thenolan
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Post by thenolan on May 25, 2020 10:19:19 GMT
I find it odd that it was marvel studios that told the least accurate spiderman story based on the comics. its not what I expected, i expected them to tell the most accurate story only very watered down because it is Disney.
for those of you who had high expectation for mcu spiderman, maybe in your ignorance higher than sam raimi movies. what are your feelings now seeing how mcu spiderman is seen as inferior to the raimi films and not even as brash as the Garfield movies.
Secondly is Andrew Garfield underrated?
He did have a loyal fan base, many spiderman fans loved garfield and emma and the peter and gwen romance. amazing spiderman 2 was shaky but I am sure if sony were to go back in time, they would have thought twice before sharing the rights with marvel.
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Post by poutinep on May 25, 2020 18:02:54 GMT
I expected Spider-Man to be awesome and he exceeded my expectations because the MCU is on an amazing hit streak.
garfield sucked, emma stone sucked, and she looks like she smells like cat piss.
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Post by onethreetwo on May 25, 2020 18:16:33 GMT
I liked Garfield. He's proven to be the better actor, but I've come around to Holland.
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Post by Archelaus on May 25, 2020 18:20:06 GMT
The MCU Spider-Man series is going along just fine, although I do prefer Sam Raimi's version. Tom Holland is great casting as Spider-Man and the villains have been pretty good. However, I didn't expect Spider-Man to be so heavily reliant on Tony Stark to make his suits, although he does prove his self-worth with his homemade suit in Homecoming. I especially don't like there hasn't been any direct reference to "Uncle Ben" Parker aside from his initials on a suitcase. Marvel doesn't want to retread familiar ground since this is the second reboot, but a little scene of Peter self-reflecting on him would be nice.
As for Andrew Garfield, he's probably underrated and despite his best efforts, he wasn't given great material to work with. He did do certain aspects of Spider-Man's character better than Tobey Maguire, but I didn't like his version of Peter Parker. He looked too old to be a high-school student and doesn't pass as being a nerd.
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Post by Deleted on May 25, 2020 18:29:15 GMT
Nothing much. I never even got around to the Andrew Garfield movies and wouldn't have with the MCU version if I didn't have to to follow the overall MCU plot. Personally, the two I think are best are Spiderman 2 and Into The Spiderverse. Andrew Garfield's movies were too soon after Spiderman 3. I wasn't even drawn to them from the ads.
I've come around to Tom Holland. He's an excellent Spiderman, though he came a bit late for me. He's really good. His chemistry with Stark, excellent. He also has a very child-like but proud 'I can rise to the occasion' chin-up posture that looks like Spiderman. It's a passing of the torch.
I'll say this about Tom Holland's Spiderman. His character is coming into his own in Spiderman: Far From Home, he really looks like he can grow into the role left by Stark, but thus far (for me) his best moments have all been in the Avengers/Civil War outings.
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Post by politicidal on May 25, 2020 22:48:50 GMT
The MCU Spider-Man series is going along just fine, although I do prefer Sam Raimi's version. Tom Holland is great casting as Spider-Man and the villains have been pretty good. However, I didn't expect Spider-Man to be so heavily reliant on Tony Stark to make his suits, although he does prove his self-worth with his homemade suit in Homecoming. I especially don't like there hasn't been any direct reference to "Uncle Ben" Parker aside from his initials on a suitcase. Marvel doesn't want to retread familiar ground since this is the second reboot, but a little scene of Peter self-reflecting on him would be nice. As for Andrew Garfield, he's probably underrated and despite his best efforts, he wasn't given great material to work with. He did do certain aspects of Spider-Man's character better than Tobey Maguire, but I didn't like his version of Peter Parker. He looked too old to be a high-school student and doesn't pass as being a nerd. Well said. Agreed wholeheartedly. I like Holland overall, but FFH had some very dumb moments for the sake of the plot. Garfield could had a decent run but Sony got too greedy. |
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Post by darkreviewer2013 on May 26, 2020 4:04:49 GMT
I haven't seen either of the MCU Spider-Man movies to date, so I can't comment on those. I am looking forward to checking them out soon though.
RE the Andrew Garfield films and his performance - I hated The Amazing Spider-Man. A premature reboot that re-told an origin story that had been mightily well-handled by Sam Raimi a decade earlier. Needlessly convoluted plotting made matters even worse. Garfield did nothing for me either, but I suspect the problem lay in the way the character was written. In fact, the only thing I did like about that entire film was Martin Sheen as Uncle Ben. I emphatically avoided the sequel.
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Post by hobowar on May 26, 2020 4:56:58 GMT
I expected to see Spider-Man interact with the rest of the Marvel universe and to be honest, they've played that down a little too much in my opinion.
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Post by bud47 on May 26, 2020 16:30:26 GMT
I expected a fresh, different take on the character that was still respectful to the spirit of the character, which is what we got. I also expected them to cast young because they understood that to properly build such an important character for the long term, they would have to cast someone that could play the role for years to come starting out as the young, naive, inexperienced high-school Peter Parker and growing into adulthood. Casting the young Tom Holland who has both charisma and acting chops was a smart move. I also expected to see the character interact with other Marvel characters. So far, they've delivered on every aspect and will likely continue to do so.
Not sure what you were expecting other than yet another rehash of what has already come before. If so, go watch the Raimi movies and be happy.
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Post by taylorfirst1 on May 26, 2020 17:07:13 GMT
I expected greatness and I got it.
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Post by dazz on May 26, 2020 18:25:11 GMT
I expected what we got, a reimagining of the character which follows the spirit of past incarnations but is modified to fit into the world of the MCU, I knew he wasn't going to be as take charge or a lead as other versions of the character because this wasn't a Spiderman that emerged alongside the likes of Iron-Man and the Avengers but one who grew up in awe of them, and this other side of him would emerge as he grew which it has, Garfield & Macguire played at best 18 year old Peter's who find themselves superhuman in a relatively normal world, Holland is playing 15/16 year old Peter in a world inhabited by gods and this shows.
As for Sony rethinking sharing the license with Disney, are you fucking high or really just that fucking dumb? the MCU Spider-Man movies have been the most successful of the Spidey films, for a quick breakdown the movies go like so, Spider-Man made 5.9 times it's budget, Spiderman 2 made 3.95 times it's budget, Spiderman 3 made 3.45 times it's budget, TASM made 3.29 times it's budget, TASM 2 made just 2.83 times it's budget, Homecoming made 5.02 times it's budget and FFH made 7.07 times it's budget, now this does not include marketing but Sony is known for how over the top and inferior their marketing is, spending an estimated $180-190m on marketing for TASM 2, Avengers Endgame on the other hand was estimated to have spent just $135m to market, what this means for the intellectually challenged is that the MCU Spidey films are by far the most profitable Spider-Man films Sony has ever had, despite what the mentally inferior OP may want to think, this is why they ultimately came back to the table with Marvel last year, these movies make them the most money, and they don't require them to oversee it because Marvel does that whilst also giving up one of their own film slots for the Sony film.
As for how well they stand against the Raimi films, well again TheNolan talks out of his arsehole, the Raimi films have a B+ to A- score via Cinemascore compared to the MCU Spidey films which earn a pair of clear A's, Metacritic has the Rami films averaging 71.66/100 and the MCU Spidey films at 71/100, Homecoming and Spidey 1 having the exact same score, so the only film seen as noteably superior is Spiderman 2, but the Spiderman 3 is significantly noted as being inferior to any of the other 4 films in this comparison also, as for RT Raimi's trilogy earns a overall 82/100 fresh score compared to Marvel's 91.5/100 score, with an average rating of 7.38/10 with an average fan score of 66.66/100 freshness and rating of 3.37/5 to Marvels averages of 7.56/10 critic rating, 91/100 fan fresh score and 4.39/5 fan rating, so the only thing the Raimi films score any higher on is Metacritic and even then only by 2/3's of a single point, otherwise the MCU version seems to trounce the Raimi films quite definitively, see this is the issue hen you confuse your opinion with researchable fact, see the difference? Opinion = subjective, not based on evidence, unreliable, Fact = objective, proven by evidence, reliable, are you getting this Nolan or has this gone over your head once again?
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2020 19:20:11 GMT
I'm still a bit put off by the fact that he's basically an Iron Man legacy character. But I suppose that makes sense in the context of the MCU. Tony is the new Uncle Ben. It's odd, but I'm fine with it because the RAIMI films will always be my definitive Spidey movies. These are like the Roger Moores to MacGuire's Connerys.
The way they treat the Spidey movies as lightweight romps is also hard to get used to. Of course Spidey movies should be fun, but these ones feel so frivolous compared to previous versions. Both movies are overly cutesy teen comedies in their respective first halves, but thankfully they both kick it up in the third act, which ultimately makes for two pretty decent (though heavily flawed) movies. Vulture is pretty great, and that big twist completely saves the first movie.
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thenolan
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@thenolan
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Post by thenolan on May 28, 2020 16:12:11 GMT
I expected Spider-Man to be awesome and he exceeded my expectations because the MCU is on an amazing hit streak.
garfield sucked, emma stone sucked, and she looks like she smells like cat piss.
Garfield was quite unlikebale in the role but he was still better than holland. holland is just too childish in the role and the iron man friendship is too much. it is overriding spiderman's mythos. Stone is the best actress so far to play a spidey love interest even if my personal preference is Mary jane watson
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thenolan
Sophomore
@thenolan
Posts: 778
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Post by thenolan on May 28, 2020 16:16:41 GMT
I expected a fresh, different take on the character that was still respectful to the spirit of the character, which is what we got. I also expected them to cast young because they understood that to properly build such an important character for the long term, they would have to cast someone that could play the role for years to come starting out as the young, naive, inexperienced high-school Peter Parker and growing into adulthood. Casting the young Tom Holland who has both charisma and acting chops was a smart move. I also expected to see the character interact with other Marvel characters. So far, they've delivered on every aspect and will likely continue to do so. Not sure what you were expecting other than yet another rehash of what has already come before. If so, go watch the Raimi movies and be happy. I think this is mcu fans expectations but spiderman fans expectation were the opposite. his interaction with other marvel characters has been a disaster, MCU painted themselves into a corner with it, who would have thought around the same time Spiderverse and Spiderman PS4 will have a superior adaptation vs mcu spiderman that spiderman fans and marvel fans will embrace more than the MCU it also looks as if the more people watch the Raimi films the more they dislike mcu spiderman.
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thenolan
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@thenolan
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Post by thenolan on May 28, 2020 16:21:06 GMT
I expected what we got, a reimagining of the character which follows the spirit of past incarnations but is modified to fit into the world of the MCU, I knew he wasn't going to be as take charge or a lead as other versions of the character because this wasn't a Spiderman that emerged alongside the likes of Iron-Man and the Avengers but one who grew up in awe of them, and this other side of him would emerge as he grew which it has, Garfield & Macguire played at best 18 year old Peter's who find themselves superhuman in a relatively normal world, Holland is playing 15/16 year old Peter in a world inhabited by gods and this shows. As for Sony rethinking sharing the license with Disney, are you fucking high or really just that fucking dumb? the MCU Spider-Man movies have been the most successful of the Spidey films, for a quick breakdown the movies go like so, Spider-Man made 5.9 times it's budget, Spiderman 2 made 3.95 times it's budget, Spiderman 3 made 3.45 times it's budget, TASM made 3.29 times it's budget, TASM 2 made just 2.83 times it's budget, Homecoming made 5.02 times it's budget and FFH made 7.07 times it's budget, now this does not include marketing but Sony is known for how over the top and inferior their marketing is, spending an estimated $180-190m on marketing for TASM 2, Avengers Endgame on the other hand was estimated to have spent just $135m to market, what this means for the intellectually challenged is that the MCU Spidey films are by far the most profitable Spider-Man films Sony has ever had, despite what the mentally inferior OP may want to think, this is why they ultimately came back to the table with Marvel last year, these movies make them the most money, and they don't require them to oversee it because Marvel does that whilst also giving up one of their own film slots for the Sony film. As for how well they stand against the Raimi films, well again TheNolan talks out of his arsehole, the Raimi films have a B+ to A- score via Cinemascore compared to the MCU Spidey films which earn a pair of clear A's, Metacritic has the Rami films averaging 71.66/100 and the MCU Spidey films at 71/100, Homecoming and Spidey 1 having the exact same score, so the only film seen as noteably superior is Spiderman 2, but the Spiderman 3 is significantly noted as being inferior to any of the other 4 films in this comparison also, as for RT Raimi's trilogy earns a overall 82/100 fresh score compared to Marvel's 91.5/100 score, with an average rating of 7.38/10 with an average fan score of 66.66/100 freshness and rating of 3.37/5 to Marvels averages of 7.56/10 critic rating, 91/100 fan fresh score and 4.39/5 fan rating, so the only thing the Raimi films score any higher on is Metacritic and even then only by 2/3's of a single point, otherwise the MCU version seems to trounce the Raimi films quite definitively, see this is the issue hen you confuse your opinion with researchable fact, see the difference? Opinion = subjective, not based on evidence, unreliable, Fact = objective, proven by evidence, reliable, are you getting this Nolan or has this gone over your head once again? I guess this proves mcu spiderman is inferior once you start with the cinema score and rt garbage. LMAO. The objective research shows the raimi films are superior. they have the better film making and gain the most respect of the spidey films. subjectively is based on evidence in what you known of the character and who adpated his story well. I think spiderman more as iron boy is universally hated defended only by mcu fans
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Post by blockbusted on May 28, 2020 16:26:21 GMT
I expected Spider-Man to be awesome and he exceeded my expectations because the MCU is on an amazing hit streak.
garfield sucked, emma stone sucked, and she looks like she smells like cat piss.
Garfield was quite unlikebale in the role but he was still better than holland. holland is just too childish in the role and the iron man friendship is too much. it is overriding spiderman's mythos. Stone is the best actress so far to play a spidey love interest even if my personal preference is Mary jane watson So being unlikeable is better than being childish? Yeah, that speaks volumes about your personality.
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Post by Nicko's Nose on May 28, 2020 16:28:38 GMT
I expected Spider-Man to be awesome and he exceeded my expectations because the MCU is on an amazing hit streak.
garfield sucked, emma stone sucked, and she looks like she smells like cat piss.
Garfield was quite unlikebale in the role Why the fuck are you comparing Garfield’s Spider-Man to Bale’s Batman? Derp.
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Post by dazz on May 28, 2020 18:13:10 GMT
I expected what we got, a reimagining of the character which follows the spirit of past incarnations but is modified to fit into the world of the MCU, I knew he wasn't going to be as take charge or a lead as other versions of the character because this wasn't a Spiderman that emerged alongside the likes of Iron-Man and the Avengers but one who grew up in awe of them, and this other side of him would emerge as he grew which it has, Garfield & Macguire played at best 18 year old Peter's who find themselves superhuman in a relatively normal world, Holland is playing 15/16 year old Peter in a world inhabited by gods and this shows. As for Sony rethinking sharing the license with Disney, are you fucking high or really just that fucking dumb? the MCU Spider-Man movies have been the most successful of the Spidey films, for a quick breakdown the movies go like so, Spider-Man made 5.9 times it's budget, Spiderman 2 made 3.95 times it's budget, Spiderman 3 made 3.45 times it's budget, TASM made 3.29 times it's budget, TASM 2 made just 2.83 times it's budget, Homecoming made 5.02 times it's budget and FFH made 7.07 times it's budget, now this does not include marketing but Sony is known for how over the top and inferior their marketing is, spending an estimated $180-190m on marketing for TASM 2, Avengers Endgame on the other hand was estimated to have spent just $135m to market, what this means for the intellectually challenged is that the MCU Spidey films are by far the most profitable Spider-Man films Sony has ever had, despite what the mentally inferior OP may want to think, this is why they ultimately came back to the table with Marvel last year, these movies make them the most money, and they don't require them to oversee it because Marvel does that whilst also giving up one of their own film slots for the Sony film. As for how well they stand against the Raimi films, well again TheNolan talks out of his arsehole, the Raimi films have a B+ to A- score via Cinemascore compared to the MCU Spidey films which earn a pair of clear A's, Metacritic has the Rami films averaging 71.66/100 and the MCU Spidey films at 71/100, Homecoming and Spidey 1 having the exact same score, so the only film seen as noteably superior is Spiderman 2, but the Spiderman 3 is significantly noted as being inferior to any of the other 4 films in this comparison also, as for RT Raimi's trilogy earns a overall 82/100 fresh score compared to Marvel's 91.5/100 score, with an average rating of 7.38/10 with an average fan score of 66.66/100 freshness and rating of 3.37/5 to Marvels averages of 7.56/10 critic rating, 91/100 fan fresh score and 4.39/5 fan rating, so the only thing the Raimi films score any higher on is Metacritic and even then only by 2/3's of a single point, otherwise the MCU version seems to trounce the Raimi films quite definitively, see this is the issue hen you confuse your opinion with researchable fact, see the difference? Opinion = subjective, not based on evidence, unreliable, Fact = objective, proven by evidence, reliable, are you getting this Nolan or has this gone over your head once again? I guess this proves mcu spiderman is inferior once you start with the cinema score and rt garbage. LMAO. The objective research shows the raimi films are superior. they have the better film making and gain the most respect of the spidey films. subjectively is based on evidence in what you known of the character and who adpated his story well. I think spiderman more as iron boy is universally hated defended only by mcu fans No the objective research shows the opposite, IMDB also has both MCU Spidey films having superior ratings to all the Raimi movies, so that's IMDB, RT, Cinemascore all of which place the MCU Spidey films higher than the Raimi ones, only Metacritic barely has Raimi's films being superior bare a whisker than the MCU films, and unlike you I know how to judge RT, the Tomatometer means nothing hence why I stated the actual average scores of the films, rounding up for Raimi's they score a 7.4/10 and 3.4/5 from critics and fans, the MCU Spidey films when rounding down score a 7.5/10 and a 4.3 from critics and fans.
Where do you get your "evidence" from? Because you see these are large places with the opinions of hundreds if not millions of people being collected and averaged out, not you know a small community online where likeminded people congregate and pat themselves on the back for their shared "correct" opinion, the general consensus seems to go against what you claim, so please provide evidence to the contrary, evidence mind you, not baseless objections and hollow posturing like you typical bring to a discussion.
Is the MCU Spider-Man perfect? no but then no adaptation is, and when a character has been continuously reimagined for 50 years with multiple variants over time there is no one true source material to adapt from, what could be the definitive Silver Age Spider-Man is not the same as the definitive Bronze Age Spider-Man adaptation neither one is any less true an adaptation though, characters change over time, adaption breeds change, hence why alterations to some aspects of the characters is fine, so long as you stay true to the core of the version of the character you wish to adapt, and even then aspects of said character change or atleast are given more or less prominence based on the story being told or approach being taken, such as in Homecoming where they went out of their way NOT to repeat the same over done aspects of the character from the past 5 movies, such as Uncle Ben, Spidey Sense, swinging through NYC, this Spidey still has all of that they just know they don't need to tell us such because it is so ingrained in our heads after 5 other movies...If only Batman movies would learn this with the whole parents issues *sigh*.
But whatever you posture like a demented peacock that's been plucked of all it's feathers you brain damaged simpleton, only people who agree with you are the window lickers that belong in the same funny farm as you so enjoy their company I guess.
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Post by bud47 on May 28, 2020 18:18:53 GMT
I expected a fresh, different take on the character that was still respectful to the spirit of the character, which is what we got. I also expected them to cast young because they understood that to properly build such an important character for the long term, they would have to cast someone that could play the role for years to come starting out as the young, naive, inexperienced high-school Peter Parker and growing into adulthood. Casting the young Tom Holland who has both charisma and acting chops was a smart move. I also expected to see the character interact with other Marvel characters. So far, they've delivered on every aspect and will likely continue to do so. Not sure what you were expecting other than yet another rehash of what has already come before. If so, go watch the Raimi movies and be happy. I think this is mcu fans expectations but spiderman fans expectation were the opposite. his interaction with other marvel characters has been a disaster, MCU painted themselves into a corner with it, who would have thought around the same time Spiderverse and Spiderman PS4 will have a superior adaptation vs mcu spiderman that spiderman fans and marvel fans will embrace more than the MCU it also looks as if the more people watch the Raimi films the more they dislike mcu spiderman. Yeah, it's strange how opinions work isn't it? Enjoy your delusions.
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Post by taylorfirst1 on May 28, 2020 18:35:07 GMT
"his interaction with other marvel characters has been a disaster, MCU painted themselves into a corner with it, who would have thought around the same time Spiderverse and Spiderman PS4 will have a superior adaptation vs mcu spiderman that spiderman fans and marvel fans will embrace more than the MCU
it also looks as if the more people watch the Raimi films the more they dislike mcu spiderman."
This must be the stupidest thing I have ever read in my life. If you came on here and claimed that "water is not wet", it would not be as stupid as that paragraph.
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