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Post by Admin on May 1, 2021 22:52:04 GMT
The OP seems to forget most of the truly important things are not inborn, they must be taught. Exhibit A, sociopaths. Nobody's born believing in good and evil and right from wrong, if they're not taught these things, they grow up inherently 'knowing' it's okay to kill people, because nobody matters, only me me me my my my matters. Two points: 1. General consensus is that nobody knows what causes sociopathy in someone. So "teaching them right and wrong" won't be a magic cure for it. 2. Most sociopaths know what's "right and wrong" - they just don't care/think it applies to them. What does any of that have to do with God wanting to give us the ability to believe in him? Some people (those who happen to be born into religious families and have religion forced on the 24/7 from birth) seem to find it very easy to believe, but those born into non-religious families and who aren't indoctrinate from birth often find it hard to believe. It's almost like it's the indoctrination that leads to belief rather than anything else...? What about the very first person who believed in God? Who indoctrinated him/her?
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on May 1, 2021 23:02:57 GMT
Two points: 1. General consensus is that nobody knows what causes sociopathy in someone. So "teaching them right and wrong" won't be a magic cure for it. 2. Most sociopaths know what's "right and wrong" - they just don't care/think it applies to them. What does any of that have to do with God wanting to give us the ability to believe in him? Some people (those who happen to be born into religious families and have religion forced on the 24/7 from birth) seem to find it very easy to believe, but those born into non-religious families and who aren't indoctrinate from birth often find it hard to believe. It's almost like it's the indoctrination that leads to belief rather than anything else...?
People don't know what causes sociopathy, but what results in a full blown sociopath is not getting children professional help for it when they first begin exhibiting symptoms at 3-4 years old. By the time they're 5-6, the damage is largely done and permanent.
I think you might be confusing sociopathy and schizophrenia.
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on May 1, 2021 23:05:29 GMT
Two points: 1. General consensus is that nobody knows what causes sociopathy in someone. So "teaching them right and wrong" won't be a magic cure for it. 2. Most sociopaths know what's "right and wrong" - they just don't care/think it applies to them. What does any of that have to do with God wanting to give us the ability to believe in him? Some people (those who happen to be born into religious families and have religion forced on the 24/7 from birth) seem to find it very easy to believe, but those born into non-religious families and who aren't indoctrinate from birth often find it hard to believe. It's almost like it's the indoctrination that leads to belief rather than anything else...? What about the very first person who believed in God? Who indoctrinated him/her? I'm guessing they either made it up (possibly to explain things that they couldn't otherwise answer or just to get themselves some attention - people do weird stuff for attention) or they were suffering from some form of delusional illness or psychosis.
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Post by Admin on May 1, 2021 23:19:39 GMT
What about the very first person who believed in God? Who indoctrinated him/her? I'm guessing they either made it up (possibly to explain things that they couldn't otherwise answer or just to get themselves some attention - people do weird stuff for attention) or they were suffering from some form of delusional illness or psychosis. Ah yes, of course the unindoctrinated indoctrinator must be either crazy or a liar. Or perhaps you just made that up.
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on May 1, 2021 23:24:53 GMT
I'm guessing they either made it up (possibly to explain things that they couldn't otherwise answer or just to get themselves some attention - people do weird stuff for attention) or they were suffering from some form of delusional illness or psychosis. Ah yes, of course the unindoctrinated indoctrinator must be either crazy or a liar. Or perhaps you just made that up. I guess all the people who appear on TV claiming God has spoken to them and want to tell you that they can relay his message to you - you believe? Not once have you ever thought "this guy might be lying/a bit crazy"? If not then God has spoken to me and if you can fund my church I will spread his word! Hallelujah!
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Post by Admin on May 1, 2021 23:33:20 GMT
Ah yes, of course the unindoctrinated indoctrinator must be either crazy or a liar. Or perhaps you just made that up. I guess all the people who appear on TV claiming God has spoken to them and want to tell you that they can relay his message to you - you believe? Not once have you ever thought "this guy might be lying/a bit crazy"? If not then God has spoken to me and if you can fund my church I will spread his word! Hallelujah! I'm pondering the very first person who believed in God, not TV evangelists. Is it your contention that those who think for themselves don't believe in God?
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Post by OpiateOfTheMasses on May 2, 2021 15:23:48 GMT
I guess all the people who appear on TV claiming God has spoken to them and want to tell you that they can relay his message to you - you believe? Not once have you ever thought "this guy might be lying/a bit crazy"? If not then God has spoken to me and if you can fund my church I will spread his word! Hallelujah! I'm pondering the very first person who believed in God, not TV evangelists. Is it your contention that those who think for themselves don't believe in God? Not entirely. But I would contend that people who are willing to critically examine things from a neutral background are less likely to believe in a supernatural deity. There are innumerable surveys and studies showing that scientists and other people who's whole jobs are based on critical thinking and not just accepting the status quo are much more likely to be atheists which would support that hypotenuse.
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Post by Admin on May 3, 2021 1:53:12 GMT
I'm pondering the very first person who believed in God, not TV evangelists. Is it your contention that those who think for themselves don't believe in God? Not entirely. But I would contend that people who are willing to critically examine things from a neutral background are less likely to believe in a supernatural deity. There are innumerable surveys and studies showing that scientists and other people who's whole jobs are based on critical thinking and not just accepting the status quo are much more likely to be atheists which would support that hypotenuse. If you're saying it's not impossible to believe without being indoctrinated to believe, I agree.
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