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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 13:12:14 GMT
I have an important announcement to make: Effective immediately, I will stop bashing Belichick. I've always maintained that I want Belichick to prove me wrong, and I think he has a real opportunity to do it this year. Yes he panic bought this team instead of building it, yes he got off to another rough start in 2021; but it's the middle of the season and the Pats are in the thick of it. As a fan, it's all you can really ask for. I was afraid I'd be watching another bottom feeder for the foreseeable future, instead I have a highly competitive team that battles each and every week. It took some time for it to come together, but here we are.
Last season proved what I already knew, that Brady can win with anyone. Good for him. But I need to get over it, Brady isn't coming back. And if Mac is the real deal, maybe letting Brady walk doesn't look so terrible in three years when Mac is coming into his own and Brady is retired (he'll be retired by then, right?). Now it's Belichick's turn, and it's about time I go all in behind him instead of just rooting for the players. We need everyone to be their best if we want to get back to the promised land.
A few notes:
- I can and will recite all the old facts if/when anyone wants to compare Brady & Belichick's career arcs to figure out who was more responsible for the Patriots' success. It's inarguable when you look at the results on the field. But I will no longer go out of my way to rip Belichick. I think most coaches are overrated, Belichick is not unique in this way.
- Even if the Pats completely fall apart the rest of the season (this is screaming jinx, isn't it?) I will not revert back to my old ways. I won't have to. My point would have been proven, and again as I have always said, I want to be wrong. I would much rather watch a competitive team in the playoff hunt then watch a 4-12 dumpster fire and say, "I told you so."
Also, I'd like to commend Belichick for what he's done so far this year. You heard me. Yeah he spent a lot of money, but it's paying off, and that isn't always the case. He recognized the problem areas on his roster and addressed them, drafted a rookie QB who is playing extremely well, and is on a four game winning streak after an abysmal start, when a lot of teams (especially one with this many new faces) could've just packed it in and started going through the motions. They've fought hard all year, only one of their losses is by more than one score-- hell, one loss was by 1, another by 2 another went to OT. Like I said, competition is all I can ask for, and I'm getting it.
Hopefully the Pats don't lose 37-0 on Thursday and make me and Belichick both look like schmucks. But I'm willing to risk it. I've always been all in on the Pats, but as of right now, I'm all in on Belichick.
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Post by masterofallgoons on Nov 17, 2021 13:18:11 GMT
I'll believe when I see it.
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 13:22:19 GMT
Ahhhhh.....
I seee.......
So they're doing well now and it's time to stop bashing him for the time being 
Flip Flopper in the house!
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 13:25:53 GMT
I'll believe when I see it. ^Hey, this has always been my stance with Belichick. I'm a prove it to me kind of guy. What he's done this year doesn't make him the greatest coach of all time, but it's already a hell of an improvement over last year. They should at least finish with a winning record. If not, then I guess I was right all along and my team sucks, where does that leave me as a fan? I can complain about this shit forever, or I can have fun watching my team play hard every week. And as I told sdm3 yesterday, if the Pats someday go on to win another Super Bowl with Belichick at the helm, I'll start the 'Belichick is a genius after all' thread myself.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 13:30:12 GMT
Ahhhhh.....
I seee.......
So they're doing well now and it's time to stop bashing him for the time being
Flip Flopper in the house!
Could be worse, I could mindlessly swallow the bullshit my franchise serves me for years, and insist every player that made a great catch in practice belongs in the hall of fame. But I don't want to be you, I want to be a genuine sports fan capable of critical thought. Feel free to call me out the next time I randomly bring up Belichick being a lousy coach. We already know nothing will stop your inane commentary on sports; well nothing except yourself, when you self-delete and quit the board for two weeks every time one of your teams gets eliminated from the playoffs.
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 13:33:55 GMT
Could be worse, I could mindlessly swallow the bullshit my franchise serves me for years, and insist every player that made a great catch in practice belongs in the hall of fame. But I don't want to be you, I want to be a genuine sports fan capable of critical thought. Feel free to call me out the next time I randomly bring up Belichick being a lousy coach. We already know nothing will stop your inane commentary on sports; well nothing except yourself, when you self-delete and quit the board for two weeks every time one of your teams gets eliminated from the playoffs. Look at this guy folks.
Shameful.
Some fan.
Team wins a few games and it's time to stop ripping them.
Is this a man of his convictions?
Sounds like a flip flopper to me - changes his opinions dependent on which way the wind is blowing
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Post by stickman38 on Nov 17, 2021 13:35:27 GMT
I don't mind the Belichick bashing but when it's 4 or 5 paragraphs of it, it gets a little strange.
Do you have a dart board in your home with Bill's face on it?
But yeah, the Patriots turnaround this season has been one of the biggest surprises to me. We'll see what happens in the last 8 weeks but if they do win it all, I think you owe Bill an apology. Lol
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 13:43:35 GMT
Could be worse, I could mindlessly swallow the bullshit my franchise serves me for years, and insist every player that made a great catch in practice belongs in the hall of fame. But I don't want to be you, I want to be a genuine sports fan capable of critical thought. Feel free to call me out the next time I randomly bring up Belichick being a lousy coach. We already know nothing will stop your inane commentary on sports; well nothing except yourself, when you self-delete and quit the board for two weeks every time one of your teams gets eliminated from the playoffs. Look at this guy folks.
Shameful.
Some fan.
Team wins a few games and it's time to stop ripping them.
Is this a man of his convictions?
Sounds like a flip flopper to me - changes his opinions dependent on which way the wind is blowing
I ripped the coach, not the team. And yeah, that's how life works for the rest of us. You know, like when you label a thread 'The Philadelphia Eagles Championship Thread,' only to relabel it 'The Philadelphia Eagles Growth/Rebuilding For The Future Thread' two months later. Things change.
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 13:49:03 GMT
Look at this guy folks.
Shameful.
Some fan.
Team wins a few games and it's time to stop ripping them.
Is this a man of his convictions?
Sounds like a flip flopper to me - changes his opinions dependent on which way the wind is blowing
I ripped the coach, not the team. And yeah, that's how life works for the rest of us. You know, like when you label a thread 'The Philadelphia Eagles Championship Thread,' only to relabel it 'The Philadelphia Eagles Growth/Rebuilding For The Future Thread' two months later. Things change. Those sound like 2 positives to me - believing in your team and watching them grow and progress
It's a shame there isn't more 'Sunny' positive people like me in the World who choose to look at the World glass half full
Sadly many people in life like to focus on the negative.
Not this guy Bub
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Post by thebayharborbutcher on Nov 17, 2021 15:15:18 GMT
It sucks what happened with Brady. However, at the end of the day Brady is gone and Belicheck it still there. I rather just see them pick up the pieces and move on. The truth of the matter is the Patriots were gonna have to rebuild from Tom Brady someday. Would I rather seen it happen 5 years from now? Yes. But we got a great 20 years out of him. Perhaps the greatest 20 years an athlete can give an organization. Plus, looking at it from Brady's perspective I understand. Watching as a fan every week is a heck of a lot different than being in it on from the day to day. Thinking about it from his perspective it's understandable why he'd want a change. My hope is that he some day rejoins the Patriots organization. I 100% believe he'd make a great head coach. In 10 years from now I could see it happening.
For right now though, I'm confident in Belicheck as head coach. I think he can rebuild the team. I actually think he has a huge fire in his stomach right now because of Brady walking away and winning a Super Bowl. He'd heard all the talk and knows what's going on. I think he wants to prove now more than ever he can build a Super Bowl winning team (without TB12). Plus the guy lives and breathes football. He knows the game. I also think he's good at managing young and controversial players. I see him as the right head coach from Mac Jones. Will he turn him into the next Brady? No. But I think he can help him get to a championship winning level.
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 15:23:16 GMT
I ripped the coach, not the team. And yeah, that's how life works for the rest of us. You know, like when you label a thread 'The Philadelphia Eagles Championship Thread,' only to relabel it 'The Philadelphia Eagles Growth/Rebuilding For The Future Thread' two months later. Things change. Those sound like 2 positives to me - believing in your team and watching them grow and progress
It's a shame there isn't more 'Sunny' positive people like me in the World who choose to look at the World glass half full
Sadly many people in life like to focus on the negative.
Not this guy Bub
It sounds to me like your expectations changed, which is no different from me. You're a positive guy- I'll keep that in mind the next time you disappear for a month only to return to the board immediately hostile and attacking other posters.
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 15:29:58 GMT
Those sound like 2 positives to me - believing in your team and watching them grow and progress
It's a shame there isn't more 'Sunny' positive people like me in the World who choose to look at the World glass half full
Sadly many people in life like to focus on the negative.
Not this guy Bub
It sounds to me like your expectations changed, which is no different from me. You're a positive guy- I'll keep that in mind the next time you disappear for a month only to return to the board immediately hostile and attacking other posters. You seem to be mistaken
I do not go out of my way to attack other posters
Never have. Never will.
I respond to those who have attacked me
I guess by your standards - I should just sit back and let posters attack me
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 15:32:55 GMT
It sounds to me like your expectations changed, which is no different from me. You're a positive guy- I'll keep that in mind the next time you disappear for a month only to return to the board immediately hostile and attacking other posters. You seem to be mistaken
I do not go out of my way to attack other posters
Never have. Never will.
I respond to those who have attacked me
I guess by your standards - I should just sit back and let posters attack me
You can do whatever you want, just don't pretend you haven't gone berserk on other posters before.
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 15:34:49 GMT
You seem to be mistaken
I do not go out of my way to attack other posters
Never have. Never will.
I respond to those who have attacked me
I guess by your standards - I should just sit back and let posters attack me
You can do whatever you want, just don't pretend you haven't gone berserk on other posters before. I have
After they attacked me
Sounds to me like we're dealing with people who can dish it out but can't take it and then whine and cry about it.
I do not seek confrontation out of nowhere
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Nov 17, 2021 15:45:08 GMT
You can do whatever you want, just don't pretend you haven't gone berserk on other posters before. I have
After they attacked me
Sounds to me like we're dealing with people who can dish it out but can't take it and then whine and cry about it.
I do not seek confrontation out of nowhere
Nobody is whining and crying about it, I'm pointing out your past behavior. And you've never done it to me, by the way. We give each other shit, but I think there's always been an understanding that we're just ball busting. I don't think what other posters have done is any different, but you randomly reappear and start spewing hellfire, making personal attacks. It's weird. It's repetitive (and it seems exhausting), but your schtick doesn't bother me. It's important to keep the board active, you help keep things alive through the slow times (when you're here).
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Post by screamingtreefrogs on Nov 17, 2021 15:49:21 GMT
I have
After they attacked me
Sounds to me like we're dealing with people who can dish it out but can't take it and then whine and cry about it.
I do not seek confrontation out of nowhere
Nobody is whining and crying about it, I'm pointing out your past behavior. And you've never done it to me, by the way. We give each other shit, but I think there's always been an understanding that we're just ball busting. I don't think what other posters have done is any different, but you randomly reappear and start spewing hellfire, making personal attacks. It's weird. It's repetitive (and it seems exhausting), but your schtick doesn't bother me. It's important to keep the board active, you help keep things alive through the slow times (when you're here). So personal attacks are made on myself
I respond with personal attacks myself
And that is 'weird'
Gotya
I stand up for myself is what I do
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Post by sdm3 on Nov 17, 2021 16:01:59 GMT
That's the spirit, Rey! Say it with me: NO DAYS OFF! DO YOUR JOB! WE'RE STILL HERE!
I have to say, I'm legitimately surprised. As you said, you have mentioned that you want to be wrong - however, it's still surprising that you'd say this in particular after years of seemingly not giving Belichick credit for anything. So I'm glad you're doing that much, at least.
Obviously, I still think Belichick is a great coach and I recognize that you must find this baffling given all the facts and stats out there. It must also seem like double standards to you - I don't think any of us are going to start calling McCarthy a genius despite how great the Cowboys look this year. Then again, McCarthy didn't win six Super Bowls from nine trips as a head coach. He had a generational talent like Rodgers and only made it to two NFC title games, let alone Super Bowls. Good coaches win with good talent. Mediocre coaches squander great talent. Great coaches and great talents together win big. None of this is to dispute your view on coaches; clearly, coaches need talented rosters to win, and only a select few coaches have enjoyed success everywhere they've been. Still, winning in the NFL is hard; the Patriots made it look easy for 20 years. We'll see if Belichick can get the Mac era back to that level. But you didn't start this post to carry on that particular debate, so I'll end it there.
It's still refreshing to see you willing to give Belichick his dues for the work he did to bring this team back to contention. Regardless of exactly how much credit he deserves, he at least deserves some of it, we agree on that much. He spent a lot of money, but plenty of teams do that and fail. Ask the Jets, ask the Jaguars, ask the Cowboys, ask the Dream Team Eagles. Belichick may have spent, but for now, it looks like he spent wisely.
(side note: remember when "the Jarrett Stidham era" was a thing?)
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Dec 8, 2021 13:52:58 GMT
This is all I ever wanted to hear, Billychuck. And I'm assuming this is reciprocation for all of the positive stuff Brady has been saying about Belichick on Man in the Arena. I just wish these two could've sorted it out without having to go their separate ways. Even if the Pats win the Super Bowl (hey, I can dream), proving we had both the greatest coach of all time and the greatest QB of all time, I'd still rather have the argument as to which guy was more important to the (eight, nine titles?) dynasty in New England instead of seeing Brady win somewhere else. Oh well, I'll have to settle for six titles and counting. And for the record, he also says Lawrence Taylor is the greatest Defensive player of all time. No argument here.
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Post by twothousandonemark on Dec 8, 2021 17:10:55 GMT
I'll ask a question in this thread - if the Patriots win a SB in the next 3 seasons, is it tied to the dynasty? I think I'm torn.
I suppose Hightower & McCourtey winning a 4th ring seems not enough of a tie, & yet a Belichick-Kraft 7th isn't nothing?
The Steve Young 49ers & Mark Messier Oilers won without their prior leaders, yet they had many more ties yes?
What is the definition of a sports dynasty? The players/personnel or the team name & laundry?
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Dec 8, 2021 17:40:52 GMT
I'll ask a question in this thread - if the Patriots win a SB in the next 3 seasons, is it tied to the dynasty? I think I'm torn. I suppose Hightower & McCourtey winning a 4th ring seems not enough of a tie, & yet a Belichick-Kraft 7th isn't nothing? The Steve Young 49ers & Mark Messier Oilers won without their prior leaders, yet they had many more ties yes? What is the definition of a sports dynasty? The players/personnel or the team name & laundry? This is the real question, isn't it? It's been asked before, were the Patriots a dynasty from 2001-2018, or separate dynasties from 2001-2004 and 2014-2018? And do the two Super Bowl losses in between those mini-dynasties not count for anything, despite one of them coming at the end of an undefeated season? I'd say two separate dynasties. Despite the continued level of success, ten years between titles is a long time. After last year's crash and burn, you'd have to say this is a new era. Same coach and owner, but a ton of new personnel. The best 'dynasty' question in sports involves the Spurs. Were they ever a dynasty? Five titles in fifteen years, three in five years at one point, but the Lakers had a threepeat in between their first and second titles, and five titles overall during the Spurs alleged reign of dominance. Hard to call it a dynasty when another team had its own dynasty at the same time. Then again, that's exactly what the Celtics and Lakers did in the 80s, and everyone says those were dynasties.
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