5hole
Sophomore
I'm balls deep in this omelette
@5hole
Posts: 919
Likes: 199
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Post by 5hole on Mar 16, 2020 5:05:47 GMT
1st episode did not disappoint...
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Post by President Ackbar™ on Mar 16, 2020 5:08:38 GMT
What a gorgeously shot show.
Shame they can't get the story to flow smoothly.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Mar 16, 2020 7:59:47 GMT
Is it still as disgustingly dumb as the first two seasons? People thinking they "live forever" by making copies of themselves, seriously.
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Post by poelzig on Mar 16, 2020 8:29:16 GMT
Is it still as disgustingly dumb as the first two seasons? People thinking they "live forever" by making copies of themselves, seriously. It may be hard to top the pretentious self indulgent wheel spinning pointlessness of season 2 but as for disgustingly dumb I have 2 words for you. Nazi World.
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 17, 2020 9:36:41 GMT
Yeah I was hearing some mixed stuff about the show leaving the parks and going into the real world but I really liked the episode. I'm far more interested about Dolores in the real world than Maeve in Warworld so far.
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Post by bluerisk on Mar 17, 2020 19:43:06 GMT
It was good, but the entire Aaaron Paul arc and character sucks big time. And it also make no sense. They can blast an ATM machine without covering there faces - and for cash. I guess if there is cash left at all, it will be by then all registered bills. The level of surveillance is also a huge issue. Even by today's standards it guarantees you a place in a prison cell.
Or how she or Bernard can move that freely in this world...especially considering border and airport security checks (=> x-ray scanner etc. pp.).
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5hole
Sophomore
I'm balls deep in this omelette
@5hole
Posts: 919
Likes: 199
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Post by 5hole on Mar 17, 2020 21:38:59 GMT
Is it still as disgustingly dumb as the first two seasons? People thinking they "live forever" by making copies of themselves, seriously. Strange how some people focus their complaints on the 1% of series that are worth watching while ignoring the 99% of total sh*t.
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 17, 2020 23:11:17 GMT
It was good, but the entire Aaaron Paul arc and character sucks big time. And it also make no sense. They can blast an ATM machine without covering there faces - and for cash. I guess if there is cash left at all, it will be by then all registered bills. The level of surveillance is also a huge issue. Even by today's standards it guarantees you a place in a prison cell. Or how she or Bernard can move that freely in this world...especially considering border and airport security checks (=> x-ray scanner etc. pp.). Caleb did the job with a guy that had a program that disabled all cameras. It was said in the episode. As for the X-Ray, my understanding is that modern hosts are built with materials that emulate flesh and bone unlike the old ones that have mechanical parts.
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Post by CoolJGS☺ on Mar 18, 2020 0:57:28 GMT
Yeah I was hearing some mixed stuff about the show leaving the parks and going into the real world but I really liked the episode. I'm far more interested about Dolores in the real world than Maeve in Warworld so far. I'm missing Mauve. I've always liked her and her arc more than Dolores'. The first episode was very interesting as it built the world up some more. This is one of the best shows at worldbuilding and each season has expanded that world in a very interesting way.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Mar 18, 2020 4:53:28 GMT
Is it still as disgustingly dumb as the first two seasons? People thinking they "live forever" by making copies of themselves, seriously. Strange how some people focus their complaints on the 1% of series that are worth watching while ignoring the 99% of total sh*t. The series is not worth watching, no matter how much junk there is elsewhere. I don't watch that junk either. Westworld impresses the half smart. It had a nice riddle character for the first half of it's first season, even though I felt a strong urge to quit watching the moment they had Dolores speak of freedom at the beginning of what I think was the 4th episode already. The thing has always been nonsense, it just kept getting worse as it went along, then became outright disgusting.
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 18, 2020 9:49:30 GMT
Strange how some people focus their complaints on the 1% of series that are worth watching while ignoring the 99% of total sh*t. The series is not worth watching, no matter how much junk there is elsewhere. I don't watch that junk either. Westworld impresses the half smart. It had a nice riddle character for the first half of it's first season, even though I felt a strong urge to quit watching the moment they had Dolores speak of freedom at the beginning of what I think was the 4th episode already. The thing has always been nonsense, it just kept getting worse as it went along, then became outright disgusting. I take it you're not a fan of stories common in science fiction about AI gaining self awareness.
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Post by Leo of Red Keep on Mar 18, 2020 12:10:07 GMT
The series is not worth watching, no matter how much junk there is elsewhere. I don't watch that junk either. Westworld impresses the half smart. It had a nice riddle character for the first half of it's first season, even though I felt a strong urge to quit watching the moment they had Dolores speak of freedom at the beginning of what I think was the 4th episode already. The thing has always been nonsense, it just kept getting worse as it went along, then became outright disgusting. I take it you're not a fan of stories common in science fiction about AI gaining self awareness. The subject itself is not the issue. The basic logic of the whole thing is at stake. Dolores being shown as using a consciousness she did not yet have, speaking of a wish for freedom she could not comprehend, was a first red flag. There were many more in the following episodes. Maeve walking around unhindered with Felix in the 6th was another alarm bell. It told of some major contrivance taking place for the sake of the action to come. As if Ford was secretly watching over it all and arranging for it to happen. Shortly thereafter, the cartoon cats at the bottom of the hierarchy, whose job it was only to clean and repair "killed" hosts, were able to alter Maeve in ways that fundamentally changed her, disrupting her storyline without having to ask for permission or anyone being notified of it. But the big fuck-up was when Bernard was revealed as a host. It was not a surprise because the Internet had somehow puzzled clues to it, yet it made the whole worldbuilding fall down by contradicting itself. We had been told and shown how intensive training hosts had to be, yet were to believe that a copy of Arnold had been made to such perfection on the side no one ever noticed. The next season would "explain" this by showing Dolores as the maker, the same one who was still somehow struggling within her loops and being interrogated by Security Stubs outside of them. Rules had been set only to be thrown away for the sake of twists. The intricate story had turned into the proverbial game of chess with a pigeon who kicks down pieces, shits on the board and claims to have won. All that remained at this point was violence, skin and music. I liked the music. By the end of the 7th episode, there was no point trying to piece things together anymore. The William twist had also been guessed and while the look, behaviour and speech of both actors made it implausible, it was yet to be. After all, it would be more of a Big Shocking Twist ® if it made less sense. At least some similarity in the person would have been needed. Now, it seems they did it again in the 2nd season, with Dolores acting just like the person she was not and could not possibly know. When I see people complain about the "masterpiece" of the 1st season not being renewed in the 2nd, I wonder what they understood of it. I saw someone speculate that some re-writing took place after the first half of the 1st season, explaining how things went to junk in the 2nd half. I believe that. There's a long burial of the 2nd season too:
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Post by bluerisk on Mar 18, 2020 15:02:34 GMT
It was good, but the entire Aaaron Paul arc and character sucks big time. And it also make no sense. They can blast an ATM machine without covering there faces - and for cash. I guess if there is cash left at all, it will be by then all registered bills. The level of surveillance is also a huge issue. Even by today's standards it guarantees you a place in a prison cell. Or how she or Bernard can move that freely in this world...especially considering border and airport security checks (=> x-ray scanner etc. pp.). Caleb did the job with a guy that had a program that disabled all cameras. It was said in the episode. As for the X-Ray, my understanding is that modern hosts are built with materials that emulate flesh and bone unlike the old ones that have mechanical parts. As it was that easy, more so since this super AI is said to be in charge of everything.
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Honolulu
Sophomore
@jrvarsityrules
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Post by Honolulu on Mar 26, 2020 8:43:00 GMT
I have not been able to see any episodes of this current season. I'm not sure if it is worth getting HBO just for that show. Nothing else on HBO interests me at all.
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Post by kuatorises on Mar 30, 2020 15:27:40 GMT
I'm still trying to get used to it being in the real world. Not sure how I feel about that. I will say that part of it has made Delores interesting again. She was great in season 1 and spent all of season 2 just walking around killing people. The first half of season 2 suffered greatly. It was just her walking around shooting people. I think she even betrayed her own allies. No character development. Season 2 finished off strong though imo. I wonder if anyone will ever call out Delores' hypocrisy? She uses "people" all the time. Would be interesting to see her get challenged on that. I want to know who the other hosts are she took from the park. Speaking of which, I think Hale will turn on Delores. It was great to see Maeve again, but I was a little put off by her whole not caring about humans statement. Between Lee and the two tech dudes, I thought it was established she was ok with some people? Not a fan of not showing William yet.
The music in last night's episode was so loud I had to turn on closed captioning.
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5hole
Sophomore
I'm balls deep in this omelette
@5hole
Posts: 919
Likes: 199
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Post by 5hole on Mar 30, 2020 21:05:57 GMT
Episodes 2 and 3 not nearly as good. #Disappointing
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 31, 2020 11:30:15 GMT
Caleb did the job with a guy that had a program that disabled all cameras. It was said in the episode. As for the X-Ray, my understanding is that modern hosts are built with materials that emulate flesh and bone unlike the old ones that have mechanical parts. As it was that easy, more so since this super AI is said to be in charge of everything. The super AI isn't in charge of everything.
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 31, 2020 12:01:43 GMT
I take it you're not a fan of stories common in science fiction about AI gaining self awareness. The subject itself is not the issue. The basic logic of the whole thing is at stake. Dolores being shown as using a consciousness she did not yet have, speaking of a wish for freedom she could not comprehend, was a first red flag. There were many more in the following episodes. Maeve walking around unhindered with Felix in the 6th was another alarm bell. It told of some major contrivance taking place for the sake of the action to come. As if Ford was secretly watching over it all and arranging for it to happen. Shortly thereafter, the cartoon cats at the bottom of the hierarchy, whose job it was only to clean and repair "killed" hosts, were able to alter Maeve in ways that fundamentally changed her, disrupting her storyline without having to ask for permission or anyone being notified of it. But the big fuck-up was when Bernard was revealed as a host. It was not a surprise because the Internet had somehow puzzled clues to it, yet it made the whole worldbuilding fall down by contradicting itself. We had been told and shown how intensive training hosts had to be, yet were to believe that a copy of Arnold had been made to such perfection on the side no one ever noticed. The next season would "explain" this by showing Dolores as the maker, the same one who was still somehow struggling within her loops and being interrogated by Security Stubs outside of them. Rules had been set only to be thrown away for the sake of twists. The intricate story had turned into the proverbial game of chess with a pigeon who kicks down pieces, shits on the board and claims to have won. All that remained at this point was violence, skin and music. I liked the music. By the end of the 7th episode, there was no point trying to piece things together anymore. The William twist had also been guessed and while the look, behaviour and speech of both actors made it implausible, it was yet to be. After all, it would be more of a Big Shocking Twist ® if it made less sense. At least some similarity in the person would have been needed. Now, it seems they did it again in the 2nd season, with Dolores acting just like the person she was not and could not possibly know. When I see people complain about the "masterpiece" of the 1st season not being renewed in the 2nd, I wonder what they understood of it. I saw someone speculate that some re-writing took place after the first half of the 1st season, explaining how things went to junk in the 2nd half. I believe that. There's a long burial of the 2nd season too: As explained in the TV show, they established that the path to artificial conciousness isn't a straight line or a pyramid but journey inwards. Like a maze. She was talking about freedom when she was attaining conciousness. I don't exactly know what part are you talking about Dolores talking about freedom but Dolores was achieving conciousness even before Arnold's death. That's why he killed himself in order to try to shutdown the park. A Westworld tech walking around with a host in a place where Westworld techs were walking around with hosts wouldn't wouldn't be a redflag. And yes, Ford programmed her to escape because Maeve was his favorite host and she was on the path to conciousness even before the current events. At least since William killed her daughter. Plus the reason why they were able to alter Maeve was because Felix had stolen a control tablet before when he was trying to work with a host bird. The Arnold/Bernard part is hardly contradictory. Even before the reveal that Arnold was a host, it was revealed that Ford had been building hosts on the side. Like his host "father" and version of himself as a child. And it wasn't quickly. Arnold died 30 years before the events of the first episode. Host Bernard was completed ten years after Arnold's death with Dolores helping him achieving fidelity. So yeah it's pretty plausible that no one that knew Bernard was the same as Arnold. My biggest beef with the William reveal is that they purposely cheated the audience with using de-aging for a young Robert Ford but using another actor to play a young William. This could've been avoided if they used another actor to play young Robert Ford. And before de-aging was common, younger versions of older characters were played with other actors in tv shows and movies. Speech and behaviour were often overlooked. I also think they didn't gave the actors a full picture of what character they were playing so Jimmy Simpson didn't know he was playing the young Man in Black. In the second season, there is a clear attempt of Jimmy Simpson to look more like young Man in Black. I've often hear people complaining about how Westworld is going to turn into another Lost but in my view there is a clear difference between the two. Both the first and second season went with the mystery box but Westworld reveals most of the major mysteries at the end of season. That's why I never understood the complains about the second season. The first season tries to actually deceive the audience with multiple timelines hidden. The second season is pretty clear. There are two main timelines. One taking place after Dolores kills Ford and another taking place 11 days after that event. The finale brings the two timelines together. Lost on the other had had mysteries that lasted the entire show.
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Post by Winter_King on Mar 31, 2020 12:10:37 GMT
I'm still trying to get used to it being in the real world. Not sure how I feel about that. I will say that part of it has made Delores interesting again. She was great in season 1 and spent all of season 2 just walking around killing people. The first half of season 2 suffered greatly. It was just her walking around shooting people. I think she even betrayed her own allies. No character development. Season 2 finished off strong though imo. I wonder if anyone will ever call out Delores' hypocrisy? She uses "people" all the time. Would be interesting to see her get challenged on that. I want to know who the other hosts are she took from the park. Speaking of which, I think Hale will turn on Delores. It was great to see Maeve again, but I was a little put off by her whole not caring about humans statement. Between Lee and the two tech dudes, I thought it was established she was ok with some people? Not a fan of not showing William yet.
The music in last night's episode was so loud I had to turn on closed captioning.
They called Dolores hypocrisy in the second season already. When she was talking about freedom while pretty much taking the freedom away from Teddy and being against the choice that the hosts made of going to the Valley Beyond. I'm actually more curious to see what host is in Hale's body. I've seen a theory that Wyatt persona in is the body of Dolores while the Dolores "farmer's daughter" is in Hale body. There are a few problems with this theory so I guess we'll have to see it if it's true. Another thing that caught up my attention and it does sound like a plot hole is that they seem to imply that Dolores made a Hale host when she was in the house that Arnold built. But in season 2, Dolores escaped Westworld within a Hale host. So there was no need of building a new Charlotte Hale body. Yeah I was hoping to see Ed Harris in this episode. Dolores said to Hale that she needed to visit an old friend. I get the feeling she was talking about William. Anyway, like the previous seasons we'll have to wait for the finale to see how everthing fits.
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Post by bluerisk on Mar 31, 2020 14:32:42 GMT
As it was that easy, more so since this super AI is said to be in charge of everything. The super AI isn't in charge of everything. Tell that to Caleb, and any other human whose live is programmed by this AI. Marriage no recommended, children not approved... Maybe realizing that humans and machines (hosts) are trapped alike by the elite is the next step in Dolores' evolution, and her plan is no longer to destroy humanity.
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