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Post by masterofallgoons on Dec 17, 2020 16:11:30 GMT
I'll just say again that for some reasons I've mentioned already that I think there's a little complexity with regards to this whole issue than most people are familiar with, and there is a contingency of white people being offended on behalf of others when they don't really understand it... but I always enjoy when people whine, bitch, and complain while calling others 'triggered snowflakes.' The lack of self awareness and irony is hilarious to a point where you have to question whether or not it's on purpose. Social issues are always more complicated and of course there's always a group willing to be offended on someone else's behalf. But the issues facing native peoples go back centuries and are not only unresolved, but largely undiscussed in our culture. They have virtually no advocacy in our society and government compared to other minority groups. Sports team names are literally the least of their concerns, which probably explains the results of those ridiculous polls that somehow 'prove' native people don't care about sports nicknames. "I have no job, no food, minimal education and my future prospects aren't looking great. What were you saying about a football team?" But rest assured, the community as a whole wants change... ... The snowflakes thing has always been hilarious to me. The people using it are always the first ones to get up at arms over any perceived insult to their perspective. He's here wondering whether we should "evolve." I already know he's against gay marriage, because it's a change that came about in his lifetime. I wonder how he feels about slavery or women's suffrage? Have we not 'evolved' into a better society over the centuries? A better, more fair society? Is there not still room for improvement? These are not problems because they don't affect him. Now ask him about gun control. The hypocrisy serves a central psychological purpose, though. Deep down, they know they're wrong. That's why they flip every situation and make it about them. They're somehow the victims. Systematic racism has been going on for centuries, and regarding Native peoples, European settlers took everything away from these people. But you want to take sports nicknames away? This is an assault on our heritage! These extremists want to ruin our country! It would be comical if it wasn't so depressing. All of the other stuff aside, I was just talking about the issue of nomenclature. We've been told that the correct term is 'Native American' and the 'Indian' is harmful and incorrect. My point is that the 'indigenous' people are not monolithic and don't necessarily all feel the same way. As I mentioned before the comment that has stuck with me of late was a guy saying 'I'm not a native American because there's no such thing as a Native American.' His point is that Cherokee nation is the nationality for those people, for example, and that a lot of these tribal members refer to themselves as Indian people or American Indians. The same things don't offend all the same people because we are not talking about a single unified group, there are different cultures and subcultures within the ethnicity that a lot of people all think of as being all the same thing...which to me would seem more offensive. Again, just this issue amongst the larger issue is complex, and I do think there's a part of it that is people speaking for others when it doesn't always apply to everybody. But there is a very real element of white people being offended on behalf of others while not actually respecting the ideas and feelings of the people they purport to be protecting. The best and most recent example of this explicitly happening is the ultra annoying term "Latin X." This is strictly an American progressive person disregarding the language of Spanish speaking people coming up with a solution to be inclusive and reject gendered language, but of course they didn't ask Latin people and just decided they could do it for them, which is about as non-progressive and inconsiderate as you could be. But yes, the idea of people decrying 'snowflakes' and complaining that they are calling themselves victims while making themselves victims and endlessly whining like unbelievable bitches is ridiculous, but for the most part I think it is funny. It may be a little depressing, but it's so silly that in many cases I have to assume it's a joke. It can't always be sincere. There's a guy on one of these threads saying he's not a racist while literally advocating for genocide. It's too insane to be real. For the real ones though, I understand to a degree, the maddening idea of over political correctness, and there's a discussion to be had there... but a lot of those people are just being politically correct for their people. Calling people exceptionally lame names like SJWs, and cucks, and betas, and soy boys, and whatever other sub-elementary school level name calling is just their own 'virtue-signaling' to the like-minded people to show that they are not original thinkers either, they are part of THAT group instead of the other one. As a wise man once said, "It's all bullshit and it's bad for ya."
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Dec 17, 2020 16:44:45 GMT
Social issues are always more complicated and of course there's always a group willing to be offended on someone else's behalf. But the issues facing native peoples go back centuries and are not only unresolved, but largely undiscussed in our culture. They have virtually no advocacy in our society and government compared to other minority groups. Sports team names are literally the least of their concerns, which probably explains the results of those ridiculous polls that somehow 'prove' native people don't care about sports nicknames. "I have no job, no food, minimal education and my future prospects aren't looking great. What were you saying about a football team?" But rest assured, the community as a whole wants change... ... The snowflakes thing has always been hilarious to me. The people using it are always the first ones to get up at arms over any perceived insult to their perspective. He's here wondering whether we should "evolve." I already know he's against gay marriage, because it's a change that came about in his lifetime. I wonder how he feels about slavery or women's suffrage? Have we not 'evolved' into a better society over the centuries? A better, more fair society? Is there not still room for improvement? These are not problems because they don't affect him. Now ask him about gun control. The hypocrisy serves a central psychological purpose, though. Deep down, they know they're wrong. That's why they flip every situation and make it about them. They're somehow the victims. Systematic racism has been going on for centuries, and regarding Native peoples, European settlers took everything away from these people. But you want to take sports nicknames away? This is an assault on our heritage! These extremists want to ruin our country! It would be comical if it wasn't so depressing. All of the other stuff aside, I was just talking about the issue of nomenclature. We've been told that the correct term is 'Native American' and the 'Indian' is harmful and incorrect. My point is that the 'indigenous' people are not monolithic and don't necessarily all feel the same way. As I mentioned before the comment that has stuck with me of late was a guy saying 'I'm not a native American because there's no such thing as a Native American.' His point is that Cherokee nation is the nationality for those people, for example, and that a lot of these tribal members refer to themselves as Indian people or American Indians. The same things don't offend all the same people because we are not talking about a single unified group, there are different cultures and subcultures within the ethnicity that a lot of people all think of as being all the same thing...which to me would seem more offensive. Again, just this issue amongst the larger issue is complex, and I do think there's a part of it that is people speaking for others when it doesn't always apply to everybody. But there is a very real element of white people being offended on behalf of others while not actually respecting the ideas and feelings of the people they purport to be protecting. The best and most recent example of this explicitly happening is the ultra annoying term "Latin X." This is strictly an American progressive person disregarding the language of Spanish speaking people coming up with a solution to be inclusive and reject gendered language, but of course they didn't ask Latin people and just decided they could do it for them, which is about as non-progressive and inconsiderate as you could be. But yes, the idea of people decrying 'snowflakes' and complaining that they are calling themselves victims while making themselves victims and endlessly whining like unbelievable bitches is ridiculous, but for the most part I think it is funny. It may be a little depressing, but it's so silly that in many cases I have to assume it's a joke. It can't always be sincere. There's a guy on one of these threads saying he's not a racist while literally advocating for genocide. It's too insane to be real. For the real ones though, I understand to a degree, the maddening idea of over political correctness, and there's a discussion to be had there... but a lot of those people are just being politically correct for their people. Calling people exceptionally lame names like SJWs, and cucks, and betas, and soy boys, and whatever other sub-elementary school level name calling is just their own 'virtue-signaling' to the like-minded people to show that they are not original thinkers either, they are part of THAT group instead of the other one. As a wise man once said, "It's all bullshit and it's bad for ya." Completely agree with all of this. Nomenclature isn't my place to comment on. I'm not native, I can't say whether they should or shouldn't be called Native Americans, American Indians, identify as their tribe, etc. That's up to them. And yes, part of the problem is they can't all agree-- which keeps their presence in society on the peripheral as opposed to organizations representing other minority groups. Once again, I don't have the solution to that problem. My whole point is the use of any name for their ethnicity as a sports nickname is offensive outright, because (with the exception of the Florida State Seminoles, who have the expressed permission of the tribe to use their likeness) their likeness is used without their consent in a context that equates them with animals or murderous groups (i.e., Pirates, Raiders, Vikings, etc.). Ignorant people arguing the opposite like to point out some team names represent the local community or history therein; which doesn't change anything. Do you (rhetorical question) think the people who decided to use Indian names way back when saw them as having more in common with lions and tigers, or with Paul Brown? movieliker went into full troll mode a long time ago. If you pay attention (and I don't blame you for not) to his schtick, you'll see he even reverses his stance multiple times on an issue, depending on what he thinks will get a rise out of people at the moment. But there's a guy in these threads who constantly insists people who disagree with him 'hate America' and has gone on long rants about marriage being between a man and a woman, etc. It's too insane to be fake. And political correctness can go too far, there's no question. PC culture is killing humor; and it's hard to know where the line is. But insisting there's nothing wrong with our culture is also wrong. The United States was based on some great ideas. It's still great. But it was always flawed, that's why the government set up a system to allow change, because even the brilliant men who founded this nation knew they, and thus their creation, was imperfect. It's why the constitution has amendments. People fighting to improve the society they are a part of don't 'hate' it. They just want it to be better for everyone. Hardly a radical concept. It's been going on since our nation's inception and it will continue because the betterment of our society is what defines us as a culture, whether or not some of these guys realize it. By the way, Triple Word Score for invoking Carlin.
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Post by nutsberryfarm ๐ on Dec 17, 2020 19:32:45 GMT
Cleveland Bavarians! Good name.
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