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Post by moviemouth on Jun 5, 2021 3:18:31 GMT
For anyone who is interested - first "us and authority." This is very interesting and is very true for me. neuroclastic.com/2019/12/15/autism-and-responding-to-authority/Funny story that fits here. I was pulled over by a cop once for driving too slow in the fast lane and she was being a total asshole and I said "why are you being so mean?" I asked it in a respectful way, or as respectful as that question could be asked. That could have gotten me in trouble with the wrong cop (It was a risk I had to take), but fortunately me saying that actually made her reflect and change her attitude. |
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Post by gw on Jun 5, 2021 4:27:51 GMT
I don't seem to be that way and I have Asperger's Syndrome/High Functioning Autism or whatever they'll call it next. I think that all children start out that way largely and grow out of it at some point in their childhood. I don't mean to disrespect your experiences but I seem to have had a different situation. While I may be more blunt in the way that I talk to authority figures I don't say things that I think may piss them off.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 5, 2021 4:50:00 GMT
I don't seem to be that way and I have Asperger's Syndrome/High Functioning Autism or whatever they'll call it next. I think that all children start out that way largely and grow out of it at some point in their childhood. I don't mean to disrespect your experiences but I seem to have had a different situation. While I may be more blunt in the way that I talk to authority figures I don't say things that I think may piss them off. Well you aren't disrespecting my situation as much as saying your experience differs from mine, the person who wrote the article and their observations. I in no way think all people with HFA are the same across the board. I know they aren't. Did you even read the article? It doesn't say HFA people are anti-authority simply because they dislike authority on principle, just that they won't just accept authority for the sake of authority and won't bow to it out of fear of social exclusion or consequences. Religion comes to mind immediately for me at least and why I would never worship a God even if a God exists. This has nothing to do with growing out of something. I'm not entirely convinced that my rejection of authority is necessarily tied to my autism, though I have good reason to believe it at least in part is. I am probably a bit more extreme in my dislike of society and authority than other people with HFA.
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Post by gw on Jun 5, 2021 5:19:01 GMT
I don't seem to be that way and I have Asperger's Syndrome/High Functioning Autism or whatever they'll call it next. I think that all children start out that way largely and grow out of it at some point in their childhood. I don't mean to disrespect your experiences but I seem to have had a different situation. While I may be more blunt in the way that I talk to authority figures I don't say things that I think may piss them off. Well you aren't disrespecting my situation as much as saying your experience differs from mine, the person who wrote the article and their observations. I in no way think all people with HFA are the same across the board. I know they aren't. Did you even read the article? It doesn't say HFA people are anti-authority simply because they dislike authority on principle, just that they won't just accept authority for the sake of authority and won't bow to it out of fear of social exclusion or consequences. Religion comes to mind immediately for me at least and why I would never worship a God even if a God exists. This has nothing to do with growing out of something. I'm not entirely convinced that my rejection of authority is necessarily tied to my autism, though I have good reason to believe it at least in part is. I am probably a bit more extreme in my dislike of society and authority than other people with HFA. I see what you mean for religion. It felt like something was off for me but it wasn't until I was twelve that it finally occurred to me that there may not be a god. It wasn't so much intellectual as it was just hard for me to believe that you can rub mud on people's eyes and cure the blind and all the other rituals like the saints and being blessed with water or how you can eat communion bread and you're somehow eating a person who's sacrificing their self to you. I read the article. It seems that to some extent I have had similar experiences with being too blunt to authority figures sometimes perhaps but not to the same degree necessarily.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 5, 2021 6:15:33 GMT
Well you aren't disrespecting my situation as much as saying your experience differs from mine, the person who wrote the article and their observations. I in no way think all people with HFA are the same across the board. I know they aren't. Did you even read the article? It doesn't say HFA people are anti-authority simply because they dislike authority on principle, just that they won't just accept authority for the sake of authority and won't bow to it out of fear of social exclusion or consequences. Religion comes to mind immediately for me at least and why I would never worship a God even if a God exists. This has nothing to do with growing out of something. I'm not entirely convinced that my rejection of authority is necessarily tied to my autism, though I have good reason to believe it at least in part is. I am probably a bit more extreme in my dislike of society and authority than other people with HFA. I see what you mean for religion. It felt like something was off for me but it wasn't until I was twelve that it finally occurred to me that there may not be a god. It wasn't so much intellectual as it was just hard for me to believe that you can rub mud on people's eyes and cure the blind and all the other rituals like the saints and being blessed with water or how you can eat communion bread and you're somehow eating a person who's sacrificing their self to you.I read the article. It seems that to some extent I have had similar experiences with being too blunt to authority figures sometimes perhaps but not to the same degree necessarily. I think that is very much because of thinking about it intellectually. I'd say reason is what caused us to think that it sounded like nonsense.
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Post by Spooky Ghost Ackbar on Jun 5, 2021 22:17:23 GMT
I had a coworker with aspbergers a while back. Ever since I’ve been curious about it because I don’t really understand the condition that well. He didn’t seem all that different to me, just kind of quiet, and I’m not sure I would’ve ever guessed.
Is it that you don’t like having people wield authority over you? Or is it more that you don’t feel that inhibition that would otherwise prevent you from challenging authority figures?
Apologies if these questions are in any way offensive or insensitive. I don’t mean them to be.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 6, 2021 13:06:10 GMT
I had a coworker with aspbergers a while back. Ever since I’ve been curious about it because I don’t really understand the condition that well. He didn’t seem all that different to me, just kind of quiet, and I’m not sure I would’ve ever guessed. Is it that you don’t like having people wield authority over you? Or is it more that you don’t feel that inhibition that would otherwise prevent you from challenging authority figures? Apologies if these questions are in any way offensive or insensitive. I don’t mean them to be. First off autism is a spectrum. Not every person with even high-functioning Asperger's will be the same. Some of very quiet and introverted and some aren't. Some will be more obvious than others, because theirs is a bit more severe. I am in the camp of ones where people will just think I am a bit strange. Social awkwardness if one of the more noticeable signs of Asperger's. High anxiety, depression, OCD are often common conditions that many people with the disorder have in common. Having a hard time making and keeping relationships I have heard is common. I certainly have that problem. Not having a filter when talking is another well known one. Taking things literally that aren't meant to be taken literally is also one. Going on and on about a subject that interests them and not noticing or caring that the other person has lost interest. That might come into play below.  I can certainly answer questions about me personally and some general things that people with Asperger's tend to have in common, but only a few things apply to every person with the disorder. Most people with the disorder do have various things in common. Keep in mind that I am no expert on Asperger's though. I just know the general stuff. The authority thing is something I actually wasn't aware of and was curious about. This one article is really the only one I read on this specific subject and I would suggest you ask someone in the field of psychology who studies autism for more accuracy or do research yourself online. Why do I have a problem with authority. One of the main things about people who Asperger's is we tend to be not very social and recognizing authority is more of a social thing. I also distrust authority (authority figures have a very bad track record in history), I don't like being told what to do and I don't see other people as more or less than other people. As I said in my OP though, I will show respect and be kind and listen to a person in a position of authority if i believe they are worthy of listening to and respecting. Them simply being in a position of power means nothing to me. I will see them as an equal. I have had great bosses and those bosses get good work out of me, because they have earned my respect and my willingness to listen to them. Not sure how much sense that makes LOL. I am not all that great at explaining things that I haven't thought about in any great detail. I had given very little thought as to why I am so against authority, until I got curious just the other day if this was common with other people with the disorder. I don't get offended easily and I actually like answering questions.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 6, 2021 13:33:04 GMT
I don't seem to be that way and I have Asperger's Syndrome/High Functioning Autism or whatever they'll call it next. I think that all children start out that way largely and grow out of it at some point in their childhood. I don't mean to disrespect your experiences but I seem to have had a different situation. While I may be more blunt in the way that I talk to authority figures I don't say things that I think may piss them off. "Mind blindness" affects moral reasoning. www.spectrumnews.org/news/mind-blindness-affects-moral-reasoning-in-autism/Two friends take a coffee break at a chemical plant. Mary asks Grace to pass the sugar, and Grace hands her a dispenser clearly labeled ‘Sugar.’ Unbeknownst to either woman, however, the dispenser contains not sugar, but a poisonous chemical that looks like it. Mary drinks her toxin-sweetened coffee and dies a few hours later. Is Grace to blame? Most people would say, “No,” because Grace didn’t know that the dispenser contained poison. But after reading 20 similar vignettes in which the actions of protagonists led to either a negative or neutral outcome, a group of 24 highly intelligent adults with autism consistently assigned a higher degree of moral blame to individuals with innocent intentions, compared with controls. This does not fit me at all. Grace is clearly not to blame in any way. She had no reason to believe that there was anything but sugar in the container. That is just logical reasoning from my perspective.
Now someone who isn't paying attention to the road and rear ends my car. That is much different. They are to blame completely, even though they had no intention of hitting me.
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Post by Spooky Ghost Ackbar on Jun 6, 2021 18:25:19 GMT
I had a coworker with aspbergers a while back. Ever since I’ve been curious about it because I don’t really understand the condition that well. He didn’t seem all that different to me, just kind of quiet, and I’m not sure I would’ve ever guessed. Is it that you don’t like having people wield authority over you? Or is it more that you don’t feel that inhibition that would otherwise prevent you from challenging authority figures? Apologies if these questions are in any way offensive or insensitive. I don’t mean them to be. First off autism is a spectrum. Not every person with even high-functioning Asperger's will be the same. Some of very quiet and introverted and some aren't. Some will be more obvious than others, because theirs is a bit more severe. I am in the camp of ones where people will just think I am a bit strange. Social awkwardness if one of the more noticeable signs of Asperger's. High anxiety, depression, OCD are often common conditions that many people with the disorder have in common. Having a hard time making and keeping relationships I have heard is common. I certainly have that problem. Not having a filter when talking is another well known one. Taking things literally that aren't meant to be taken literally is also one. Going on and on about a subject that interests them and not noticing or caring that the other person has lost interest. That might come into play below. I can certainly answer questions about me personally and some general things that people with Asperger's tend to have in common, but only a few things apply to every person with the disorder. Most people with the disorder do have various things in common. Keep in mind that I am no expert on Asperger's though. I just know the general stuff. The authority thing is something I actually wasn't aware of and was curious about. This one article is really the only one I read on this specific subject and I would suggest you ask someone in the field of psychology who studies autism for more accuracy or do research yourself online. Why do I have a problem with authority. One of the main things about people who Asperger's is we tend to be not very social and recognizing authority is more of a social thing. I also distrust authority (authority figures have a very bad track record in history), I don't like being told what to do and I don't see other people as more or less than other people. As I said in my OP though, I will show respect and be kind and listen to a person in a position of authority if i believe they are worthy of listening to and respecting. Them simply being in a position of power means nothing to me. I will see them as an equal. I have had great bosses and those bosses get good work out of me, because they have earned my respect and my willingness to listen to them. Not sure how much sense that makes LOL. I am not all that great at explaining things that I haven't thought about in any great detail. I had given very little thought as to why I am so against authority, until I got curious just the other day if this was common with other people with the disorder. I don't get offended easily and I actually like answering questions. Interesting. Thanks. A lot of these descriptions fit people I know but they haven’t been diagnosed as far as I know. So maybe I’m completely wrong about wondering. The thing that’s difficult to get for me is that some of the traits seem fairly general (I mean, who isn’t “a bit strange”) and I know a lot of people who are high anxiety and bit obsessive, including myself. But I suppose it needs to be a combination of many traits and to a certain extreme.
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Post by gw on Jun 6, 2021 20:30:15 GMT
I don't seem to be that way and I have Asperger's Syndrome/High Functioning Autism or whatever they'll call it next. I think that all children start out that way largely and grow out of it at some point in their childhood. I don't mean to disrespect your experiences but I seem to have had a different situation. While I may be more blunt in the way that I talk to authority figures I don't say things that I think may piss them off. "Mind blindness" affects moral reasoning. www.spectrumnews.org/news/mind-blindness-affects-moral-reasoning-in-autism/Two friends take a coffee break at a chemical plant. Mary asks Grace to pass the sugar, and Grace hands her a dispenser clearly labeled ‘Sugar.’ Unbeknownst to either woman, however, the dispenser contains not sugar, but a poisonous chemical that looks like it. Mary drinks her toxin-sweetened coffee and dies a few hours later. Is Grace to blame? Most people would say, “No,” because Grace didn’t know that the dispenser contained poison. But after reading 20 similar vignettes in which the actions of protagonists led to either a negative or neutral outcome, a group of 24 highly intelligent adults with autism consistently assigned a higher degree of moral blame to individuals with innocent intentions, compared with controls. This does not fit me at all. Grace is clearly not to blame in any way. She had no reason to believe that there was anything but sugar in the container. That is just logical reasoning from my perspective.
Now someone who isn't paying attention to the road and rear ends my car. That is much different. They are to blame completely, even though they had no intention of hitting me. I think that Grace obviously isn't at fault. In the second scenario I would say it's a crummy but unavoidable scenario that we haven't found a way around. But I read the article and the PDF and I didn't see that in either one. Did I overlook it or did you find it from somewhere else? I'm sure that I do have this mind blindness to a large degree. But is there a test for how people with Asperger's/HFA do at guessing the emotions of others on the spectrum? That would be the real test.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 6, 2021 21:43:35 GMT
"Mind blindness" affects moral reasoning. www.spectrumnews.org/news/mind-blindness-affects-moral-reasoning-in-autism/Two friends take a coffee break at a chemical plant. Mary asks Grace to pass the sugar, and Grace hands her a dispenser clearly labeled ‘Sugar.’ Unbeknownst to either woman, however, the dispenser contains not sugar, but a poisonous chemical that looks like it. Mary drinks her toxin-sweetened coffee and dies a few hours later. Is Grace to blame? Most people would say, “No,” because Grace didn’t know that the dispenser contained poison. But after reading 20 similar vignettes in which the actions of protagonists led to either a negative or neutral outcome, a group of 24 highly intelligent adults with autism consistently assigned a higher degree of moral blame to individuals with innocent intentions, compared with controls. This does not fit me at all. Grace is clearly not to blame in any way. She had no reason to believe that there was anything but sugar in the container. That is just logical reasoning from my perspective.
Now someone who isn't paying attention to the road and rear ends my car. That is much different. They are to blame completely, even though they had no intention of hitting me.I think that Grace obviously isn't at fault. In the second scenario I would say it's a crummy but unavoidable scenario that we haven't found a way around. But I read the article and the PDF and I didn't see that in either one. Did I overlook it or did you find it from somewhere else? I'm sure that I do have this mind blindness to a large degree. But is there a test for how people with Asperger's/HFA do at guessing the emotions of others on the spectrum? That would be the real test. I just made the second one up for comparison sake.
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Post by moviemouth on Jun 8, 2021 11:26:03 GMT
I had a coworker with aspbergers a while back. Ever since I’ve been curious about it because I don’t really understand the condition that well. He didn’t seem all that different to me, just kind of quiet, and I’m not sure I would’ve ever guessed. Is it that you don’t like having people wield authority over you? Or is it more that you don’t feel that inhibition that would otherwise prevent you from challenging authority figures? Apologies if these questions are in any way offensive or insensitive. I don’t mean them to be.
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