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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 0:01:52 GMT
In no particular order, here are mine.
Superman: He's the original. He's the classic. Salt-of-the-earth boy finds out he's a person who can save the world. Our symbol of hope.
Batman: The opposite of Superman. The guy is a total psycho, but it works. He's a ninja-detective who beats the piss out of the strangest criminals you've ever seen. And the kicker is that most of these criminals exist because this ninja-detective decided to dress up like a bat. None of it makes sense, but all of it is awesome.
Wonder Woman: #ImWithHer (or whatever).
Spider-Man: He's a kid. He's your standard comic book reader. Poor and young. They can relate. It's brilliant.
Professor X: Inspired by a civil rights leader, and giving the handicapped a hero of their own. A physically weak man also happens to have the most powerful mind on the planet. In all seriousness, this is brilliant. He's like the Stephen Hawking of the Marvel Universe. And there's also the added twist that he's a complete badass.
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Post by twothousandonemark on Apr 29, 2017 4:21:51 GMT
Superman
Batman
Spiderman
Wonder Woman
Wolverine
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 4:27:53 GMT
In no particular order, here are mine. Superman: He's the original. He's the classic. Salt-of-the-earth boy finds out he's a person who can save the world. Our symbol of hope. Batman: The opposite of Superman. The guy is a total psycho, but it works. He's a ninja-detective who beats the piss out of the strangest criminals you've ever seen. And the kicker is that most of these criminals exist because this ninja-detective decided to dress up like a bat. None of it makes sense, but all of it is awesome. Wonder Woman: #ImWithHer (or whatever). Spider-Man: He's a kid. He's your standard comic book reader. Poor and young. They can relate. It's brilliant. Professor X: Inspired by a civil rights leader, and giving the handicapped a hero of their own. A physically weak man also happens to have the most powerful mind on the planet. In all seriousness, this is brilliant. He's like the Stephen Hawking of the Marvel Universe. And there's also the added twist that he's a complete badass. I'm not sure your "conceptual" list is any different than your "superficial" list, so why the distinction? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 5:42:13 GMT
In no particular order, here are mine. Superman: He's the original. He's the classic. Salt-of-the-earth boy finds out he's a person who can save the world. Our symbol of hope. Batman: The opposite of Superman. The guy is a total psycho, but it works. He's a ninja-detective who beats the piss out of the strangest criminals you've ever seen. And the kicker is that most of these criminals exist because this ninja-detective decided to dress up like a bat. None of it makes sense, but all of it is awesome. Wonder Woman: #ImWithHer (or whatever). Spider-Man: He's a kid. He's your standard comic book reader. Poor and young. They can relate. It's brilliant. Professor X: Inspired by a civil rights leader, and giving the handicapped a hero of their own. A physically weak man also happens to have the most powerful mind on the planet. In all seriousness, this is brilliant. He's like the Stephen Hawking of the Marvel Universe. And there's also the added twist that he's a complete badass. I'm not sure your "conceptual" list is any different than your "superficial" list, so why the distinction? What's my superficial list? |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 5:46:57 GMT
I'm not sure your "conceptual" list is any different than your "superficial" list, so why the distinction? What's my superficial list? If I asked somebody to name 5 famous super heroes they're about as likely to list the 5 you have as any, so I'm asking what makes your list conceptual. It just seems pretty standard.
I mean Superman isn't my symbol of hope, like you stated, he's a just a boring generic character if you ask me.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 6:31:49 GMT
What's my superficial list? If I asked somebody to name 5 famous super heroes they're about as likely to list the 5 you have as any, so I'm asking what makes your list conceptual. It just seems pretty standard.
I mean Superman isn't my symbol of hope, like you stated, he's a just a boring generic character if you ask me.
You can pick whichever characters you want. Go for it. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2017 7:52:28 GMT
Hulk
Batman
Spider-man
Scarlett Witch
Superman
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Post by janice on Apr 29, 2017 8:26:37 GMT
In no particular order, here are mine. Superman: He's the original. He's the classic. Salt-of-the-earth boy finds out he's a person who can save the world. Our symbol of hope. Not anymore!!! Snyder destroyed that symbol of hope. Now he is a spokesperson for Depression and PTSD. |
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 14:20:53 GMT
1. Batman
2. Spider-Man
3. The X-Men
4. Everyone else not in the MCU
5. The losers and jobbers and general mid-card roster Disney got stuck with when they thought they were acquiring the Marvel anyone gave two shits about and somehow managed to dupe morons into paying money to see because Joss Whedon explained comic books to some executive at some point
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 14:23:27 GMT
What's my superficial list? If I asked somebody to name 5 famous super heroes they're about as likely to list the 5 you have as any, so I'm asking what makes your list conceptual. It just seems pretty standard.
I mean Superman isn't my symbol of hope, like you stated, he's a just a boring generic character if you ask me.
It doesn't matter if you think he's boring or generic. I do too. But he is The guy. He has always been The Guy. He will always be The Guy. He is the Hogan. He is the Babe Ruth. He is more important than any other super hero, culturally and historically, combined. Except maybe (probably) Batman. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 16:19:02 GMT
If I asked somebody to name 5 famous super heroes they're about as likely to list the 5 you have as any, so I'm asking what makes your list conceptual. It just seems pretty standard.
I mean Superman isn't my symbol of hope, like you stated, he's a just a boring generic character if you ask me.
It doesn't matter if you think he's boring or generic. I do too. But he is The guy. He has always been The Guy. He will always be The Guy. He is the Hogan. He is the Babe Ruth. He is more important than any other super hero, culturally and historically, combined. Except maybe (probably) Batman. I really don't think he is. He was the guy but he barely outsells Thor now, much less Captain America, or Spiderman, Iron Man, Batman, etc. Baby Groot is going to crush him in toy sales. I don't see how he's the guy honestly. I think he's clearly not. |
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 16:25:43 GMT
It doesn't matter if you think he's boring or generic. I do too. But he is The guy. He has always been The Guy. He will always be The Guy. He is the Hogan. He is the Babe Ruth. He is more important than any other super hero, culturally and historically, combined. Except maybe (probably) Batman. I really don't think he is. He was the guy but he barely outsells Thor now, much less Captain America, or Spiderman, Iron Man, Batman, etc. Baby Groot is going to crush him in toy sales. I don't see how he's the guy honestly. I think he's clearly not. His iconic status transcends floppy sales. He is on another level, as are Batman and, to a lesser extent, Spider-Man. They can make ten shitty movies with these characters that all flop, and they'll keep making them in perpetuity. The first "off-brand" Marvel sequel to fail commercially may not be so fortunate. By "off-brand," I mean secondary/tertiary/non-Avengers. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 16:30:09 GMT
His iconic status transcends floppy sales. He is on another level, as are Batman and, to a lesser extent, Spider-Man. They can make ten shitty movies with these characters that all flop, and they'll keep making them in perpetuity. The first "off-brand" Marvel sequel to fail commercially may not be so fortunate. By "off-brand," I mean secondary/tertiary/non-Avengers. I hear what you're saying, but the word iconic can be used for lots of characters nobody cares about. Ronald McDonald is iconic. |
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Post by camimac on Apr 29, 2017 16:32:31 GMT
Superman, he's an icon. He is someone that most of us wish existed.
Batman, I think that one of the most amazing things about him is he has no superpowers. He's got guts, skills and all sorts of devices in his belt; and side kick Robin who has his back.
Thor, I've got to add him to the list because he has always been my favorite super hero.
Vision - artificial man, but yet so human.
Captain America!
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 16:33:26 GMT
His iconic status transcends floppy sales. He is on another level, as are Batman and, to a lesser extent, Spider-Man. They can make ten shitty movies with these characters that all flop, and they'll keep making them in perpetuity. The first "off-brand" Marvel sequel to fail commercially may not be so fortunate. By "off-brand," I mean secondary/tertiary/non-Avengers. I hear what you're saying, but the word iconic can be used for lots of characters nobody cares about. Ronald McDonald is iconic.  |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 16:38:32 GMT
I hear what you're saying, but the word iconic can be used for lots of characters nobody cares about. Ronald McDonald is iconic. Great POST!! lolol
"you're a McDonald, not a whore!" hilarious shit.
So I just find it amusing, especially when DC Fans will call their characters iconic as though that's the same thing as people caring about them. Captain America is also iconic, so is Spiderman, Hulk, Wolverine, etc. So are the Smurfs. The question isn't whether something is iconic, but whether anybody gives a damn, and for characters like Superman the answer is vastly less than they used to.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 16:49:12 GMT
Great POST!! lolol
"you're a McDonald, not a whore!" hilarious shit.
So I just find it amusing, especially when DC Fans will call their characters iconic as though that's the same thing as people caring about them. Captain America is also iconic, so is Spiderman, Hulk, Wolverine, etc. So are the Smurfs. The question isn't whether something is iconic, but whether anybody gives a damn, and for characters like Superman the answer is vastly less than they used to.
Sure. Fair/good point. But, I think the distinction I've been tryna draw is that Superman is uniquely able to rebound again and again. I remember people loving that dopey Lois and Clark show for a few years back in the 90s, then it went away; then Smallville, etc. There will probably always be a multitude of Superman (multi)media projects* in the works, and there have been for decades. That's simply not true for a lot of those other characters you mentioned. Right? *Apart from the comics. We both know all these characters have been continuously appearing in floppies forever. |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 17:13:18 GMT
Sure. Fair/good point. But, I think the distinction I've been tryna draw is that Superman is uniquely able to rebound again and again. I remember people loving that dopey Lois and Clark show for a few years back in the 90s, then it went away; then Smallville, etc. There will probably always be a multitude of Superman (multi)media projects* in the works, and there have been for decades. That's simply not true for a lot of those other characters you mentioned. Right? *Apart from the comics. We both know all these characters have been continuously appearing in floppies forever. I see what you're saying, but would ask, is it that unique?
First, has he rebounded? MOS was pretty derided. It got a lower rating than any MCU film and barely made more than Thor, so I don't know that it qualifies as a rebound. I would argue the last good Superman film was back with Superman 2. Smallville was only getting 3-4 million viewers, so it's not like it was a breakout show. For comparison, Daredevil gets that much and he hasn't been pushed publically or lived up nearly to the iconic level of Superman.
Second, Captain America has been tried before and now reused more successfully. Hulk had a long running TV show way back in the 70's and has been brought back. Punisher has been tried numerous times as far back as the 80's and has rebounded. Batman of course television to the 89 film to TDK.
So I don't really see Superman as particularly unique in that regard.
I think people tend to hang on his name. It's like we're supposed to think he's the guy, but nobody actually thinks he is.
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Post by coldenhaulfield on Apr 29, 2017 17:19:57 GMT
Sure. Fair/good point. But, I think the distinction I've been tryna draw is that Superman is uniquely able to rebound again and again. I remember people loving that dopey Lois and Clark show for a few years back in the 90s, then it went away; then Smallville, etc. There will probably always be a multitude of Superman (multi)media projects* in the works, and there have been for decades. That's simply not true for a lot of those other characters you mentioned. Right? *Apart from the comics. We both know all these characters have been continuously appearing in floppies forever. I see what you're saying, but would ask, is it that unique?
First, has he rebounded? MOS was pretty derided. It got a lower rating than any MCU film and barely made more than Thor, so I don't know that it qualifies as a rebound. I would argue the last good Superman film was back with Superman 2. Smallville was only getting 3-4 million viewers, so it's not like it was a breakout show. For comparison, Daredevil gets that much and he hasn't been pushed publically or lived up nearly to the iconic level of Superman.
Second, Captain America has been tried before and now reused more successfully. Hulk had a long running TV show way back in the 70's and has been brought back. Punisher has been tried numerous times as far back as the 80's and has rebounded. Batman of course television to the 89 film to TDK.
So I don't really see Superman as particularly unique in that regard.
I think people tend to hang on his name. It's like we're supposed to think he's the guy, but nobody actually thinks he is.
A lot of those are one-offs; the magnitude and multitude of Superman stuff over the long arc of filmic representation outweighs most of it combined, notwithstanding Batman. But I've always seen him as the Randy Savage to Superman's Hogan. So why are we wasting time talking about this and ignoring the pressing, burning question at the heart of the matter: then who would be the Ultimate Warrior?! |
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Post by ArArArchStanton on Apr 29, 2017 17:26:43 GMT
A lot of those are one-offs; the magnitude and multitude of Superman stuff over the long arc of filmic representation outweighs most of it combined, notwithstanding Batman. But I've always seen him as the Randy Savage to Superman's Hogan. So why are we wasting time talking about this and ignoring the pressing, burning question at the heart of the matter: then who would be the Ultimate Warrior?! Oh the Ultimate Warrior is tough, because it would have to be something that was intended to last a long time and then just fizzled out after a couple of years.
Do we have any candidates?
And just finishing up the Superman bit, I contend the continual push of him as "the guy" is just superficial. His appeal is generic, because he is generic, which is also why few really care and have a generic disposition towards him. They show up because everybody has this idea that it's supposed to be good, but it never is, because it's generic. The argument here is that vanilla ice cream is the best. Sure, yeah I guess.
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