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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 15, 2020 12:21:23 GMT
Ask that to Azazel, Nightcrawler, Beast, Caliban, Artie or even Cyclops... There's no need for registration in their cases--they can't hide it. The point of registration is to keep track of those who look outwardly normal.
Registration can be the very first step to something MUCH WORSE following that, like concentration camps. You never know.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 15, 2020 12:23:53 GMT
Registration can be the very first step to something MUCH WORSE following that, like concentration camps. You never know. But they have super powers. That's the Ebert point. They aren't defenseless. Nightcrawler was able to evade all the president's secret service.
Would make more sense if they were worried about the secret Stryker stuff first.
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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 15, 2020 12:38:23 GMT
Registration can be the very first step to something MUCH WORSE following that, like concentration camps. You never know. But they have super powers. That's the Ebert point. They aren't defenseless. Nightcrawler was able to evade all the president's secret service.
Superpowers don't matter. Sentinels were created in the seventies, as pointed out by DOFP. There were Sentinels in the Danger Room, at the beginning of "The Last Stand" (year 2000). You cannot spend your life escaping or fighting people with superpowers. You're a normal citizen, despite your DNA.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 15, 2020 12:47:46 GMT
Superpowers don't matter. Sentinels were created in the seventies, as pointed out by DOFP. There were Sentinels in the Danger Room, at the beginning of "The Last Stand" (year 2000). You cannot spend your life escaping or fighting people with superpowers. You're a normal citizen, despite your DNA. But that wasn't in the movie. In the movie, only registration was discussed. This is what Ebert was talking about.
The movie made it sound like Magneto had something to worry about with a piece of paper. Not with his powers he didn't. He could destroy a police department in a few seconds.
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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 15, 2020 13:12:00 GMT
Superpowers don't matter. Sentinels were created in the seventies, as pointed out by DOFP. There were Sentinels in the Danger Room, at the beginning of "The Last Stand" (year 2000). You cannot spend your life escaping or fighting people with superpowers. You're a normal citizen, despite your DNA. But that wasn't in the movie. In the movie, only registration was discussed. This is what Ebert was talking about.
The movie made it sound like Magneto had something to worry about with a piece of paper. Not with his powers he didn't. He could destroy a police department in a few seconds.
Magneto comes from the concentration camps. The movie made it sound like Magneto had something to worry about what FOLLOWS a piece of paper, not the piece of paper itself. Sentinels, experiments on mutants, ways to suppress mutant powers... and much more. Stryker was out there. Ebert was seriously wrong.
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Post by dazz on Jul 15, 2020 17:13:43 GMT
i am with Supperhero on this, not his attempt to insert his deluded "definitive" timeline bollocks, but Magneto's fears being real, you can say oh he had superpowers and yeah but that wasn't in this movie all you want but it's a bullshit excuse, at the end of the movie they have Magneto locked up in a plastic prison specifically designed for him, that doesn't happen over night, by registering their powers it gives the government their names, their faces and intel on their powers, everything you would need to cull them from the population, and Magneto's fears aren't just based in the reality of his present but the reality of his past, he's a holocaust survivor and he is traumatised by that, same way people who are victims of sexual assault are traumatised by their ordeal, now just because you may not believe the validity to Magneto's fears, though they are proven true later, how do you argue his perception doesn't make sense when he has the backstory he has, just like if a woman who was violently sexually assaulted flinches or recoils at a man getting to close to them though the mans intentions maybe 100% innocent, you understand her reaction, you should understand Magneto's also...ok not the turning everyone into mutants things, that's supervillain chicanery right there, but the fears of what an overwhelming force of numbers fuelled on hate and fear could do makes perfect sense.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 15, 2020 17:37:08 GMT
Magneto comes from the concentration camps. The movie made it sound like Magneto had something to worry about what FOLLOWS a piece of paper, not the piece of paper itself. Sentinels, experiments on mutants, ways to suppress mutant powers... and much more. Stryker was out there. Ebert was seriously wrong. He was just being realistic. Pieces of paper mean nothing. They could have a secret program to track mutants without making it public anyway (and they did). Magneto and co. didn't even know about it.
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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 15, 2020 20:06:17 GMT
i am with Supperhero on this, not his attempt to insert his deluded "definitive" timeline bollocks, but Magneto's fears being real, you can say oh he had superpowers and yeah but that wasn't in this movie all you want but it's a bullshit excuse, at the end of the movie they have Magneto locked up in a plastic prison specifically designed for him, that doesn't happen over night, by registering their powers it gives the government their names, their faces and intel on their powers, everything you would need to cull them from the population, and Magneto's fears aren't just based in the reality of his present but the reality of his past, he's a holocaust survivor and he is traumatised by that, same way people who are victims of sexual assault are traumatised by their ordeal, now just because you may not believe the validity to Magneto's fears, though they are proven true later, how do you argue his perception doesn't make sense when he has the backstory he has, just like if a woman who was violently sexually assaulted flinches or recoils at a man getting to close to them though the mans intentions maybe 100% innocent, you understand her reaction, you should understand Magneto's also...ok not the turning everyone into mutants things, that's supervillain chicanery right there, but the fears of what an overwhelming force of numbers fuelled on hate and fear could do makes perfect sense. Well put.
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Post by twothousandonemark on Jul 15, 2020 23:50:54 GMT
Not a benchmark for me, merely evolution from Superman, Batman, & subsequently Spider-Man respectively... before the genre hunted down & devoured Hollywood.
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Jul 16, 2020 6:41:50 GMT
Speak some truth boy. Another piece nerdist.com/article/x-men-2000-most-important-superhero-movie/Why X-MEN Is the Most Important Superhero Movie Ever MadeCampea argues it is the most important comic film. though I say that goes to superman, I would say xmen is the most important for pure artistic serious comic films. Logan and Joker, man of steel or TDK or DOFP may not have happened if this movie did not set the tone. Also I have 50% surprised the media is giving this movie its due. its like they chose to remember marvel used to have intelligent comic films for adults I dont blame MCU fans for working so hard to say the movie is dated. this is their last quest to give MCU some credibility but that cant happen anymore.
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Jul 16, 2020 6:47:14 GMT
It's a very predictable screenplay, but the movie was intense and had superb direction, great acting from everyone involved, wonderful set-pieces, astonishing action sequences, impressive FX for its time and... HUGH JACKMAN. It's not a masterpiece, but it was ONE STEP or even TWO STEPS ahead of Tim Burton and the superhero movies of the nineties, and it just ignited the modern superhero genre for the following generations. HUGH JACKMAN was magnificent. He totally recreated Wolverine from scratch and made the character a big GLOBAL MOVIE ICON, beyond comic books. He will always be the Real Wolverine. It's mainly known for launching Hugh Jackman's career more than anything else and being a stepping stone to Spider-Man, which is the CBM that really ignited the genre. It wasn't even that big of a hit during the summer of 2000. MI2 was the blockbuster of that season and people were talking more about Gladiator than anything else. X-Men was a surprise success for a small budget action film with a grounded and relatable premise with a really lame and lazy, ripped from the Sci-Fi channel plot (a machine that turns people into mutants, oh my!). It had a small budget which was reflected in the film. The costumes, effects and action sequences/set pieces were adequate. It was nothing impressive or groundbreaking for it's time and more importantly lacked the scope and imagination of the source material. X2 was a bigger success and did more for the genre. Although let's be real, neither were a phenomenon like the first Burton Batman film. wait are you saying MCU had higher standard for marvel? how come you cannot prove this with film making facts? LMAO. Burtons Batman came first. so did Superman but they were different kind of comic films. X2 reached the standard for marvel like burton did for DC. Spiderman was marvel's superman. so marvel and dc were even. XMen till today is still marvel saving face of making grown up movies that has credibility. Logan, X2, DOFP and first class. Xmen gave comic film serious legitimacy. So the question is why does marvel not have the credibility anymore that xmen gave it? why have movies like endgame, captian marvel and the rest done harm to marvel Also to see people talk about the impact of this film. what chance does MCU xmen have? we know mcu xmen is not even cinema and will be silly comedy.
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Jul 16, 2020 6:57:11 GMT
The best things about it are Jackman and Paquin, good sympathetic performances from both--but it's a poor comic book "action" film. Ebert said in his review it seemed strange the mutants would be upset about registration when they could easily avoid being registered with the powers they have. you make some good points on the poor comic book action film. the director was not interested in action. he wanted the drama first. Infact I think the action is in the movie for like 10-20%. it may not be a poor action flick but it was a good drama comic film thus, setting the door for films like Btman Begins, Logan and X2 that took this style forward. Ironic is X3 is a good action film.
Speaking of Roger Ebert, in his review he said he was very surprised a comic film can actually have a plot, story telling and depth. since back then comic films only existed to sell toys and do action scenes. lastly you nailed it for Jackman and Paquin. like we used to say xmen, is one of the few comic series were many actors do give great performances, unlike now where they just stand behind green screen for 3 hours. Even a weak film like X3 still had a great performance with Kelsy Grammer playing Beast. the final legacy of this series is. this is the only marvel franchise, despite half of their crappy films is marvel saving grace. as mcu gets constantly slammed and ignored among real film makers and older comic fan, a film like xmen 1 helps marvel's reputation a whole lot. You cannot watch xmen 1 and say marvel movies are just theme parks fluff.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 16, 2020 7:47:23 GMT
Speaking of Roger Ebert, in his review he said he was very surprised a comic film can actually have a plot, story telling and depth. since back then comic films only existed to sell toys and do action scenes. He forgot about Superman the Movie although I see in his review he considered it more of an action comedy.
I think Blade was ok for action and drama though it isn't a superhero movie in the normal sense.
One thing I remember from the Ebert show, Roper ridiculed the scene where they are standing around discussing which of them should use their powers to attack Magneto.
The second film was much more action oriented but seemed less dramatic.
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Post by hobowar on Jul 16, 2020 14:29:04 GMT
The best things about it are Jackman and Paquin, good sympathetic performances from both--but it's a poor comic book "action" film. Ebert said in his review it seemed strange the mutants would be upset about registration when they could easily avoid being registered with the powers they have. you make some good points on the poor comic book action film. the director was not interested in action. he wanted the drama first. Infact I think the action is in the movie for like 10-20%. it may not be a poor action flick but it was a good drama comic film thus, setting the door for films like Btman Begins, Logan and X2 that took this style forward. Ironic is X3 is a good action film.
Speaking of Roger Ebert, in his review he said he was very surprised a comic film can actually have a plot, story telling and depth. since back then comic films only existed to sell toys and do action scenes. lastly you nailed it for Jackman and Paquin. like we used to say xmen, is one of the few comic series were many actors do give great performances, unlike now where they just stand behind green screen for 3 hours. Even a weak film like X3 still had a great performance with Kelsy Grammer playing Beast. the final legacy of this series is. this is the only marvel franchise, despite half of their crappy films is marvel saving grace. as mcu gets constantly slammed and ignored among real film makers and older comic fan, a film like xmen 1 helps marvel's reputation a whole lot. You cannot watch xmen 1 and say marvel movies are just theme parks fluff.Yeah you can. Scorsese thought Batman was Marvel when he said that. Surely you know what that means?
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Post by hobowar on Jul 16, 2020 14:35:32 GMT
=
Scorsese's opinion.
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Post by politicidal on Jul 16, 2020 18:04:05 GMT
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Post by politicidal on Jul 18, 2020 15:22:41 GMT
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Jul 19, 2020 8:06:57 GMT
Speaking of Roger Ebert, in his review he said he was very surprised a comic film can actually have a plot, story telling and depth. since back then comic films only existed to sell toys and do action scenes. He forgot about Superman the Movie although I see in his review he considered it more of an action comedy.
I think Blade was ok for action and drama though it isn't a superhero movie in the normal sense.
One thing I remember from the Ebert show, Roper ridiculed the scene where they are standing around discussing which of them should use their powers to attack Magneto.
The second film was much more action oriented but seemed less dramatic.
I don't think he forgot about superman , I think with xmen it was more noticeable because the movie was very grounded and had a more realistic story about people with powers. the second film just had better action sequence, practical effects? the drama was more with more stakes. speaking of action, it is almost funny now watching a comic film like xmen 1 or 2 where nothing really explodes. comic films were different back then but better. they were less easy to hate on.
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thenolan
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Post by thenolan on Jul 19, 2020 8:07:36 GMT
that is what you get when you make your movies more grounded.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jul 19, 2020 8:19:39 GMT
I don't think he forgot about superman , I think with xmen it was more noticeable because the movie was very grounded and had a more realistic story about people with powers. the second film just had better action sequence, practical effects? the drama was more with more stakes. speaking of action, it is almost funny now watching a comic film like xmen 1 or 2 where nothing really explodes. comic films were different back then but better. they were less easy to hate on. The dramatic parts in Superman like the Krypton council and Smallville scenes were as grounded as any in X-men films. They weren't intended as comedy.
The relationship between Rogue and Logan was stronger and more personal drama in the first, and while Brian Cox was a great villain and Magneto was also more threatening, the Jean Grey sacrifice and reaction from Logan and Cyclops was kind of emo weak, sort of like an attempt to copy Star Trek 2 (even by having her give the ending narration as Spock did). Superman got weepy when Lois died but he then did something about it so it isn't the same kind of helplessness.
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