|
Post by sostie on Jun 29, 2020 14:43:18 GMT
|
|
|
Post by TheGoodMan19 on Jun 29, 2020 17:45:23 GMT
I was a kid fascinated my music in the 70's. And never heard of Kraftwerk. I'll admit I was stuck in the sticks. Were the popular in the more urban places in the US?
Disco had been around for a while before SNF soundtrack came out
Very true, but it's arguable the album/film made Disco a massive worldwide phenomenon. I also think it made the soundtrack album a more viable financial consideration for film studios. There had been big selling pop soundtracks in the past - Beatles and Elvis films for instance. And "jukebox" soundtracks like American Graffiti. But a successful compilation soundtrack made for a film were not as common until after SNF release, and certainly not considered a big money making potential. On the subject of SNF, I watched it in full the other week forthefirst time in decades. It's a pretty great film. It suffers from some poor post synch/over dubbing, but is a lot grittier than I remembered, and Travolta is outstanding. What I was going for was a massively influential album. You could say "there was music before Please, Please Me and music after.". The end of the 50's music. Bollocks, I think, not only paved the way for punk by being more well known that the Ramones, but also metal and new wave. Music before Bollocks was all progressive and folkish, James Taylor stuff. And Nevermind ended the rule of Hair Metal and brought back better lyrics that the normal "I want laid" stuff. You might be able to argue against Bollocks but no way can you refute Please Please Me and Nevermind.
As far as the movie, it really is a great piece of film. Ignore the dated clothes and music, and it's very good. Travolta's character finally seeing all the BS in his life. I think it was Gene Siskel's favorite movie. He bought Travolta's iconic white suit. Some people think its another Monster a Go-Go.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jun 29, 2020 17:59:39 GMT
And Nevermind ended the rule of Hair Metal and brought back better lyrics that the normal "I want laid" stuff. Really? Cobain was hardly a Bob Dylan, and Nirvana were just a heavier Pixies with worse songwriting but better production and a major label promoting them. Plenty of hair metal bands could write better lyrics: Maybe it's just another song about getting laid (not really), but it's better than anything Cobain ever wrote.
|
|
|
Post by TheGoodMan19 on Jun 29, 2020 18:03:51 GMT
And Nevermind ended the rule of Hair Metal and brought back better lyrics that the normal "I want laid" stuff. Really? Cobain was hardly a Bob Dylan, and Nirvana were just a heavier Pixies with worse songwriting but better production and a major label promoting them. Plenty of hair metal bands could write better lyrics: Maybe it's just another song about getting laid (not really), but it's better than anything Cobain ever wrote. I'm not arguing "better or worse". Does anyone think Please Please Me is the best the Beatles had to offer? Influence. How many people listened to Nirvana? How many people listened to the Pixies?
|
|
|
Post by lowtacks86 on Jun 29, 2020 18:08:30 GMT
For better or worse, Pantera's "Vulgar Display of Power" opened the doors for "bro metal" (metalcore, numetal, mallcore)
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jun 29, 2020 18:15:50 GMT
Really? Cobain was hardly a Bob Dylan, and Nirvana were just a heavier Pixies with worse songwriting but better production and a major label promoting them. Plenty of hair metal bands could write better lyrics: Maybe it's just another song about getting laid (not really), but it's better than anything Cobain ever wrote. I'm not arguing "better or worse". Does anyone think Please Please Me is the best the Beatles had to offer? Influence. How many people listened to Nirvana? How many people listened to the Pixies?
I don't think Please Please Me was The Beatles' most influential either; surely that would have to go to Revolver or Sgt. Pepper. No argument that more people have heard Nirvana than Pixies, but influence might be closer between the two than it appears. Pixies are a bit like The Velvet Underground in that they didn't achieve popular success but had a huge impact on future bands, including Nirvana given that Cobain said Teen Spirit was his attempt at writing a Pixies song. Another marginally successful band that was sneakily influential to the 90s was The Replacements; Let it Be and Tim are the blueprint for all the radio-friendly alt. rock bands (Matchbox 20, Goo Goo Dolls, etc.) that exploded during the decade.
|
|
|
Post by lowtacks86 on Jun 29, 2020 18:19:46 GMT
Mainstream audiences didn't really seem to care about industrial until "Downward Spiral"
|
|
|
Post by TheGoodMan19 on Jun 29, 2020 18:22:13 GMT
I'm not arguing "better or worse". Does anyone think Please Please Me is the best the Beatles had to offer? Influence. How many people listened to Nirvana? How many people listened to the Pixies?
I don't think Please Please Me was The Beatles' most influential either; surely that would have to go to Revolver or Sgt. Pepper. No argument that more people have heard Nirvana than Pixies, but influence might be closer between the two than it appears. Pixies are a bit like The Velvet Underground in that they didn't achieve popular success but had a huge impact on future bands, including Nirvana given that Cobain said Teen Spirit was his attempt at writing a Pixies song. Another marginally successful band that was sneakily influential to the 90s was The Replacements; Let it Be and Tim are the blueprint for all the radio-friendly alt. rock bands (Matchbox 20, Goo Goo Dolls, etc.) that exploded during the decade. PPM opened to door for the British Invasion. Even though the singles were the game changer, the first album changed it all. None of the British bands would have had a chance. No Stones, Animals, Kinks, ad infinitum. The four Beatles personalities opened the door as much as the music. Rubber Soul and what followed just upped the ante.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jun 29, 2020 18:26:54 GMT
For better or worse, Pantera's "Vulgar Display of Power" opened the doors for "bro metal" (metalcore, numetal, mallcore) Pantera were groove metal. Them and Metallica popularized that (with an assist from Sepultura). Numetal certainly borrowed from that, but not exclusively. Metalcore was a hybrid of melodic death metal (At the Gates, In Flames, Dark Tranquility; ATG's Slaughter of the Soul was the genre's blueprint) with hardcore; not a ton of influence from Pantera. Not sure what mallcore is...
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jun 29, 2020 18:30:20 GMT
I don't think Please Please Me was The Beatles' most influential either; surely that would have to go to Revolver or Sgt. Pepper. No argument that more people have heard Nirvana than Pixies, but influence might be closer between the two than it appears. Pixies are a bit like The Velvet Underground in that they didn't achieve popular success but had a huge impact on future bands, including Nirvana given that Cobain said Teen Spirit was his attempt at writing a Pixies song. Another marginally successful band that was sneakily influential to the 90s was The Replacements; Let it Be and Tim are the blueprint for all the radio-friendly alt. rock bands (Matchbox 20, Goo Goo Dolls, etc.) that exploded during the decade. PPM opened to door for the British Invasion. Even though the singles were the game changer, the first album changed it all. None of the British bands would have had a chance. No Stones, Animals, Kinks, ad infinitum. The four Beatles personalities opened the door as much as the music. Rubber Soul and what followed just upped the ante.
I think there's two different kinds of influence here with varying amounts of overlap; the breakthrough commercial success that allows similar bands to flood the market, and musical influence that inspires future bands. I won't deny PPM's eminence with the former, just the latter.
|
|
|
Post by lowtacks86 on Jun 29, 2020 18:41:29 GMT
For better or worse, Pantera's "Vulgar Display of Power" opened the doors for "bro metal" (metalcore, numetal, mallcore) Pantera were groove metal. Them and Metallica popularized that (with an assist from Sepultura). Numetal certainly borrowed from that, but not exclusively. Metalcore was a hybrid of melodic death metal (At the Gates, In Flames, Dark Tranquility; ATG's Slaughter of the Soul was the genre's blueprint) with hardcore; not a ton of influence from Pantera. Not sure what mallcore is... I know they get categorized as "groove" but I always thought of Pantera as basically being thrash metal (they were clearly influenced by the original thrash wave)
|
|
|
Post by sostie on Jun 29, 2020 18:44:17 GMT
Really? Cobain was hardly a Bob Dylan, and Nirvana were just a heavier Pixies with worse songwriting but better production and a major label promoting them. Plenty of hair metal bands could write better lyrics: Maybe it's just another song about getting laid (not really), but it's better than anything Cobain ever wrote. I'm not arguing "better or worse". Does anyone think Please Please Me is the best the Beatles had to offer? Influence. How many people listened to Nirvana? How many people listened to the Pixies?
The influence of the Pixies might depend where you are. They were pretty big in the UK...darlings of the music press (when that meant something) since Surfer Rosa, and they were selling 20,000+ venues in the UK before Nevermind was released. Their 1990 LP charted higher than Nevermind (but didn't sell as much obviously). Plus Cobain says Teen Spirit was his attempt to "co-opt" the Pixies sound. Pixies (and mudhoney) probably paved the way for Nirvana in the UK, and gave them a decent sized following here, but Nevermind definitely blew it through the roof
|
|
|
Post by lowtacks86 on Jun 29, 2020 18:45:20 GMT
Phil Collins "Face Value" heavily influenced 80s production, in particular to the "gated drum" sound.
|
|
|
Post by NJtoTX on Jun 30, 2020 0:27:23 GMT
Well, covers.
|
|
|
Post by Eva Yojimbo on Jun 30, 2020 5:14:04 GMT
Pantera were groove metal. Them and Metallica popularized that (with an assist from Sepultura). Numetal certainly borrowed from that, but not exclusively. Metalcore was a hybrid of melodic death metal (At the Gates, In Flames, Dark Tranquility; ATG's Slaughter of the Soul was the genre's blueprint) with hardcore; not a ton of influence from Pantera. Not sure what mallcore is... I know they get categorized as "groove" but I always thought of Pantera as basically being thrash metal (they were clearly influenced by the original thrash wave) Pantera definitely had thrash elements, but it was the groove on songs like Walk that was so influential. Thrash was on its last legs (at least in terms of popularity) when they came out.
|
|