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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 5, 2021 4:59:23 GMT
Its not about what the rights are, or how they fit in with one another, but rather about the rights that are denied them just because they are LGBTQ. No rights have ever been denied anyone because they were not gay. Here's one example: Only married people can visit patients in certain hospitals. In places where the significant other is same sex that would disqualify them. There's lots of legalities that are covered by marriage for which same sex couples don't qualify. There's still a lot of institutionalized discrimination against them and, some churches still openly criticize same sex relationships as a mortal sin. There's a very very simple solution to that. Enact legislation which requires hospitals to recognize the rights of same-sex partners. It doesn't require that the ancient institution of marriage be changed by some 21st century government.
The state is not all powerful nor should it be. Be very wary of top down social change by a bunch of politicians.
Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Only 3% of gay couples have even married in the last ten years in jurisdictions where the government began trying to enact this same-sex marriage charade.
Nah, keep your marriage. Not interested.
Folks, gameboy is himself a gay man, who does not seem to believe in gay rights. We've had exchanges like this in the past where I, a person in favor of gay rights, have made arguments that would benefit them, and then gameboy, who would as a gay man would benefit from such arguments, totally disputes me. It makes me wonder if actually is gay as he claims. Go figure. By the way: Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Yeah, that's what I mean. When enough people denounce an injustice the people they voted into power make change. Its not top down. Its grass roots.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 6, 2021 7:37:46 GMT
There's a very very simple solution to that. Enact legislation which requires hospitals to recognize the rights of same-sex partners. It doesn't require that the ancient institution of marriage be changed by some 21st century government.
The state is not all powerful nor should it be. Be very wary of top down social change by a bunch of politicians.
Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Only 3% of gay couples have even married in the last ten years in jurisdictions where the government began trying to enact this same-sex marriage charade.
Nah, keep your marriage. Not interested.
Folks, gameboy is himself a gay man, who does not seem to believe in gay rights. We've had exchanges like this in the past where I, a person in favor of gay rights, have made arguments that would benefit them, and then gameboy , who would as a gay man would benefit from such arguments, totally disputes me. It makes me wonder if actually is gay as he claims. Go figure. By the way: Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Yeah, that's what I mean. When enough people denounce an injustice the people they voted into power make change. Its not top down. Its grass roots. I don't think your example of rights made a lot of sense regarding some hospital visitation rights, it was too left field and flawed. You are not gay either lenny, so when one claims they are speaking for the LGBTQI, they really don't get that either since they are not all sexualities.
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Post by gameboy on Jan 7, 2021 4:41:56 GMT
There's a very very simple solution to that. Enact legislation which requires hospitals to recognize the rights of same-sex partners. It doesn't require that the ancient institution of marriage be changed by some 21st century government.
The state is not all powerful nor should it be. Be very wary of top down social change by a bunch of politicians.
Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Only 3% of gay couples have even married in the last ten years in jurisdictions where the government began trying to enact this same-sex marriage charade.
Nah, keep your marriage. Not interested.
Folks, gameboy is himself a gay man, who does not seem to believe in gay rights. We've had exchanges like this in the past where I, a person in favor of gay rights, have made arguments that would benefit them, and then gameboy , who would as a gay man would benefit from such arguments, totally disputes me. It makes me wonder if actually is gay as he claims. Go figure. By the way: Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Yeah, that's what I mean. When enough people denounce an injustice the people they voted into power make change. Its not top down. Its grass roots. So you, a straight male, stereotype me and other gay people and tell us that we must all march in lockstep and think identically? Did you really just say I'm not gay because I oppose gay marriage? 
And no, I do not benefit from a social expectation that I must be monogamous. That's a pseudo-religious expectation and the government has no business getting involved.
It's only grass roots if gays actually want marriage for themselves. We don't. We're not voting with our feet and walking down that aisle. Most gays support fey marriage from their armchair but don't want it for themselves. It's a top down social experiment.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 8, 2021 0:05:12 GMT
Folks, gameboy is himself a gay man, who does not seem to believe in gay rights. We've had exchanges like this in the past where I, a person in favor of gay rights, have made arguments that would benefit them, and then gameboy , who would as a gay man would benefit from such arguments, totally disputes me. It makes me wonder if actually is gay as he claims. Go figure. By the way: Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Yeah, that's what I mean. When enough people denounce an injustice the people they voted into power make change. Its not top down. Its grass roots. I don't think your example of rights made a lot of sense regarding some hospital visitation rights, it was too left field and flawed. You are not gay either lenny, so when one claims they are speaking for the LGBTQI, they really don't get that either since they are not all sexualities. One doesn't have to be gay in order to be an ally to gay movements. I'm not black either. Nor a woman.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 8, 2021 0:18:00 GMT
Folks, gameboy is himself a gay man, who does not seem to believe in gay rights. We've had exchanges like this in the past where I, a person in favor of gay rights, have made arguments that would benefit them, and then gameboy , who would as a gay man would benefit from such arguments, totally disputes me. It makes me wonder if actually is gay as he claims. Go figure. By the way: Social change swells from the ground up and forces government recognition. Yeah, that's what I mean. When enough people denounce an injustice the people they voted into power make change. Its not top down. Its grass roots. So you, a straight male, stereotype me and other gay people and tell us that we must all march in lockstep and think identically? Did you really just say I'm not gay because I oppose gay marriage?
And no, I do not benefit from a social expectation that I must be monogamous. That's a pseudo-religious expectation and the government has no business getting involved.
It's only grass roots if gays actually want marriage for themselves. We don't. We're not voting with our feet and walking down that aisle. Most gays support fey marriage from their armchair but don't want it for themselves. It's a top down social experiment.
Who are these gay people that you're speaking to that DONT want gay rights? I call BS on that too. Its not about wanting to BE married. Its about having the right to do so if you ever wanted to. I personally know many gay people, and fuck yeah they want marriage rights. I'm not stereotyping anybody. I heard them, I listened to them, and I behaved accordingly. You're strange fruit, Gameboy. Strange.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 8, 2021 0:24:33 GMT
I don't think your example of rights made a lot of sense regarding some hospital visitation rights, it was too left field and flawed. You are not gay either lenny, so when one claims they are speaking for the LGBTQI, they really don't get that either since they are not all sexualities. One doesn't have to be gay in order to be an ally to gay movements. I'm not black either. Nor a woman. The LGBTQI thing is an idealist fragmentation of labels/tags purportedly relating to sexuality away from from it considered “normal” sexuality of hetero. This dynamic is not that of race or biological birth gender in which LGBTQI can be a subset aspect of all races and both genders, (yes, there are only 2). Many homosexual people DO NOT care for the institute of marriage, nor do they care to be condescended too by those that claim to be allies of the LGBTQI movement which they may not even care to be lumped into. It is a fallacious and undermining.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 8, 2021 0:34:15 GMT
One doesn't have to be gay in order to be an ally to gay movements. I'm not black either. Nor a woman. The LGBTQI thing is an idealist fragmentation of labels/tags purportedly relating to sexuality away from from it considered “normal” sexuality of hetero. This dynamic is not that of race or biological birth gender in which LGBTQI can be a subset aspect of all races and both genders, (yes, there are only 2). Many homosexual people DO NOT care for the institute of marriage, nor do they care to be condescended too by those that claim to be allies of the LGBTQI movement which they may not even care to be lumped into. It is a fallacious and undermining. That's not been my experience. But I'm glad for you that you're so confident in your point of view. Congratulations.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 8, 2021 0:36:03 GMT
So you, a straight male, stereotype me and other gay people and tell us that we must all march in lockstep and think identically? Did you really just say I'm not gay because I oppose gay marriage?
And no, I do not benefit from a social expectation that I must be monogamous. That's a pseudo-religious expectation and the government has no business getting involved.
It's only grass roots if gays actually want marriage for themselves. We don't. We're not voting with our feet and walking down that aisle. Most gays support fey marriage from their armchair but don't want it for themselves. It's a top down social experiment.
Who are these gay people that you're speaking to that DONT want gay rights? I call BS on that too. Its not about wanting to BE married. Its about having the right to do so if you ever wanted to. I personally know many gay people, and fuck yeah they want marriage rights. I'm not stereotyping anybody. I heard them, I listened to them, and I behaved accordingly. You're strange fruit, Gameboy. Strange. I’m not sure what these rights are you are talking about lenny.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 8, 2021 0:38:57 GMT
The LGBTQI thing is an idealist fragmentation of labels/tags purportedly relating to sexuality away from from it considered “normal” sexuality of hetero. This dynamic is not that of race or biological birth gender in which LGBTQI can be a subset aspect of all races and both genders, (yes, there are only 2). Many homosexual people DO NOT care for the institute of marriage, nor do they care to be condescended too by those that claim to be allies of the LGBTQI movement which they may not even care to be lumped into. It is a fallacious and undermining. That's not been my experience. But I'm glad for you that you're so confident in your point of view. Congratulations. Your experience as a straight dude who knows what being the projected normal is all about???
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 8, 2021 0:40:35 GMT
Who are these gay people that you're speaking to that DONT want gay rights? I call BS on that too. Its not about wanting to BE married. Its about having the right to do so if you ever wanted to. I personally know many gay people, and fuck yeah they want marriage rights. I'm not stereotyping anybody. I heard them, I listened to them, and I behaved accordingly. You're strange fruit, Gameboy. Strange. I’m not sure what these rights are you are talking about lenny. Exactly.
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Post by lenlenlen1 on Jan 8, 2021 0:41:25 GMT
That's not been my experience. But I'm glad for you that you're so confident in your point of view. Congratulations. Your experience as a straight dude who knows what being the projected normal is all about??? My experience with the gay people I personally know, friends and family.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 8, 2021 2:40:11 GMT
I’m not sure what these rights are you are talking about lenny. Exactly. What rights are these LGBTQI.... compartmentalised beings denied that the rest of the heteronormalcy beings have?
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 8, 2021 2:41:17 GMT
Your experience as a straight dude who knows what being the projected normal is all about??? My experience with the gay people I personally know, friends and family. So they are denied rights too?
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Post by gameboy on Jan 8, 2021 7:16:08 GMT
So you, a straight male, stereotype me and other gay people and tell us that we must all march in lockstep and think identically? Did you really just say I'm not gay because I oppose gay marriage?
And no, I do not benefit from a social expectation that I must be monogamous. That's a pseudo-religious expectation and the government has no business getting involved.
It's only grass roots if gays actually want marriage for themselves. We don't. We're not voting with our feet and walking down that aisle. Most gays support fey marriage from their armchair but don't want it for themselves. It's a top down social experiment.
Who are these gay people that you're speaking to that DONT want gay rights? I call BS on that too. Its not about wanting to BE married. Its about having the right to do so if you ever wanted to. I personally know many gay people, and fuck yeah they want marriage rights. I'm not stereotyping anybody. I heard them, I listened to them, and I behaved accordingly. You're strange fruit, Gameboy. Strange. Strange fruit? So now come the homophobic slurs from Mister "Some of my best friends are ..."  <<< ::you know what I call these?:: Dude, you're a bigot.
So this is exactly my point. I said most gay people support same-sex marriage but don't want to be married. You twist that into this heterosexist idea that we must be married monogamists and practice sexual exclusivity or we are somehow deficient human beings. You want gay clones who ape heterosexuals. Equality is not sameness.
You can say all of your alleged gay friends want to be married. I can show you stats that only 3% do get married in jurisdictions where the state begins trying to enforce this pseudo-religious pantomime of mummy and daddy.
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Post by Toasted Cheese on Jan 10, 2021 10:49:10 GMT
Who are these gay people that you're speaking to that DONT want gay rights? I call BS on that too. Its not about wanting to BE married. Its about having the right to do so if you ever wanted to. I personally know many gay people, and fuck yeah they want marriage rights. I'm not stereotyping anybody. I heard them, I listened to them, and I behaved accordingly. You're strange fruit, Gameboy. Strange. Strange fruit? So now come the homophobic slurs from Mister "Some of my best friends are ..." <<< ::you know what I call these?:: Dude, you're a bigot.
So this is exactly my point. I said most gay people support same-sex marriage but don't want to be married. You twist that into this heterosexist idea that we must be married monogamists and practice sexual exclusivity or we are somehow deficient human beings. You want gay clones who ape heterosexuals. Equality is not sameness.
You can say all of your alleged gay friends want to be married. I can show you stats that only 3% do get married in jurisdictions where the state begins trying to enforce this pseudo-religious pantomime of mummy and daddy.
lenny means well, he is just speaking from a spoonfed brainwashed perspective and wanting to be seen as doing the right thing. It is a distortion and somewhat phony. It is interesting how all these well-meaning but clueless hets seem to think they know what is best for others that aren't one of "us".
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Post by Dirty Santa PaulsLaugh on Jan 10, 2021 12:43:41 GMT
What are they and how do they fit in with each other compared to straight rights? Its not about what the rights are, or how they fit in with one another, but rather about the rights that are denied them just because they are LGBTQ. No rights have ever been denied anyone because they were not gay. Here's one example: Only married people can visit patients in certain hospitals. In places where the significant other is same sex that would disqualify them. There's lots of legalities that are covered by marriage for which same sex couples don't qualify. There's still a lot of institutionalized discrimination against them and, some churches still openly criticize same sex relationships as a mortal sin. “Straight Rights” are called, I believe, rights. They are the base norm that’s been in place since the Republic was founded. White men exclusively held these rights for hundreds of years. However, some here seem to believe extending the rights they do currently enjoy will somehow diminish their rights as individuals.
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Post by deembastille on Jan 10, 2021 13:38:20 GMT
Are we playing Scrabble?
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Post by gameboy on Jan 10, 2021 17:24:42 GMT
If I add the 'A' on the Scrabble board for "Asexual" as the dumbass gay establishment now does, LGBTQIA!!!, I get double points, right? 
Asexual, really? Why are my rights being confused with those of sexless freaks?
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Post by dirtypillows on Jan 10, 2021 20:54:15 GMT
If I add the 'A' on the Scrabble board for "Asexual" as the dumbass gay establishment now does, LGBTQIA!!!, I get double points, right?
Asexual, really? Why are my rights being confused with those of sexless freaks? the whole "LGBTQIA" is just convenient for them. Obviously they're not giving this too much thought. |
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Post by gameboy on Jan 10, 2021 21:17:55 GMT
If I add the 'A' on the Scrabble board for "Asexual" as the dumbass gay establishment now does, LGBTQIA!!!, I get double points, right?
Asexual, really? Why are my rights being confused with those of sexless freaks? the whole "LGBTQIA" is just convenient for them. Obviously they're not giving this too much thought. "Queer" can replace the whole dumb alphabet soup. It covers men, women, homosexuals, bisexuals, trannies, anyone who bucks the heterosexist system.
But I do believe asexuals have no business trying to impose themselves on our struggle. The sexual freedom we fought for is negated by their anti-sexual anti-human anti-love sociopathy. Sorry, I didn't fight for the freedom of those sickos to castrate themselves.
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