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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 6, 2020 18:29:21 GMT
.....it was more like a hijacking. Enjoy.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Oct 6, 2020 19:15:52 GMT
A hijacking of what?
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 6, 2020 19:32:10 GMT
The concept of brotherhood.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Oct 6, 2020 19:35:15 GMT
The concept of brotherhood. 'Brotherhood' could mean a host of things and sounds woolly.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 6, 2020 19:38:38 GMT
The concept of brotherhood. 'Brotherhood' could mean a host of things and sounds woolly. You're right. And with Freemasons in charge it becomes a more exclusive brotherhood than the kind of brotherhood God intended.
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Oct 6, 2020 19:41:26 GMT
'Brotherhood' could mean a host of things and sounds woolly. You're right. And with Freemasons in charge it becomes a more exclusive brotherhood than the kind of brotherhood God intended. I thought you were talking about the Enlightenment?
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 6, 2020 19:47:53 GMT
You're right. And with Freemasons in charge it becomes a more exclusive brotherhood than the kind of brotherhood God intended. I thought you were talking about the Enlightenment? Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO.
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Post by goz on Oct 6, 2020 22:07:42 GMT
I thought you were talking about the Enlightenment? Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO. lol
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 7, 2020 19:02:51 GMT
Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO. Professor, you are required to research and write a book to prove this theory non-idiotic. I'd be happy to, if I can ever get the time.
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Post by goz on Oct 7, 2020 21:18:59 GMT
I watched most of that ( gave it away when he started reading Biblical texts to back his flimsy illogical and historically incorrect points.
You ( and this Religious person who I assume is Catholic?) confuse and conflate many things about BOTH Freemasonry AND The Enlightenment. ( as most of these cranks you watch and post usually do.)
The Enlightenment:
Hence your claim that Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO. is substantially unfounded.
Whilst predating the Enlightenment in its infancy, Freemasonry as it is known today was not started until the early 18th century, whereas the Enlightenment began as early as 1500. Also the aims of the two movements were substantively different, though it is possible to see BOTH you ( a science denier) and the Church, to be critical of both because BOTH movements down grade the power of Church particularly Catholic and Jewish religions.
It is also drawing quite a long bow to accuse either solely being to 'blame' ( as you and the cleric in the video) for communism or solidarity of 'brotherhood'.
There is an inconsistency of logic to this except that, as the cleric says...there was a divisiveness n both that lessened the important and power of the established religious institutions, in common. Whilst IMHO it is likely that the Enlightenment influenced Freemasonry, I VERY much doubt that the reverse is true.[/b]
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 8, 2020 0:04:10 GMT
I watched most of that ( gave it away when he started reading Biblical texts to back his flimsy illogical and historically incorrect points. You ( and this Religious person who I assume is Catholic?) confuse and conflate many things about BOTH Freemasonry AND The Enlightenment. ( as most of these cranks you watch and post usually do.) The Enlightenment: Hence your claim that Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO. is substantially unfounded.
Whilst predating the Enlightenment in its infancy, Freemasonry as it is known today was not started until the early 18th century, whereas the Enlightenment began as early as 1500. Also the aims of the two movements were substantively different, though it is possible to see BOTH you ( a science denier) and the Church, to be critical of both because BOTH movements down grade the power of Church particularly Catholic and Jewish religions.
It is also drawing quite a long bow to accuse either solely being to 'blame' ( as you and the cleric in the video) for communism or solidarity of 'brotherhood'.
There is an inconsistency of logic to this except that, as the cleric says...there was a divisiveness n both that lessened the important and power of the established religious institutions, in common. Whilst IMHO it is likely that the Enlightenment influenced Freemasonry, I VERY much doubt that the reverse is true.lol
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Post by goz on Oct 8, 2020 0:07:30 GMT
I watched most of that ( gave it away when he started reading Biblical texts to back his flimsy illogical and historically incorrect points. You ( and this Religious person who I assume is Catholic?) confuse and conflate many things about BOTH Freemasonry AND The Enlightenment. ( as most of these cranks you watch and post usually do.) The Enlightenment: Hence your claim that Yes, I was. You wouldn't have had the Enlightenment without Freemasonry, IMO. is substantially unfounded.
Whilst predating the Enlightenment in its infancy, Freemasonry as it is known today was not started until the early 18th century, whereas the Enlightenment began as early as 1500. Also the aims of the two movements were substantively different, though it is possible to see BOTH you ( a science denier) and the Church, to be critical of both because BOTH movements down grade the power of Church particularly Catholic and Jewish religions.
It is also drawing quite a long bow to accuse either solely being to 'blame' ( as you and the cleric in the video) for communism or solidarity of 'brotherhood'.
There is an inconsistency of logic to this except that, as the cleric says...there was a divisiveness n both that lessened the important and power of the established religious institutions, in common. Whilst IMHO it is likely that the Enlightenment influenced Freemasonry, I VERY much doubt that the reverse is true.lol Where's the thanks for all the research you will need for up upcoming best selling book? I am sorry I didn't put it on youtube and wear a silly costume! Edit: ![](https://i.postimg.cc/YCxMvqG4/right.png) Fourteen of the first 43 presidents of the United States were Freemasons. ![](https://i.postimg.cc/YCxMvqG4/right.png) The Freemasons have no historical connection to the Knights Templar; no Templars were left when the organization formed. ![](https://i.postimg.cc/YCxMvqG4/right.png) There is a Masonic Grand Lodge in every one of the U.S. states as well as in the District of Columbia. ![](https://i.postimg.cc/YCxMvqG4/right.png) Some conspiracy theorists claim that the Freemasons are a cult with connections to the Illuminati or with the fabled Elders of Zion as part of an anti-Semitic claim that Jewish bankers control the world's governments.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 8, 2020 0:11:28 GMT
Where's the thanks for all the research you will need for up upcoming best selling book? I am sorry I didn't put it on youtube and wear a silly costume! Maybe you can do that next time.
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Post by goz on Oct 8, 2020 0:15:23 GMT
Where's the thanks for all the research you will need for up upcoming best selling book? I am sorry I didn't put it on youtube and wear a silly costume! Maybe you can do that next time. See my edit: OK: ![](https://media1.popsugar-assets.com/files/thumbor/xbaS6jGyfRxaSN9JKgi-2lNZVRA/fit-in/2048xorig/filters:format_auto-!!-:strip_icc-!!-/2018/10/19/754/n/1922283/51aa0cb85bca0f00edb9d3.21729276_.jpg) Oh wait...that's someone else you know! This is me: ![](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/190946765393-0-1/s-l1000.jpg)
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 8, 2020 0:18:54 GMT
Maybe you can do that next time. See my edit: OK: ![](https://media1.popsugar-assets.com/files/thumbor/xbaS6jGyfRxaSN9JKgi-2lNZVRA/fit-in/2048xorig/filters:format_auto-!!-:strip_icc-!!-/2018/10/19/754/n/1922283/51aa0cb85bca0f00edb9d3.21729276_.jpg) Oh wait...that's someone else you know! This is me: ![](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/190946765393-0-1/s-l1000.jpg) Sure you didn't get it right the first time?
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Post by goz on Oct 8, 2020 0:35:23 GMT
See my edit: OK: ![](https://media1.popsugar-assets.com/files/thumbor/xbaS6jGyfRxaSN9JKgi-2lNZVRA/fit-in/2048xorig/filters:format_auto-!!-:strip_icc-!!-/2018/10/19/754/n/1922283/51aa0cb85bca0f00edb9d3.21729276_.jpg) Oh wait...that's someone else you know! This is me: ![](https://i.ebayimg.com/images/i/190946765393-0-1/s-l1000.jpg) Sure you didn't get it right the first time? No, I am def blonde and the other one is the one with a moustache!
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Post by Winter_King on Oct 8, 2020 14:38:23 GMT
I don't how a discussion about Enlightenment ends up having pictures of sexy nuns but I like it.
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Post by goz on Oct 8, 2020 20:22:33 GMT
I don't how a discussion about Enlightenment ends up having pictures of sexy nuns but I like it. SOME sexy nuns can also write and post a small treatise on the subject, which was substantially ignored by the brainless OP.
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Post by The Herald Erjen on Oct 8, 2020 21:19:09 GMT
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Post by FilmFlaneur on Oct 8, 2020 23:01:53 GMT
From Erjen's link. "Here [Masonic meetings] you have aristocrats and merchants and schoolteachers and Lord knows what, all breaking bread together and treating one another as equals. Are they equals in reality? No, they are not. No way. But, this does create a kind of ideal that brothers can be equals. " Not much specific mention of the Enlightenment though, in the whole piece if any. I'm only bothering take up this dull thread with this reply as it is a slow evening here.
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