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Post by Sarge on Jun 22, 2022 22:08:28 GMT
Not to their knowledge when they left to go there. Okay. But we do know Mars is barren, has no life, no oxygen and no magnetic field. I suppose there might have been a few Homo Erectuses that wandered into the desert for no good reason, but they were quickly removed from the gene pool. So was your answer to my question, oxygen? Because your answer seemed evasive. The reality is our species are explorers and expanded all around the globe, up and down mountains, across burning and frozen deserts, into the arctic and Antarctic, deep into the ocean and into space, for reasons beyond oxygen or any other resource. In fact, we are cool like that. 
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2022 22:16:44 GMT
Okay. But we do know Mars is barren, has no life, no oxygen and no magnetic field. I suppose there might have been a few Homo Erectuses that wandered into the desert for no good reason, but they were quickly removed from the gene pool. So was your answer to my question, oxygen? Because your answer seemed evasive. The reality is our species are explorers and expanded all around the globe, up and down mountains, across burning and frozen deserts, into the arctic and Antarctic, deep into the ocean and into space, for reasons beyond oxygen or any other resource. In fact, we are cool like that.  I’m not saying we won’t explore Mars, only that we will not live there. We explored Antarctica but nobody lives there permanently. For good reason.
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Post by Winter_King on Jun 23, 2022 13:49:48 GMT
One day probably, for a start. Why? The core is dead. No magnetic field means no protection from solar rays. No oxygen. No life. Why not colonize our deserts instead? What does Mars have that the desert doesn’t? Or the ocean floor? We would obviously create artificial habitats on Mars which could offer protection from solar rays. It's also unclear if the planet doesn't support life. We haven't found any yet, but inside the large lava tubes of Mars there might be life there. And why is simple: the only way of preventing human extinction is through colonization of space.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2022 17:39:13 GMT
Why? The core is dead. No magnetic field means no protection from solar rays. No oxygen. No life. Why not colonize our deserts instead? What does Mars have that the desert doesn’t? Or the ocean floor? We would obviously create artificial habitats on Mars which could offer protection from solar rays. Why not just do that on Antarctica or the Sahara desert? And does anyone really want to live in a bubble? If you really think about colonization of Mars it only makes sense under extreme circumstances. If Earth is completely dead. But, even in the worst case scenario Earth won’t be worse off than Mars. So to survive the death of Earth we move to… another dead planet?
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Post by Sarge on Jun 23, 2022 19:20:04 GMT
So was your answer to my question, oxygen? Because your answer seemed evasive. The reality is our species are explorers and expanded all around the globe, up and down mountains, across burning and frozen deserts, into the arctic and Antarctic, deep into the ocean and into space, for reasons beyond oxygen or any other resource. In fact, we are cool like that. I’m not saying we won’t explore Mars, only that we will not live there. We explored Antarctica but nobody lives there permanently. For good reason. I know that Mars is incredibly inhospitable to the point where we could never establish a colony without heavily shielded living spaces but I don't think we are going to stay home. I don't know how it will happen but our nature is to expand and I believe that's what we will do. Afterall, you stated we will go extinct if we stay here so it seems we have little choice if that's your belief.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2022 19:23:27 GMT
I’m not saying we won’t explore Mars, only that we will not live there. We explored Antarctica but nobody lives there permanently. For good reason. I know that Mars is incredibly inhospitable to the point where we could never establish a colony without heavily shielded living spaces but I don't think we are going to stay home. I don't know how it will happen but our nature is to expand and I believe that's what we will do. Afterall, you stated we will go extinct if we stay here so it seems we have little choice if that's your belief. Mars is not much of a choice though. If we figure out how to make Mars hospitable then we can likely do the same here. So we might as well fix Earth in that scenario. Now, if eventually we discover some sort of tech that allows us to create artificial environments or terraforming or magnetic field generators ect. I could see us going to Mars. Until then, I don’t know. I could easily see us collapsing into a dark age of war and famine before that happens though.
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Post by Sarge on Jun 23, 2022 20:06:57 GMT
I know that Mars is incredibly inhospitable to the point where we could never establish a colony without heavily shielded living spaces but I don't think we are going to stay home. I don't know how it will happen but our nature is to expand and I believe that's what we will do. Afterall, you stated we will go extinct if we stay here so it seems we have little choice if that's your belief. Mars is not much of a choice though. If we figure out how to make Mars hospitable then we can likely do the same here. So we might as well fix Earth in that scenario. Now, if eventually we discover some sort of tech that allows us to create artificial environments or terraforming or magnetic field generators ect. I could see us going to Mars. Until then, I don’t know. I could easily see us collapsing into a dark age of war and famine before that happens though. That's a Hollywood trope.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2022 20:23:24 GMT
Mars is not much of a choice though. If we figure out how to make Mars hospitable then we can likely do the same here. So we might as well fix Earth in that scenario. Now, if eventually we discover some sort of tech that allows us to create artificial environments or terraforming or magnetic field generators ect. I could see us going to Mars. Until then, I don’t know. I could easily see us collapsing into a dark age of war and famine before that happens though.That's a Hollywood trope. You don’t watch a whole lot of news, do you, Mr Wayne?
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Post by Sarge on Jun 23, 2022 20:27:33 GMT
That's a Hollywood trope. You don’t watch a whole lot of news, do you, Mr Wayne? I hardly watch any tv news but I'm guessing you watch too much.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2022 20:30:07 GMT
You don’t watch a whole lot of news, do you, Mr Wayne? I hardly watch any tv news but I'm guessing you watch too much. Perhaps you are right. There’s currently no risk of nuclear war. Global warming is having no effect. And everyone in the world is well fed and happy. What are we going to Mars for? Things are going great right here!
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Post by Sarge on Jun 23, 2022 21:32:09 GMT
I hardly watch any tv news but I'm guessing you watch too much. Perhaps you are right. There’s currently no risk of nuclear war. Global warming is having no effect. And everyone in the world is well fed and happy. What are we going to Mars for? Things are going great right here! Our conversation is turning antagonistic, which is not my intention. I guess we should agree to disagree on the future expansion of humanity.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2022 22:38:48 GMT
Perhaps you are right. There’s currently no risk of nuclear war. Global warming is having no effect. And everyone in the world is well fed and happy. What are we going to Mars for? Things are going great right here! Our conversation is turning antagonistic, which is not my intention. I guess we should agree to disagree on the future expansion of humanity. I suppose that’s for the best. I was enjoying the debate while it lasted and didn’t intend for it to turn antagonistic either. Let’s cut our losses and bail.
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Post by Winter_King on Jun 24, 2022 8:50:40 GMT
We would obviously create artificial habitats on Mars which could offer protection from solar rays. Why not just do that on Antarctica or the Sahara desert? And does anyone really want to live in a bubble? If you really think about colonization of Mars it only makes sense under extreme circumstances. If Earth is completely dead. But, even in the worst case scenario Earth won’t be worse off than Mars. So to survive the death of Earth we move to… another dead planet? No. When that happen it would be already too late. Given the immense difficulties of building a viable Mars colony, we should get a head start. The sooner the better. Besides, a Mars colony would be just the beginning the eventual colonization of the solar system and building the first successful colony would give us a lot of experience to do the same on other planets or dwarf planets. It could also help solve the problem overpopulation which will lead to more destruction of natural habitats on Earth. There is also an abundance of rare elements if the solar system, particularly in the asteroid belt. So if we can figure out how to mine them, it's easier to bring those materials to Mars than it is to bring them back to Earth. And while it's firmly on the realm of science fiction with the technology we have today, maybe it's possible to terraform Mars in the future.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2022 17:36:43 GMT
Why not just do that on Antarctica or the Sahara desert? And does anyone really want to live in a bubble? If you really think about colonization of Mars it only makes sense under extreme circumstances. If Earth is completely dead. But, even in the worst case scenario Earth won’t be worse off than Mars. So to survive the death of Earth we move to… another dead planet? No. When that happen it would be already too late. Given the immense difficulties of building a viable Mars colony, we should get a head start. The sooner the better. Besides, a Mars colony would be just the beginning the eventual colonization of the solar system and building the first successful colony would give us a lot of experience to do the same on other planets or dwarf planets. It could also help solve the problem overpopulation which will lead to more destruction of natural habitats on Earth. There is also an abundance of rare elements if the solar system, particularly in the asteroid belt. So if we can figure out how to mine them, it's easier to bring those materials to Mars than it is to bring them back to Earth. And while it's firmly on the realm of science fiction with the technology we have today, maybe it's possible to terraform Mars in the future. I understand the benefit. I’m not really trying to create a case against it, only that I find it unlikely mankind will get to the point where it’s truly both possible and appealing. Global environmental catastrophe is already underway. I don’t see anyone spending money on Mars missions once things really get bad. I don’t want to repeat all my previous points, but I think the main question I haven’t seen answered here is: Why Mars? If bubble cities are possible than why not put them on Antarctica or even the moon first?
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Post by Winter_King on Jun 28, 2022 13:23:16 GMT
No. When that happen it would be already too late. Given the immense difficulties of building a viable Mars colony, we should get a head start. The sooner the better. Besides, a Mars colony would be just the beginning the eventual colonization of the solar system and building the first successful colony would give us a lot of experience to do the same on other planets or dwarf planets. It could also help solve the problem overpopulation which will lead to more destruction of natural habitats on Earth. There is also an abundance of rare elements if the solar system, particularly in the asteroid belt. So if we can figure out how to mine them, it's easier to bring those materials to Mars than it is to bring them back to Earth. And while it's firmly on the realm of science fiction with the technology we have today, maybe it's possible to terraform Mars in the future. I understand the benefit. I’m not really trying to create a case against it, only that I find it unlikely mankind will get to the point where it’s truly both possible and appealing. Global environmental catastrophe is already underway. I don’t see anyone spending money on Mars missions once things really get bad. I don’t want to repeat all my previous points, but I think the main question I haven’t seen answered here is: Why Mars? If bubble cities are possible than why not put them on Antarctica or even the moon first? Antarctica is covered in darkness for six months. And that won't solve the issues if the planet is threatened by an extinction event. Also considering the enviromental damage done to several habitats on the planet as a result of human expansion, people might object doing the same to the almost untouched continent. Mars days are similar to Earth days, more gravity than the moon, has water in form of ice and it's relatively close compared to other planets in the solar system. The temperature of Mars, while colder than Earth, still allows for temperatures similar to the Earth in certain areas. The gravity is also stronger than the Moon which helps. That being said, the Moon will likely be the first human colony outside the Earth. And there are currently active plans by the US/ESA and China to build a permanent outpost on the Moon.
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