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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 22, 2020 19:13:01 GMT
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Post by Lord Death Man on Jul 22, 2020 22:33:36 GMT
This post makes very little sense. Consider elaborating on your thoughts.
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Post by politicidal on Jul 22, 2020 23:28:20 GMT
Khalil, is that you?
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Post by Lord Death Man on Jul 23, 2020 2:11:06 GMT
Likely his reincarnation.
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jul 23, 2020 17:43:41 GMT
It lost money. That’s all there is to it.
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Post by bud47 on Jul 23, 2020 18:11:23 GMT
Remind us again how many more "great" Fox X-Men movies we can expect in the future? Regardless of whom this lost money for, the only thing it accomplished was to confirm that the franchise had run out of steam and needed to be put out of it's misery.
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Post by dazz on Jul 24, 2020 0:13:54 GMT
Except Last Stand, $210m budget and a minimum of $100m in marketing against $460m box office, + $106m estimated home media sales, now I know you cannot count or do maths in even the most basic form so allow me to educate you once again.
Box Office $460m, 51% domestic and 49% international domestic return between 50% and 55% = $117.3-129.03m International returns between 40-45% = $90.16-101.43m Combined Domestic & International returns between $207.46-230.46m
Video Sales = $106m minus 10-20% production cost* = $84.8-95.4m *probably closer to 25% like Deadpool but I'm being generous.
Combined revenue ranges from $292.26-325.86m Combined expenses = $310m minimum production and marketing, and unaccounted for taxes, interest, participation bonuses, residuals, overhead and Marvel's licensing fee's.
Best case is Fox pocketed $15m before secondary expenses when combining box office and home media releases, this does not include TV licensing and later streaming deals for the movies though, but they still lost almost $100m on the box office alone.
So you keep hunting for any trace you think might be victories, numbers do not lie, Last Stand was a fucking disaster, if Fox didn't have to keep making X-Men movies or lose the license that along with Origins would have likely put X-Men on ice for about a decade or so, thank god for contractual obligations or else we ay never have gotten Logan or Deadpool, or First Class and that would be a travesty.
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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 24, 2020 13:15:42 GMT
This is the truth. I think you must accept it.
FOX X-MEN MOVIES
Big Hits:
X-Men X2 X-Men: The Last Stand The Wolverine X-Men: Days of Future Past Deadpool X-Men: Apocalypse Logan Deadpool 2
Moderate Hits (grossed twice their budget) with huge video sales:
X-Men Origins: Wolverine X-Men: First Class
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Post by dazz on Jul 24, 2020 17:05:51 GMT
This is the truth. I think you must accept it. FOX X-MEN MOVIES Big Hits:X-Men X2 X-Men: The Last Stand The Wolverine X-Men: Days of Future Past Deadpool X-Men: Apocalypse Logan Deadpool 2 Moderate Hits (grossed twice their budget) with huge video sales:X-Men Origins: Wolverine X-Men: First Class Last stand grossed 2.2x it's budget same as First Class, Origins however grossed 2.5x it's budget, told yah, you cannot count for shit, also double the production budget hasn't meant a movie is a hit in decades, ever since marketing budgets started getting into the 10's of millions for modest releases. When you do not understand something you should just be quiet, remember best to be quiet and thought a fool rather than open your mouth and remove all doubt, every time you speak you remove all doubt all the time, you fool you damn fool.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 24, 2020 17:21:21 GMT
Disney didn't lose money on Dark Phoenix because they wrote it off. Fox already spent the money making it.
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Post by Martin Brundle - Martinfly on Jul 25, 2020 11:50:15 GMT
Disney didn't lose money on Dark Phoenix because they wrote it off. Fox already spent the money making it. Fox was "purchased". Money came in. They cashed an insane amount of money to be "absorbed" by Disney. So "Dark Phoenix" and "The New Mutants" have fruited money for FOX the same. They will eventually become video sleeper hits, and we true X-Men fans are happy anyway.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 25, 2020 15:46:45 GMT
Disney didn't lose money on Dark Phoenix because they wrote it off. Fox already spent the money making it. Fox was "purchased". Money came in. They cashed an insane amount of money to be "absorbed" by Disney. So "Dark Phoenix" and "The New Mutants" have fruited money for FOX the same. They will eventually become video sleeper hits, and we true X-Men fans are happy anyway. After I finished Dark Phoenix, I said "I'm sorry."
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Post by dazz on Jul 25, 2020 20:18:19 GMT
Disney didn't lose money on Dark Phoenix because they wrote it off. Fox already spent the money making it. Fox was "purchased". Money came in. They cashed an insane amount of money to be "absorbed" by Disney. So "Dark Phoenix" and "The New Mutants" have fruited money for FOX the same. They will eventually become video sleeper hits, and we true X-Men fans are happy anyway. Actually no, see Fox spent $200m making the movie, to recoup that Disney would have needed to pay that much just for Dark Phoenix alone in the merger, Disney paid $71.3b for the entire Fox Library which covers 1000's of movies, 10's of thousands maybe even 100,000+ hours of TV content, massive amounts of intellectual properties, as well as TV networks, ownership in other ventures and all this other stuff.
Let's just go with 1000 movies and 10,000 hours of TV, say they are equally valuable, so $35.65b each, that means the movies were worth $35.65m and each hour of TV $3.565m, that puts Fox at a loss of $164.35m on Dark Phoenix, and that's overly estimating their worth considerably.
It's just that the loss of Dark Phoenix was negligible to Fox because of the merger, who cares if they wasted $200m when they are selling the company for $70b+, no one that's who, it's not that it didn't cost them money, it's like someone stealing your wallet with £50 in it the day before you win the lottery, you still lost money but on an unrelated note you are now worth exponentially more than that so who cares?
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 27, 2020 23:03:07 GMT
Fox was "purchased". Money came in. They cashed an insane amount of money to be "absorbed" by Disney. So "Dark Phoenix" and "The New Mutants" have fruited money for FOX the same. They will eventually become video sleeper hits, and we true X-Men fans are happy anyway. Actually no, see Fox spent $200m making the movie, to recoup that Disney would have needed to pay that much just for Dark Phoenix alone in the merger, Disney paid $71.3b for the entire Fox Library which covers 1000's of movies, 10's of thousands maybe even 100,000+ hours of TV content, massive amounts of intellectual properties, as well as TV networks, ownership in other ventures and all this other stuff.
Let's just go with 1000 movies and 10,000 hours of TV, say they are equally valuable, so $35.65b each, that means the movies were worth $35.65m and each hour of TV $3.565m, that puts Fox at a loss of $164.35m on Dark Phoenix, and that's overly estimating their worth considerably.
It's just that the loss of Dark Phoenix was negligible to Fox because of the merger, who cares if they wasted $200m when they are selling the company for $70b+, no one that's who, it's not that it didn't cost them money, it's like someone stealing your wallet with £50 in it the day before you win the lottery, you still lost money but on an unrelated note you are now worth exponentially more than that so who cares?
The thing he's not understanding is that they could have said screw it and waited to throw it on Disney+ as another addition to their library. They actually gained money from having it in theaters.
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Post by dazz on Jul 28, 2020 4:13:03 GMT
Actually no, see Fox spent $200m making the movie, to recoup that Disney would have needed to pay that much just for Dark Phoenix alone in the merger, Disney paid $71.3b for the entire Fox Library which covers 1000's of movies, 10's of thousands maybe even 100,000+ hours of TV content, massive amounts of intellectual properties, as well as TV networks, ownership in other ventures and all this other stuff.
Let's just go with 1000 movies and 10,000 hours of TV, say they are equally valuable, so $35.65b each, that means the movies were worth $35.65m and each hour of TV $3.565m, that puts Fox at a loss of $164.35m on Dark Phoenix, and that's overly estimating their worth considerably.
It's just that the loss of Dark Phoenix was negligible to Fox because of the merger, who cares if they wasted $200m when they are selling the company for $70b+, no one that's who, it's not that it didn't cost them money, it's like someone stealing your wallet with £50 in it the day before you win the lottery, you still lost money but on an unrelated note you are now worth exponentially more than that so who cares?
The thing he's not understanding is that they could have said screw it and waited to throw it on Disney+ as another addition to their library. They actually gained money from having it in theaters. That depends on contract issues, like what obligations the studios have with theatre chains, what the contracts promise the talent and such, as happened with the recent Troll's movie, by going streaming it cut out the actors box office bonuses and I think they are or were planning on suing the studio over it.
It's also Hollywood accounting, even though Disney didn't spend a penny to make that movie they will use it's cost's and it's off of the box office financial failure as a way to right off millions so that they can not pay taxes on something or other.
Why he even cares I don't know, I like box office numbers and just like to see what the nitty gritty is, I really don't care if a film does more or worse box office wise, unless it's a movie in a franchise or an IP I want to see become a franchise, and so success or failure holds a lot of sway.
But also his statement that Dark Phoenix and New Mutants will be huge hits on home media, Dark Phoenix hasn't even cracked $20m in DVD and Blu-ray sales domestically yet apparently, so much for it being a big hit, almost as if universally outside of the fanatics people just don't like the movie...weird.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 28, 2020 20:43:16 GMT
The thing he's not understanding is that they could have said screw it and waited to throw it on Disney+ as another addition to their library. They actually gained money from having it in theaters. That depends on contract issues, like what obligations the studios have with theatre chains, what the contracts promise the talent and such, as happened with the recent Troll's movie, by going streaming it cut out the actors box office bonuses and I think they are or were planning on suing the studio over it.
It's also Hollywood accounting, even though Disney didn't spend a penny to make that movie they will use it's cost's and it's off of the box office financial failure as a way to right off millions so that they can not pay taxes on something or other.
Why he even cares I don't know, I like box office numbers and just like to see what the nitty gritty is, I really don't care if a film does more or worse box office wise, unless it's a movie in a franchise or an IP I want to see become a franchise, and so success or failure holds a lot of sway.
But also his statement that Dark Phoenix and New Mutants will be huge hits on home media, Dark Phoenix hasn't even cracked $20m in DVD and Blu-ray sales domestically yet apparently, so much for it being a big hit, almost as if universally outside of the fanatics people just don't like the movie...weird.
I think he cares because he likes these movies (for some reason) and Dark Phoenix is a blemish. So he's finding a way to take it out of the line-up of the other X-men movies.
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Post by dazz on Jul 29, 2020 6:47:37 GMT
That depends on contract issues, like what obligations the studios have with theatre chains, what the contracts promise the talent and such, as happened with the recent Troll's movie, by going streaming it cut out the actors box office bonuses and I think they are or were planning on suing the studio over it.
It's also Hollywood accounting, even though Disney didn't spend a penny to make that movie they will use it's cost's and it's off of the box office financial failure as a way to right off millions so that they can not pay taxes on something or other.
Why he even cares I don't know, I like box office numbers and just like to see what the nitty gritty is, I really don't care if a film does more or worse box office wise, unless it's a movie in a franchise or an IP I want to see become a franchise, and so success or failure holds a lot of sway.
But also his statement that Dark Phoenix and New Mutants will be huge hits on home media, Dark Phoenix hasn't even cracked $20m in DVD and Blu-ray sales domestically yet apparently, so much for it being a big hit, almost as if universally outside of the fanatics people just don't like the movie...weird.
I think he cares because he likes these movies (for some reason) and Dark Phoenix is a blemish. So he's finding a way to take it out of the line-up of the other X-men movies. Yeah but I like The Incredible Hulk doesn't mean I need to justify why it's not a financial flop, it is, box office wise Marvel lost money on that movie, I could try and justify why it wasn't a failure in other ways, but box office wise there is no way Marvel made their money back on that movie, but the success of Iron Man alone offset that lose completely so who cares? Fox sold X-Men and everything else, so that $200m they spent was a negligible loss, but it's still a loss, and whether it made $250m or $700m the FoX-Men were dead either way after the acquisition so it's success or failure didn't really matter.
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Post by politicidal on Jul 29, 2020 21:33:44 GMT
That depends on contract issues, like what obligations the studios have with theatre chains, what the contracts promise the talent and such, as happened with the recent Troll's movie, by going streaming it cut out the actors box office bonuses and I think they are or were planning on suing the studio over it.
It's also Hollywood accounting, even though Disney didn't spend a penny to make that movie they will use it's cost's and it's off of the box office financial failure as a way to right off millions so that they can not pay taxes on something or other.
Why he even cares I don't know, I like box office numbers and just like to see what the nitty gritty is, I really don't care if a film does more or worse box office wise, unless it's a movie in a franchise or an IP I want to see become a franchise, and so success or failure holds a lot of sway.
But also his statement that Dark Phoenix and New Mutants will be huge hits on home media, Dark Phoenix hasn't even cracked $20m in DVD and Blu-ray sales domestically yet apparently, so much for it being a big hit, almost as if universally outside of the fanatics people just don't like the movie...weird.
I think he cares because he likes these movies (for some reason) and Dark Phoenix is a blemish. So he's finding a way to take it out of the line-up of the other X-men movies. And it's the only one? Take DP out of the equation and you still got XMEN Origins: Wolverine.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 30, 2020 19:11:45 GMT
I think he cares because he likes these movies (for some reason) and Dark Phoenix is a blemish. So he's finding a way to take it out of the line-up of the other X-men movies. And it's the only one? Take DP out of the equation and you still got XMEN Origins: Wolverine. If you notice his list, he took X-men Origins out and placed it with First Class. Not a bad movie, but was unfortunate enough to come out after X3 and X-men Origins. As if to acknowledge that it is bad, but it's in the middle of the Fox movies so we have to say that it is good to show that all the Fox movies are good.
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Post by ThatGuy on Jul 30, 2020 19:17:28 GMT
I think he cares because he likes these movies (for some reason) and Dark Phoenix is a blemish. So he's finding a way to take it out of the line-up of the other X-men movies. Yeah but I like The Incredible Hulk doesn't mean I need to justify why it's not a financial flop, it is, box office wise Marvel lost money on that movie, I could try and justify why it wasn't a failure in other ways, but box office wise there is no way Marvel made their money back on that movie, but the success of Iron Man alone offset that lose completely so who cares? Fox sold X-Men and everything else, so that $200m they spent was a negligible loss, but it's still a loss, and whether it made $250m or $700m the FoX-Men were dead either way after the acquisition so it's success or failure didn't really matter. No, I mean really likes them. Enough that he tries to fix the timeline and such.
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