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Post by Toasted Cheese on Aug 8, 2020 0:40:39 GMT
It is when forced and conditioned onto a child and they grow up with a pigs swill of belief which can be difficult to undo. There is plenty of evidence of what harm religious belief can create. We have amongst us the presence of Arlon to demonstrate that exposure to said pig's swill has resulted in his belief that witches walk in our midst, doing witchly deeds. Small wonder he opines elsewhere that scientists are 'going out of business'. Actually, he has quite a lot of colorful opinions regarding science v. religion, as this thread amply demonstrates: IMDB2.freeforums.net/thread/235642/school-cancels-bible-class-interest He more often than not ends up unwittingly opining himself into the briar patch and being a place he never grew up in, finds it difficult to traipse around in it. I don't know if it is entertaining or sad to witness at times.
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Post by Dirty Santa PaulsLaugh on Aug 8, 2020 4:07:56 GMT
To whom it may concern. Trump has a longer history of being a Democrat than a Republican, so what did Dirty Santa PaulsLaugh mean?   Er, that he's a fucking opportunist who follows wherever he thinks the money trail will lead? This is news to you? This statement is "turd polishing." Ar is making a roundabout excuse that Trump never wanted to be president and does not want to be re-elected, but it will be the Democrats fault if he does win in November.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 8, 2020 6:53:48 GMT
Pardon my curiosity, if money isn't your god, what is? It definitely isn't yours. How would you know?
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 8, 2020 6:54:33 GMT
Er, that he's a fucking opportunist who follows wherever he thinks the money trail will lead? This is news to you? This statement is "turd polishing." Ar is making a roundabout excuse that Trump never wanted to be president and does not want to be re-elected, but it will be the Democrats fault if he does win in November. I didn't realize there were experts in that field.
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Post by amyghost on Aug 8, 2020 11:11:51 GMT
It definitely isn't yours. How would you know? Let's call it an educated guess. Can't wait to see the ad homs you append to that one.
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Post by amyghost on Aug 8, 2020 11:14:01 GMT
We have amongst us the presence of Arlon to demonstrate that exposure to said pig's swill has resulted in his belief that witches walk in our midst, doing witchly deeds. Small wonder he opines elsewhere that scientists are 'going out of business'. Actually, he has quite a lot of colorful opinions regarding science v. religion, as this thread amply demonstrates: IMDB2.freeforums.net/thread/235642/school-cancels-bible-class-interestHe more often than not ends up unwittingly opining himself into the briar patch and being a place he never grew up in, finds it difficult to traipse around in it. I don't know if it is entertaining or sad to witness at times. His attempts to sound like a scientist are both particularly trying and pathetic. 'Glutton for punishment' seems to be the phrase that best sums it up when he haunts those threads.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 8, 2020 11:42:49 GMT
Let's call it an educated guess. Can't wait to see the ad homs you append to that one. So its a wrong guess with your education? So far I'm sure it is. How was that?
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 8, 2020 11:44:45 GMT
He more often than not ends up unwittingly opining himself into the briar patch and being a place he never grew up in, finds it difficult to traipse around in it. I don't know if it is entertaining or sad to witness at times. 'Glutton for punishment' seems to be the phrase that best sums it up when he haunts those threads. There's a lot of that going around.
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Post by amyghost on Aug 9, 2020 11:58:36 GMT
Let's call it an educated guess. Can't wait to see the ad homs you append to that one. So its a wrong guess with your education? So far I'm sure it is. How was that? Pretty lame, even for you  .
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Post by amyghost on Aug 9, 2020 12:01:54 GMT
His attempts to sound like a scientist are both particularly trying and pathetic. 'Glutton for punishment' seems to be the phrase that best sums it up when he haunts those threads. There's a lot of that going around. Some of it coming from actual scientists, which you're far from being. Why you wish to keep blatantly parading your ignorance is best known to yourself. Perhaps you suffer from that particular complex, shared by many Christians, that seeks to make oneself an object of humiliation and persecution...making oneself a cross for others to bear, the better to feel oneself qualified to bear a cross  .
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 9, 2020 12:28:47 GMT
There's a lot of that going around. Some of it coming from actual scientists, which you're far from being. Why you wish to keep blatantly parading your ignorance is best known to yourself. Perhaps you suffer from that particular complex, shared by many Christians, that seeks to make oneself an object of humiliation and persecution...making oneself a cross for others to bear, the better to feel oneself qualified to bear a cross . It's not as amusing as you might think watching retarded public school kids trying to use the internet as an authority on science. You are not seeing the comparison of the child-like faith some people have in religion and the child-like faith you have in science. It's actually stunningly similar and actually more error prone in your case. It worked in elementary school for both sides to merely accept what they imagine is authority without question, having no talent or foundation from which to question authority anyway. It has become increasingly necessary though that both sides get out of that mode and actually develop an understanding of religion and science they should have developed in higher learning. I might currently be in a minority now, but there isn't a sensible majority to join at the moment. Sensible people will just have to join me.
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Post by amyghost on Aug 9, 2020 14:00:32 GMT
Some of it coming from actual scientists, which you're far from being. Why you wish to keep blatantly parading your ignorance is best known to yourself. Perhaps you suffer from that particular complex, shared by many Christians, that seeks to make oneself an object of humiliation and persecution...making oneself a cross for others to bear, the better to feel oneself qualified to bear a cross . You are not seeing the comparison of the child-like faith some people have in religion and the child-like faith you have in science. It's actually stunningly similar and actually more error prone in your case. It worked in elementary school for both sides to merely accept what they imagine is authority without question, having no talent or foundation from which to question authority anyway. It has become increasingly necessary though that both sides get out of that mode and actually develop an understanding of religion and science they should have developed in higher learning. I might currently be in a minority now, but there isn't a sensible majority to join at the moment. Sensible people will just have to join me. Actually, it is; reading your successive screed proves that. Of course, even the most amusing things have the ability to become tiresome after a while. Anyone who accepts the doctrines of sky-fairy religions of whatever stripe is prone from the word go to accept authority without question, Arlon--which just makes it all the more amusing to watch you posit yourself as any sort of independent mind, when that mind is so completely in thrall to sky-fairy notions. But bless your heart. Keep trying, anyway. It is the internet, so if you keep at it long enough, sooner or later you're bound to develop a following.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 9, 2020 16:34:15 GMT
It's not as amusing as you might think watching retarded public school kids trying to use the internet as an authority on science. You are not seeing the comparison of the child-like faith some people have in religion and the child-like faith you have in science. It's actually stunningly similar and actually more error prone in your case. It worked in elementary school for both sides to merely accept what they imagine is authority without question, having no talent or foundation from which to question authority anyway. It has become increasingly necessary though that both sides get out of that mode and actually develop an understanding of religion and science they should have developed in higher learning. I might currently be in a minority now, but there isn't a sensible majority to join at the moment. Sensible people will just have to join me. Actually, it is; reading your successive screed proves that. Of course, even the most amusing things have the ability to become tiresome after a while. Anyone who accepts the doctrines of sky-fairy religions of whatever stripe is prone from the word go to accept authority without question, Arlon--which just makes it all the more amusing to watch you posit yourself as any sort of independent mind, when that mind is so completely in thrall to sky-fairy notions. But bless your heart. Keep trying, anyway. It is the internet, so if you keep at it long enough, sooner or later you're bound to develop a following. I'm quite certain very many people who attend religious services regularly do not believe in a "sky fairy" as much as you think they do. Rather both actual religion and actual science are equally far over your head.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Aug 9, 2020 18:10:50 GMT
Actually, it is; reading your successive screed proves that. Of course, even the most amusing things have the ability to become tiresome after a while. Anyone who accepts the doctrines of sky-fairy religions of whatever stripe is prone from the word go to accept authority without question, Arlon--which just makes it all the more amusing to watch you posit yourself as any sort of independent mind, when that mind is so completely in thrall to sky-fairy notions. But bless your heart. Keep trying, anyway. It is the internet, so if you keep at it long enough, sooner or later you're bound to develop a following. I'm quite certain very many people who attend religious services regularly do not believe in a "sky fairy" as much as you think they do. We have been here before and Arlon, who himself loves to mock stupid "christians", has yet to show that many (in fact a majority) of Christians do not believe in a deity which is personal (In the scriptures of the Abrahamic religions, God is described as being a personal creator, speaking in the first person) and deliberate (he designed creation to a plan). A supposed entity typically full of love, capable of jealousy, anger. pride and compassion & etc, all of which of course are human characteristics. A Pew survey discovered that 56% of Americans believe in the God of the Bible and that "the great majority of Americans who believe in “God as described in the Bible” envision “an all-powerful, all-knowing, loving deity who determines most or all of what happens in their lives,” the survey found... Overall, eight-in-ten self-identified Christians say they believe in the God of the Bible, nearly all adults who say they believe in the God of the Bible say they think God loves all people regardless of their faults. Simply put, those who believe in the God of the Bible tend to perceive a more powerful, knowing, benevolent and active deity. (Roughly a quarter (23 percent) of all the “yes” respondents said they believed instead merely in a “higher power or spiritual force.”) www.pewtrusts.org/en/trust/archive/fall-2018/when-you-say-you-believe-in-god-what-do-you-mean www.pewforum.org/2018/04/25/when-americans-say-they-believe-in-god-what-do-they-mean/A majority of believers also pray every day, which also suggests that they expect the divine to be a personal one, with deliberation and an anticipated will to act on their behalf. www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/frequency-of-prayer/ Nearly eight-in-ten U.S. adults think God or a higher power has protected them, and two-thirds say they have been rewarded by the Almighty. It is ironic to be certain about what others believe in when not certain about one's own preferred version of God. In recent messages for instance Arlon has decided that the Almighty is, variously, a 'code of ethics', then 'the essence of nature' then on to something 'entirely abstract' and, most recently, a thing entirely 'vague and nebulous', not all of which is compatible.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 9, 2020 18:43:00 GMT
I'm quite certain very many people who attend religious services regularly do not believe in a "sky fairy" as much as you think they do. and Arlon has yet to show that many (in fact a majority) of Christians do not believe in a deity which is personal (In the scriptures of the Abrahamic religions, God is described as being a personal creator, speaking in the first person) and deliberate (he designed creation to a plan). A supposed entity typically full of love, capable of jealousy, anger. pride and compassion & etc, all of which of course are human characteristics. A Pew survey discovered that 56% of Americans believe in the God of the Bible and that "the great majority of Americans who believe in “God as described in the Bible” envision “an all-powerful, all-knowing, loving deity who determines most or all of what happens in their lives,” the survey found... Overall, eight-in-ten self-identified Christians say they believe in the God of the Bible, nearly all adults who say they believe in the God of the Bible say they think God loves all people regardless of their faults. Simply put, those who believe in the God of the Bible tend to perceive a more powerful, knowing, benevolent and active deity. (Roughly a quarter (23 percent) of all the “yes” respondents said they believed instead merely in a “higher power or spiritual force.”) www.pewtrusts.org/en/trust/archive/fall-2018/when-you-say-you-believe-in-god-what-do-you-mean www.pewforum.org/2018/04/25/when-americans-say-they-believe-in-god-what-do-they-mean/A majority of believers also pray every day, which also suggests that they expect the divine to be a personal one, with deliberation and an anticipated will to act on their behalf. www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/frequency-of-prayer/ Nearly eight-in-ten U.S. adults think God or a higher power has protected them, and two-thirds say they have been rewarded by the Almighty. It is ironic to be certain about what others believe in when not certain about one's own preferred version of God. In recent messages for instance Arlon has decided that the Almighty is, variously, a 'code of ethics', then 'the essence of nature' then on to something 'entirely abstract' and, most recently, a thing entirely 'vague and nebulous', not all of which is compatible. Your obvious severe lack of sophistication means we will probably see your complaints ad infinitum. I realize how difficult it is for you, but try to understand that if you cannot read the Bible because you cannot take it literally, you cannot read the opinions of people on the Bible since they are similarly artful. I have showed you several times how surveys might find whatever they like by how they are worded.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Aug 9, 2020 18:53:36 GMT
We have been here before and Arlon has yet to show that many (in fact a majority) of Christians do not believe in a deity which is personal (In the scriptures of the Abrahamic religions, God is described as being a personal creator, speaking in the first person) and deliberate (he designed creation to a plan). A supposed entity typically full of love, capable of jealousy, anger. pride and compassion & etc, all of which of course are human characteristics. A Pew survey discovered that 56% of Americans believe in the God of the Bible and that "the great majority of Americans who believe in “God as described in the Bible” envision “an all-powerful, all-knowing, loving deity who determines most or all of what happens in their lives,” the survey found... Overall, eight-in-ten self-identified Christians say they believe in the God of the Bible, nearly all adults who say they believe in the God of the Bible say they think God loves all people regardless of their faults. Simply put, those who believe in the God of the Bible tend to perceive a more powerful, knowing, benevolent and active deity. (Roughly a quarter (23 percent) of all the “yes” respondents said they believed instead merely in a “higher power or spiritual force.”) www.pewtrusts.org/en/trust/archive/fall-2018/when-you-say-you-believe-in-god-what-do-you-mean www.pewforum.org/2018/04/25/when-americans-say-they-believe-in-god-what-do-they-mean/A majority of believers also pray every day, which also suggests that they expect the divine to be a personal one, with deliberation and an anticipated will to act on their behalf. www.pewforum.org/religious-landscape-study/frequency-of-prayer/ Nearly eight-in-ten U.S. adults think God or a higher power has protected them, and two-thirds say they have been rewarded by the Almighty. It is ironic to be certain about what others believe in when not certain about one's own preferred version of God. In recent messages for instance Arlon has decided that the Almighty is, variously, a 'code of ethics', then 'the essence of nature' then on to something 'entirely abstract' and, most recently, a thing entirely 'vague and nebulous', not all of which is compatible. Your obvious severe lack of sophistication means we will probably see your complaints ad infinitum. I realize how difficult it is for you, but try to understand that if you cannot read the Bible because you cannot take it literally, you cannot read the opinions of people on the Bible since they are similarly artful. I have showed you several times how surveys might find whatever they like by how they are worded. You yourself have used Pew in rare moments of substantiation my friend, lol. And I am only reporting on what so many of the religious say about themselves and what they believe when asked. I realise you think them stupid (as you do anyone who does not agree with you), but there it is anyway. And some of the Bible is to be taken literally, and is taken so by many. Sorry about that.
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Post by Arlon10 on Aug 9, 2020 23:54:02 GMT
Your obvious severe lack of sophistication means we will probably see your complaints ad infinitum. I realize how difficult it is for you, but try to understand that if you cannot read the Bible because you cannot take it literally, you cannot read the opinions of people on the Bible since they are similarly artful. I have showed you several times how surveys might find whatever they like by how they are worded. You yourself have used Pew in rare moments of substantiation my friend, lol. And I am only reporting on what so many of the religious say about themselves and what they believe when asked. I realise you think them stupid (as you do anyone who does not agree with you), but there it is anyway. And some of the Bible is to be taken literally, and is taken so by many. Sorry about that. I am going to try to explain the "ad hominem" thing yet another way. Suppose there is a child who is a discipline problem in elementary school. He does not understand the lesson topic and argues with the teacher. He makes rules for the teacher to follow that are not really rules. Obviously the teacher has no choice but to have the child removed from the class until his behavior improves. If he claims that an " ad hominem" is being used against him by the teacher and the teacher needs to provide what the child considers evidence of anything there really isn't anything the teacher can do about that. The child is the problem because he is flawed. It can be illogical to claim that other people are also wrong because the child is. It is possible the others do not have all the same beliefs the discipline problem has and arrived at their positions by other means. That would be one time an ad hominem is illogical. It can be inexpedient to pursue "reasoning" which is not theirs. It is logical however to point out to the child that his methods are flawed and that he must be removed from the class. It is also very expedient and just. You are that discipline problem. There is no "logical" solution that you will accept despite your protests that there is. The bottom line is that you are the problem. There is no other logical solution to the problem than to throw you out of the class. Speaking of "witches" using poisons elsewhere in this thread, it appears you got some sort of poison along the way. Did you perhaps cross up a group of whatever at one time? I do understand better than you do that noting a person's problems is socially unacceptable in quite many circumstances. That is totally different from "illogical" applications of one person's problems to other people who might appear to have the same interests. Unless the person with the problem is pressing it on you then you do not need to address it. However if he takes a position in the class that is beyond his ability, then it is necessary to remove him, whatever he might think about that. You are obviously confused by the "rules" because of your crippled simplicity. There are times when an ad hominem is illogical and times when it is most logical. There are times when an ad populum is just and times when it is not. So it is with most types of arguments. That's why experienced debaters do not generally invoke "rules" to win any points. The product of inferior public schools tries to win arguments by making "rules" that give them the win despite how obviously they are losing (tornado-junkyard e.g.). They try hopelessly to maintain a list of rules on the internet. Experienced debaters rather address the special type of argument that applies to the circumstances. I analyze surveys to arrive at whatever conclusions if any can be drawn. Not all surveys are conducted well and some are obviously designed to mislead.
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Post by drystyx on Aug 10, 2020 1:12:26 GMT
"Honoring Nature" is the total opposite of all the other items listed, and is indeed witchcraft.
The others are the exact opposite of "witchcraft".
So, what we have here is a disguised attempt to equate "honoring Nature" with loving. Incredible that "loving animals" is on the same list, when that is the exact opposite of "honoring Nature". "Honoring Nature" means not giving your cat shots, not caring for your cat, not killing the fleas. It means letting your pet experience the hatefulness of Nature.
There is actually witchcraft in fundamentalist Christianity, since the fundamentalist believes the Good God created the laws of Physics which are the worst possible laws for any Universe, and biological life, which is the worst possible life a being could create. Indeed, these are proof of dualism and Gnosticism, that the hateful demonic beings are at work. Honoring Nature is honoring Hate.
I must admit that the list does disguise the hatefulness of Nature better than most attempts to do so, hiding it among the things that are the opposite of Witchcraft, but it is what it is. And I've been saying that line long before a certain president stole it from me.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Aug 10, 2020 4:31:25 GMT
There's a lot of that going around. Some of it coming from actual scientists, which you're far from being. Why you wish to keep blatantly parading your ignorance is best known to yourself. Perhaps you suffer from that particular complex, shared by many Christians, that seeks to make oneself an object of humiliation and persecution...making oneself a cross for others to bear, the better to feel oneself qualified to bear a cross . The biggest victim and pity party parader always comes out on top, but sadly and ironically get left behind at the same time.
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Post by amyghost on Aug 10, 2020 11:46:16 GMT
Actually, it is; reading your successive screed proves that. Of course, even the most amusing things have the ability to become tiresome after a while. Anyone who accepts the doctrines of sky-fairy religions of whatever stripe is prone from the word go to accept authority without question, Arlon--which just makes it all the more amusing to watch you posit yourself as any sort of independent mind, when that mind is so completely in thrall to sky-fairy notions. But bless your heart. Keep trying, anyway. It is the internet, so if you keep at it long enough, sooner or later you're bound to develop a following. I'm quite certain very many people who attend religious services regularly do not believe in a "sky fairy" as much as you think they do. Rather both actual religion and actual science are equally far over your head. Arlon, it's clear you come here only for purposes of validating yourself to yourself; thus the continual streams of ad homs relating to others' intelligence, educational background, learning curves, etc. You're an obviously deeply insecure individual, and if you want/need to get your self-esteem jollies by continuing to punch away at this tired gambit, be my guest. Just don't expect me to play along. And do be aware that others here are watching your performance and forming their own opinions about it.
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