vishspal
Sophomore
@vishspal
Posts: 724
Likes: 208
 
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Post by vishspal on Jan 27, 2023 15:02:09 GMT
Why do you think the DCEU fail?
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Post by moviemouth on Jan 27, 2023 15:15:21 GMT
Rushing the story. Also just bad writing in general.
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Post by James on Jan 27, 2023 15:19:10 GMT
Rushing the story. It can still succeed at being like the MCU if they just focused more on building things up instead of trying to play catch-up.
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Post by kolchak92 on Jan 27, 2023 15:45:45 GMT
I think there was something of a pretentiousness to it that turned people off, which is particularly evident in Man of Steel, Batman vs Superman and Suicide Squad. I think Wonder Woman (2017) didn't have that self-important aura to it, and it wound up being a much better and more popular film.
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Post by Lux on Jan 27, 2023 16:07:11 GMT
I think there was something of a pretentiousness to it that turned people off, which is particularly evident in Man of Steel, Batman vs Superman and Suicide Squad. I think Wonder Woman (2017) didn't have that self-important aura to it, and it wound up being a much better and more popular film. The woman saviour to end all wars isn't pretentious? Also Wonder Woman was poorly made and Man of Steel had better effects but Wonder Woman was definitely pretentious. You need to focus more on the messaging and plot instead of the boobs. |
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Post by politicidal on Jan 27, 2023 16:42:39 GMT
Rushing the story.
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Post by Marv on Jan 27, 2023 17:43:11 GMT
A few different things. Rushing the story, the darker palette, no clear roadmap or trajectory that fans could understand, lack of faith in their own products.
Its like they threw all the ingredients in the stew and immediately tried to eat it and were surprised that nothing was cooked properly.
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Post by Prime etc. on Jan 27, 2023 17:48:11 GMT
Superhero movie fatigue is part of it.
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Jan 27, 2023 18:22:11 GMT
I think other people probably could have handled going from a Superman solo film, to a Batman crossover, to a Wonder Woman origin, to Justice League. Hell, Hollywood used to just make movies regardless of how many characters they had without a series of standalone set-up movies.
The problem was Snyder, who's idea of "fun" was shooting Jimmy Olsen in the face. The guy doesn't like comics unless they have tits and blood, and once said he'd have Batman raped in prison to out-dark Nolan. He said himself he's jaded on the entire concept of superheroes after Watchmen, and compared still believing in non-psychopathic versions of Superman and Batman to being naive about America's war crimes or some shit. This is not someone you build an audience pleasing superhero universe around.
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Post by onethreetwo on Jan 27, 2023 18:25:46 GMT
Besides Snyder rushing things, he had a poor vision. He has an eye for style. His movies and actors look good, but he never had a real long term vision. Instead he acted on impulse and we got a mess.
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Post by Archelaus on Jan 28, 2023 2:24:54 GMT
They didn't do enough solo films before culminating all those characters into one Justice League film. Zack Snyder and DC rushed the series by introducing Batman and Wonder Woman and teasing Justice League all in one film. More films should have been made laying the groundwork and getting to know the characters first.
Also, Snyder's visual style is unique in its own right, but it doesn't work when establishing the DC universe. I didn't like how visually dark Batman v Superman looked. Not to mention, there was a lack of an optimistic tone. I don't necessarily mind if a film is thematically dark, but the DC superheroes should be the light in our darkness.
Lastly, there was a lack of direction after Snyder's plan for a Justice League trilogy was cast aside. They allowed non-DCEU films like Joker and The Batman to be produced (which are good films nevertheless), but there was no plan in motion for the actual in-universe films to culminate into a huge crossover film. Therefore, it's hard for someone like me to get invested into these films when they're all standalone.
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Post by lowtacks86 on Jan 28, 2023 3:22:25 GMT
Well for one Marvel has way more iconic superheroes than DC(Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-man, Hulk), it's prolly why for the longest time the only DC superhero movies we really got were either Batman or Superman, people just don't get seem to get excited as much over the Flash or Green Arrow.
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Post by politicidal on Jan 28, 2023 3:37:52 GMT
Well for one Marvel has way more iconic superheroes than DC(Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-man, Hulk), it's prolly why for the longest time the only DC superhero movies we really got were either Batman or Superman, people just don't get seem to get excited as much over the Flash or Green Arrow. I am a little surprised we never got a half-assed Flash movie back in the 2000s like we did with Catwoman. Apparently we almost got a Green Lantern movie with Jack Black. Oh, WB.  |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jan 28, 2023 4:36:09 GMT
I think other people probably could have handled going from a Superman solo film, to a Batman crossover, to a Wonder Woman origin, to Justice League. Hell, Hollywood used to just make movies regardless of how many characters they had without a series of standalone set-up movies. The problem was Snyder, who's idea of "fun" was shooting Jimmy Olsen in the face. The guy doesn't like comics unless they have tits and blood, and once said he'd have Batman raped in prison to out-dark Nolan. He said himself he's jaded on the entire concept of superheroes after Watchmen, and compared still believing in non-psychopathic versions of Superman and Batman to being naive about America's war crimes or some shit. This is not someone you build an audience pleasing superhero universe around. That’s not exactly what he said. That comment in question pertained to his adaptation of Watchmen. He was saying that Watchmen is a lot darker than TDK, and that in the Watchmen universe, Batman getting raped in prison is a thing that wouldn’t be out of place. The fact that Batman was never sexually assaulted in his movies should be a pretty clear indication that he never intended to have Batman get raped in prison. |
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Post by Marv on Jan 28, 2023 4:36:26 GMT
Well for one Marvel has way more iconic superheroes than DC(Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-man, Hulk), it's prolly why for the longest time the only DC superhero movies we really got were either Batman or Superman, people just don't get seem to get excited as much over the Flash or Green Arrow. Which sucks because Flash and Green Lantern are two comics that I loved, back when I was buying comics. Great rogues galleries, supporting characters and lore. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jan 28, 2023 4:37:04 GMT
Well for one Marvel has way more iconic superheroes than DC(Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-man, Hulk), it's prolly why for the longest time the only DC superhero movies we really got were either Batman or Superman, people just don't get seem to get excited as much over the Flash or Green Arrow. Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU. I wouldn’t say they were particularly iconic. Marvel’s biggest titles back when the MCU began were Spider-Man and the X-Men, and they were tied up at other studios. |
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Post by lowtacks86 on Jan 28, 2023 4:47:10 GMT
Well for one Marvel has way more iconic superheroes than DC(Captain America, Iron Man, Spider-man, Hulk), it's prolly why for the longest time the only DC superhero movies we really got were either Batman or Superman, people just don't get seem to get excited as much over the Flash or Green Arrow. Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU. I wouldn’t say they were particularly iconic. Marvel’s biggest titles back when the MCU began were Spider-Man and the X-Men, and they were tied up at other studios. "Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU" Yes and the Flash and Green Arrow were more like c-listers compared to them. The Captain America shield is highly iconic, I remember plenty of people wearing the shirt (even before the movies). Iron Man was popular enough to get his own cartoon back in the 90s. The same couldn't be said for Green Arrow or Flash, they were mostly relegated to cameos in the 90s Superman cartoon and the Justice League spinoff. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jan 28, 2023 4:50:41 GMT
Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU. I wouldn’t say they were particularly iconic. Marvel’s biggest titles back when the MCU began were Spider-Man and the X-Men, and they were tied up at other studios. "Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU" Yes and the Flash and Green Arrow were more like c-listers compared to them. The Captain America shield is highly iconic, I remember plenty of people wearing the shirt (even before the movies). Iron Man was popular enough to get his own cartoon back in the 90s. The same couldn't be said for Green Arrow or Flash, they were mostly relegated to cameos in the 90s Superman cartoon and the Justice League spinoff. The Flash was no less well known than Iron Man or Captain America. Many people were already familiar with him thanks to the Super Friends cartoon, and he also had a live action show in the early 90s. Plus, he was a major character in the Justice League cartoon from the 2000s. |
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Post by moviebuffbrad on Jan 28, 2023 4:54:47 GMT
I think other people probably could have handled going from a Superman solo film, to a Batman crossover, to a Wonder Woman origin, to Justice League. Hell, Hollywood used to just make movies regardless of how many characters they had without a series of standalone set-up movies. The problem was Snyder, who's idea of "fun" was shooting Jimmy Olsen in the face. The guy doesn't like comics unless they have tits and blood, and once said he'd have Batman raped in prison to out-dark Nolan. He said himself he's jaded on the entire concept of superheroes after Watchmen, and compared still believing in non-psychopathic versions of Superman and Batman to being naive about America's war crimes or some shit. This is not someone you build an audience pleasing superhero universe around. That’s not exactly what he said. That comment in question pertained to his adaptation of Watchmen. He was saying that Watchmen is a lot darker than TDK, and that in the Watchmen universe, Batman getting raped in prison is a thing that wouldn’t be out of place. The fact that Batman was never sexually assaulted in his movies should be a pretty clear indication that he never intended to have Batman get raped in prison. I didn't say he intended to have Batman raped in his Batman movies. Two can split hairs, thisguy. The exact quote for anyone interested: |
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Post by lowtacks86 on Jan 28, 2023 4:55:39 GMT
"Iron Man and Captain America were B-listers before the MCU" Yes and the Flash and Green Arrow were more like c-listers compared to them. The Captain America shield is highly iconic, I remember plenty of people wearing the shirt (even before the movies). Iron Man was popular enough to get his own cartoon back in the 90s. The same couldn't be said for Green Arrow or Flash, they were mostly relegated to cameos in the 90s Superman cartoon and the Justice League spinoff. The Flash was no less well known than Iron Man or Captain America. Many people were already familiar with him thanks to the Super Friends cartoon, and he also had a live action show in the early 90s. Plus, he was a major character in the Justice League cartoon from the 2000s. Yes but being well known isn't the same thing as "iconic", for instance plenty of people know about that awful "Batman and Robin" film, but I wouldn't really call that movie "iconic". If I were to compare the sales for Captain America shirts vs Flash shirts, which do you think is gonna be higher? Captain America fought the Nazis and is an American icon, Flash is...really fast at running? |
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