams in the NFL? Not very good, right? Not being able to beat teams outside of ones division does tend to prevent a team from having much success and getting to the post season. You can have a team have a good record against another team in their division, but have a pretty lousy overall record against other teams outside their division. In case you don't remember, the other teams in the AFC East don't only play teams in their division. What does that have to do with anything at all? What do you mean what does that have to do with anything? It has to do with talking about a team's record against other teams outside its division. You really didn't. You just said that the teams in the AFC East have beat the Patriots numerous times, as if divisional match-ups don't often produce close games and upsets. I mean, the Browns were one of the two teams to beat the Ravens last year but does that mean the Browns weren't a bad team last year? Actually, it isn't. It's an attempt to examine how other teams in the same division fare against teams outside the division. Determining how two teams in a division that are tied in record get the division win sometimes come down to how they fared in common games or games against conference opponents. If say the Jets and Patriots had 11-5 records, the Patriots went 5-1 in the division but 7-3 elsewhere, and the Jets went 5-1 in the division but 6-4 elsewhere, the Patriots get the division. The records of the other teams in the division against other teams in the NFL matters. You keep talking about how the Patriots fare against the division and teams outside of it, and the average win-loss record of the division as a whole compared to the other divisions in the NFL, but you're not looking at how the other teams in the division did when pitted against the other teams in the NFL. Not sure if I already asked this, and not going to bother to looking through the thread to see if I did, but if a team goes 4-2 in the division and 3-7 elsewhere, were they really that good of a team? Your previous post suggests otherwise. But if you haven't gotten bent out of shape, then good for you. Except I'm not a casual fan. I just think there's more to the success of dynasties than they were just so goddamn good. There's more to it than that. There always is. But that one post of yours where you kept asking "care to explain....?" like some smart ass know it all kinda seemed like the first signs of someone getting bent out of shape. I know you don't see it as that, but trust me, everyone else has. It isn't easy. Never said it was. You, however, are suggesting that the reason for the Patriots success comes from nothing more than their focus, determination, and having the great QB of all time. The reality is so much has to go right for teams to be dominate for as long as the Patriots have. And it did help that they played in a division with the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins.
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 19, 2020 5:20:09 GMT
What does that have to do with anything at all? What do you mean what does that have to do with anything? It has to do with talking about a team's record against other teams outside its division. And it did help that they played in a division with the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins. Except, of course, for the fact that MiamiNYJBuffalo had the most wins of all non-division winners over the last 12 Years.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Mar 19, 2020 12:28:49 GMT
Not sure if I already asked this, and not going to bother to looking through the thread to see if I did, but if a team goes 4-2 in the division and 3-7 elsewhere, were they really that good of a team? Let's go over this one more time because the point seems to have gone completely over your head. I didn't say the Dolphins in any given year were a good team. I don't care about the Dolphins. The comment I responded to was, "The Patriots have benefitted greatly from playing in a weak division." The information I posted proves this false beyond the shadow of a doubt. First, the Pats lose games to their division foes frequently. How is that helping them? Secondly, they beat teams from every other division in football at the same clip they beat division foes. So again, how is their division helping them? What difference does it make when they beat everyone in the NFL at the same rate? You've never been able to come up with an answer to that question and you never will. I was being deliberately obnoxious in that previous post because I knew you wouldn't have an answer. Because the facts prove your commentary dead wrong. Facts that I bothered researching as opposed to making inane observations from afar. You keep talking in circles because you have no argument. You're like a replicant from Westworld following the same 'generic internet guy' routine. Step 1: Make an uneducated observation on any given topic. Step 2: Once someone shows up who is more knowledgeable than you on said topic, backtrack/deflect/hastily change your argument/ask the other guy why he's taking things so seriously. I could ask you why you felt it necessary to chop up my post and respond to certain aspects of it line by line; that seems a little OCD. Are you getting bent out of shape? Or maybe we're just having a conversation. I can't help it if you misread the inflection in my posts. When I want to emphasize something, I'll use italics or bold font. You can talk about how lousy the Bills have been over the years to your heart's content, I'm not going to argue that. I don't need you to agree Brady is the GOAT, I don't care if the Patriots are 'the greatest team ever,' those things are up for debate and could be a fun conversation, but there's no definitive answer that can be proven by any metric. But the Patriots 'benefitting from a weak division' is a factually inaccurate statement, and when you make those on the internet, someone is usually there to call you on your bullshit. Also, shoutout to movieliker for following his subroutine. i.e., Make ignorant comment; quickly shift into 'casual trolling mode' once he realizes he can't defend his stance. You keep doing you.
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Post by sdm3 on Mar 19, 2020 13:06:54 GMT
Yeah, but the Patriots only won because of their weak division lol.
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Post by FrankSobotka1514 on Mar 19, 2020 13:17:00 GMT
Reports say that the Eagles traded a 3 and 5 to the Lions for CB Darius Slay. Hope he’s better than Nnamdi Asomugha.
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Post by hehatesshe on Mar 19, 2020 19:48:21 GMT
Todd Gurley...CUT
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Post by movieliker on Mar 19, 2020 20:03:17 GMT
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Post by tristramshandy on Mar 19, 2020 20:34:36 GMT
Coming late to the easy AFC East division argument. I think there are two reasons why that is thought.
#1: Since 2010, the AFC East has had just four wild card teams, and two of them have been pretty awful (2016 Dolphins and 2017 Bills). Six teams that didn't make the playoffs in the AFC had a better point differential than the Dolphins did in 2016 and the 2017 Ravens had a 149 point better +/- differential than the 2018 Bills had. So in large part it has been recency bias. There hasn't been a really good second AFC East team since those two Mark Sanchez-Jets teams that went to the AFC Championship game.
#2: Since 2001, these are the three best AFC East quarterbacks by passer rating for the other three teams:
Jets - Chad Pennington Bills - Kyle Orton Dolphins - Chad Pennington
The lack of even a low-level All Pro AFC East QB in Brady's 19 years makes the other teams seem less potent.
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Post by 尺ロㄈにモイ州凡几 on Mar 19, 2020 20:58:20 GMT
Not sure if I already asked this, and not going to bother to looking through the thread to see if I did, but if a team goes 4-2 in the division and 3-7 elsewhere, were they really that good of a team? Let's go over this one more time because the point seems to have gone completely over your head. I didn't say the Dolphins in any given year were a good team. I don't care about the Dolphins. The comment I responded to was, "The Patriots have benefitted greatly from playing in a weak division." The information I posted proves this false beyond the shadow of a doubt. All the information you posted was (to summarize) the Patriots have lost to the other teams in their division. So because teams in their division have beat them before, that means the division isn't weak? Alright. Because. The. Other. Teams. In. The. Division. Don't. Usually. Beat. Other. Teams. In. Other. Divisions. Jesus. A lot of words to say you had a mini meltdown, mate. And I did research too, my man. Fuckin saw that the rest of the AFC East doesn't fare well against other teams in the NFL. Really didn't have to do much research into that, though. You do realize win-loss records against common opponents and overall win-loss records do count towards getting a division title, right? *in nerdy voice* Well actually, the robots in Westworld aren't replicants, they're hosts. Replicants are from Blade Runner. Seems like someone with a Blade Runner avatar would know that. *pushes up think rim nerd glasses* You're talking in circles too, my friend. Both of us are just making the same point over and over again without making any headway. I stayed on topic, though. I'm still on topic. Didn't really think that me pointing out how you were/are experiencing a mild case of the meltdowns was going to turn into you bringing it up in every single reply, claiming that I merely said that in some attempt to cause a diversion or something. I mean, I did say it to get under your skin a bit because I'm a prick, but I still am on topic. Yes. IM GETTING REALLY BENT OUT OF SHAPE AND IF I DONT CALM DOWN SOON IM GOING TO START BEATING SOME ASS!!!1 Even though it's not really inaccurate. But you don't want to agree with it, so whatever.
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Post by DrKrippen on Mar 19, 2020 21:41:04 GMT
Guess they couldn't trade him.
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