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Post by formersamhmd on May 7, 2017 18:19:36 GMT
Ah yes, this ever present "formula" no one can ever define. It's been defined. They make CMBs that are full of hipster dialogue, are ashamed and grounded and focused on villains, and that are not wondrous. That's the DC formula, actually.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 18:26:24 GMT
I feel they should skip the origin story, like that video I posted on the Fox-Men board. Just let a tour group that enters the Baxter Building see a short, animated version of their origin in the lobby while they're touring it, since the FF are celebrities. I don't know, man. I feel like their origin is just too important. Especially for The Thing. We need to know these characters before they are transformed otherwise it will risk feeling hallow. Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 18:34:32 GMT
I don't know, man. I feel like their origin is just too important. Especially for The Thing. We need to know these characters before they are transformed otherwise it will risk feeling hallow. Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground. A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. In regards to BvS I think their version of Batman fails precisely because we were supposed to know who he is and what he's all about rather than the movie actually showing us. But in regards to origin stories being done over and over... I think it's a reason not to reboot rather than a reason to just skip the beginning of a character's journey. However, Fantastic Four should do it again because general audiences are not any where near as familiar with them as Batman. Also, the last two origin story movies for F4 weren't massive hits like SM 1 or TASM, or Batman Begins... so doing it again isn't quite as redundant.
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 18:40:25 GMT
I feel they should skip the origin story, like that video I posted on the Fox-Men board. Just let a tour group that enters the Baxter Building see a short, animated version of their origin in the lobby while they're touring it, since the FF are celebrities. I don't know, man. I feel like their origin is just too important. Especially for The Thing. We need to know these characters before they are transformed otherwise it will risk feeling hallow. Agreed.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 18:41:44 GMT
Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground. A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. In regards to BvS I think their version of Batman fails precisely because we were supposed to know who he is and what he's all about rather than the movie actually showing us. But in regards to origin stories being done over and over... I think it's a reason not to reboot rather than a reason to just skip the beginning of a character's journey. However, Fantastic Four should do it again because general audiences are not any where near as familiar with them as Batman. Also, the last two origin story movies for F4 weren't massive hits like SM 1 or TASM, or Batman Begins... so doing it again isn't quite as redundant. I don't agree with you on this, because people have been able to pick up on the Fantastic Four's story without seeing the origin for decades now. I still believe that their origin should be minimal the next time around, but to each their own.
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 18:43:48 GMT
I don't know, man. I feel like their origin is just too important. Especially for The Thing. We need to know these characters before they are transformed otherwise it will risk feeling hallow. Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground. Batman has been around since 1939 and is the 2nd most famous and most iconic superhero in American comics. Most people are familiar with the Batman origin. But not the same with Fantastic Four. Most people aren't familiar with the Fantastic Four's origin.
But all this is moot anyway because MCU doesn't have the rights to Fantastic Four and is never going to get them. There's a better chance of Fox making an X-Men/Fantastic Four crossover movie than MCU making a Fantastic Four movie.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 18:44:47 GMT
A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. In regards to BvS I think their version of Batman fails precisely because we were supposed to know who he is and what he's all about rather than the movie actually showing us. But in regards to origin stories being done over and over... I think it's a reason not to reboot rather than a reason to just skip the beginning of a character's journey. However, Fantastic Four should do it again because general audiences are not any where near as familiar with them as Batman. Also, the last two origin story movies for F4 weren't massive hits like SM 1 or TASM, or Batman Begins... so doing it again isn't quite as redundant. I don't agree with you on this, because people have been able to pick up on the Fantastic Four's story without seeing the origin for decades now. I still believe that their origin should be minimal the next time around, but to each their own. Origin story or not... I'll just be glad to get a FF movie that's actually good!
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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on May 7, 2017 18:48:12 GMT
Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground. A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. Is this still 100% true in the age of the mega-franchise? I ask respectfully. Guide my saber from the great beyond.
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Post by Deleted on May 7, 2017 18:50:02 GMT
I don't agree with you on this, because people have been able to pick up on the Fantastic Four's story without seeing the origin for decades now. I still believe that their origin should be minimal the next time around, but to each their own. Origin story or not... I'll just be glad to get a FF movie that's actually good! Fingers crossed. It's a shame to lose to Michael Chiklis, though. Even if the mid-2000s films weren't that hot, he was great as Ben Grimm.
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agentblue
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Post by agentblue on May 7, 2017 19:31:51 GMT
Thomas and Martha Wayne being shot in Crime Alley is just as important to understanding Bruce Wayne, but it's been done so many times that everyone pretty knows why he dresses like a flying rodent now. We didn't need to see it AGAIN in Batman v Superman. Despite the reputation of the 2005-07 FF films, enough people have seen them or heard of the Fantastic Four that I don't think we need to retread old ground. Batman has been around since 1939 and is the 2nd most famous and most iconic superhero in American comics. Most people are familiar with the Batman origin. But not the same with Fantastic Four. Most people aren't familiar with the Fantastic Four's origin.
But all this is moot anyway because MCU doesn't have the rights to Fantastic Four and is never going to get them. There's a better chance of Fox making an X-Men/Fantastic Four crossover movie than MCU making a Fantastic Four movie.
Yeah unless something major happens Marvel isnt getting those rights back at all.
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 19:46:49 GMT
I don't agree with you on this, because people have been able to pick up on the Fantastic Four's story without seeing the origin for decades now. I still believe that their origin should be minimal the next time around, but to each their own. Origin story or not... I'll just be glad to get a FF movie that's actually good! Already did. The 2005 Fantastic Four movie (starring Ioan Gruffeld and Jessica Alba) was good and definitely much better than any of the crap put out by MCU.
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Post by ThatGuy on May 7, 2017 19:47:39 GMT
A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. In regards to BvS I think their version of Batman fails precisely because we were supposed to know who he is and what he's all about rather than the movie actually showing us. But in regards to origin stories being done over and over... I think it's a reason not to reboot rather than a reason to just skip the beginning of a character's journey. However, Fantastic Four should do it again because general audiences are not any where near as familiar with them as Batman. Also, the last two origin story movies for F4 weren't massive hits like SM 1 or TASM, or Batman Begins... so doing it again isn't quite as redundant. I don't agree with you on this, because people have been able to pick up on the Fantastic Four's story without seeing the origin for decades now. I still believe that their origin should be minimal the next time around, but to each their own. I think the origin story would be better if it went directly into their movie's story. The previous movies' origins were just a part of the movie and really didn't serve as furthering the story. It was just origin, pause, rest of the movie. They both got their powers, had to be studied for a bit, then go into the rest of the movie. Which felt like a totally different movie. That's why I think them getting their powers should teleport them someplace so there wouldn't be that break in the story. Have them figure out their powers while on the adventure.
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 19:49:54 GMT
A movie should never rely on the audience having outside information about its characters. Never. Is this still 100% true in the age of the mega-franchise? Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A good movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own.
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 19:50:50 GMT
Origin story or not... I'll just be glad to get a FF movie that's actually good! Fingers crossed. It's a shame to lose to Michael Chiklis, though. Even if the mid-2000s films weren't that hot, he was great as Ben Grimm. The 2005 Fantastic Four movie (starring Ioan Gruffeld and Jessica Alba) was good and definitely much better than any of the crap put out by MCU.
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Post by ThatGuy on May 7, 2017 19:55:29 GMT
Batman has been around since 1939 and is the 2nd most famous and most iconic superhero in American comics. Most people are familiar with the Batman origin. But not the same with Fantastic Four. Most people aren't familiar with the Fantastic Four's origin.
But all this is moot anyway because MCU doesn't have the rights to Fantastic Four and is never going to get them. There's a better chance of Fox making an X-Men/Fantastic Four crossover movie than MCU making a Fantastic Four movie.
Yeah unless something major happens Marvel isnt getting those rights back at all. Like them losing a lot of money on the previous installment? This would have them not make F4 movies... probably ever. And then the rights revert back to Marvel. They'd have to make a F4 movie to keep the rights. You think they'd risk another bomb?
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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on May 7, 2017 20:01:38 GMT
Is this still 100% true in the age of the mega-franchise? Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own. You are rude and vexing in the extreme, DC-Fan . So much so that I imagine all of your posts delivered in Hitler's oratory style - a breathless, yelling session punctuated by random pauses and commanding hand gestures. Can you not disagree with a person in a civil fashion? And anyway, I was talking to his Lordship, @forceghostackbar - not you. One day you will post a rational thread with a cohesive, non-divisive and thoughtful thesis. On that day, I will be there to welcome you into the human family. It may take some time but, never fear, Atomica is patience incarnate. This will be your last feeding for the interval. Enjoy the rest of your weekend.
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zoilus
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Post by zoilus on May 7, 2017 20:05:08 GMT
The 2005 Fantastic Four movie (starring Ioan Gruffeld and Jessica Alba) was good and definitely much better than any of the crap put out by MCU. Who else was in that? Michael Chiklis? And...Chris something? Chris Evans? What's he been doing since? Led 3 movies that made a billion $ each?
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Post by DC-Fan on May 7, 2017 20:06:52 GMT
Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own. You are rude and vexing in the extreme, DC-Fan . So much so that I imagine all of your posts delivered in Hitler's oratory style - a breathless, yelling session punctuated by random pauses and commanding hand gestures. Can you not disagree with a person in a civil fashion? And anyway, I was talking to his Lordship, @forceghostackbar - not you. One day you will post a rational thread with a cohesive, non-divisive and thoughtful thesis. On that day, I will be there to welcome you into the human family. It may take some time but, never fear, Atomica is patience incarnate. This will be your last feeding for the interval. Enjoy the rest of your weekend. How is this not civil?
Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A good movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own.
I'm not the 1 who's resorting to personal insults. It's you MCU fans who keep resorting to personal insults because you know your arguments are weak so you resort to personal insults thinking that's going to make your argument stronger when all it does is further demonstrate that your arguments are weak.
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Post by ThatGuy on May 7, 2017 20:09:12 GMT
Is this still 100% true in the age of the mega-franchise? Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own. All those franchises are self-contained. Anything you get extra is just that, extra. All the books give you extra backstory on characters, objects and places. You don't need to read or watch any of it to get what is going on in the movie you are watching. But watching BvS, can you tell me what the Omega symbol on the ground means? Who were the flying demons in Batman's dream? Who was that guy in the red that was talking to Bruce through the portal? Why was that one pod open in Man of Steel? Why did I have to read a comic to know Kara Zor-El was in it? In BvS, who's suit was that in the case with the spray paint on it? Who put the spray paint on it? These aren't things that background easter eggs because they are points of focus. None of these things are touched upon in the movie they are shown in. Will they be touched on later? Nobody knows. But it shows that those movies aren't self-contained.
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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on May 7, 2017 20:17:29 GMT
You are rude and vexing in the extreme, DC-Fan . So much so that I imagine all of your posts delivered in Hitler's oratory style - a breathless, yelling session punctuated by random pauses and commanding hand gestures. Can you not disagree with a person in a civil fashion? And anyway, I was talking to his Lordship, @forceghostackbar - not you. One day you will post a rational thread with a cohesive, non-divisive and thoughtful thesis. On that day, I will be there to welcome you into the human family. It may take some time but, never fear, Atomica is patience incarnate. This will be your last feeding for the interval. Enjoy the rest of your weekend. How is this not civil?
Yes, it's still 100% true and will always be 100% true. The Star Wars and Star Trek movies should never rely on the audience having read any novels or watched any animated series. And MCU shouldn't rely on the audience having outside information either. A good movie franchise must be self-contained and be able to stand on its own.
I'm not the 1 who's resorting to personal insults. It's you MCU fans who keep resorting to personal insults because you know your arguments are weak so you resort to personal insults thinking that's going to make your argument stronger when all it does is further demonstrate that your arguments are weak.
Your declaration is filled with jarring absolutes that leave no room for discussion or invitation to debate. I apologize for my earlier comments.
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