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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on Jun 8, 2017 15:17:23 GMT
just rolling another one out there...
Is Wonder Woman overhyped?
Don't get me wrong; WB knocked it out of the park with this film. It's a great film, and even the most staunch DCEU detractors would be hard-pressed to spin it any other way.
What I found most impressive about the movie was its commitment to a cohesive tone and the unapologetic assertiveness of its leading lady. Wonder Woman has something most DCEU heroes lack, maturity. I wouldn't be surprised if she took the leadership role in JL from Superman and Batman (who are both too self-involved to lead anything in my opinion).
All that said, comparisons to Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, Oscar contention, and "best solo origin film ever" comments are being thrown around like confetti... Is it really all that and a bag of chips?
I'll step aside if it is because WB knows how to make a masterwork CBM. (I'm hoping Marvel matures to that level some day but, I'm in no rush. You need headroom to grow).
When I saw Batman Begins for the first time, I was transported. Never before (and never again) had the hero's journey been captured in such a nuanced and engaging way. Bale's transformation from Bruce Wayne to Batman was astonishing. There was never a Bruce Wayne. He was always just a flimsy construct keeping an elemental force at bay until it was ready to emerge. Nolan conveys that deftly. I couldn't even analyze the film until much later after seeing it.
I didn't feel that way about Wonder Woman.
My biggest concern is for Jenkins. Hardcore DCEU fans are doing her a disservice by comparing her to iconic names in the genre like Nolan. It forces her to perform equally well, if not better on her next outing. If the barometer is not set accurately from the start, we're setting her up to underperform or, even worse, to fail her next time out. As a woman myself, I don't want to see that happen to an obviously gifted female director.
And then again, there is always the possibilty that she IS the next Christopher Nolan. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
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Post by Skaathar on Jun 8, 2017 16:29:19 GMT
Yes, yes it is. It's a pretty good movie and I enjoyed it quite a bit... but it's definitely getting a lot more praise than it should. Had the main character been male and all gender roles reversed (including a male director), especially if this was an MCU film, I'm sure this would not receive the same amount of "loud" praise. It would still be praised, but not as loudly. If that makes sense.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 8, 2017 18:57:42 GMT
Is Wonder Woman overhyped? No, it's 1 of the best superhero movies ever made and definitely better than any MCU movie. even the most staunch DCEU detractors would be hard-pressed to spin it any other way. ArArArchStanton and formersamhmd are trying to spin it another way. All that said, comparisons to Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, Oscar contention, and "best solo origin film ever" comments are being thrown around like confetti... Is it really all that and a bag of chips?
Will Wonder Woman win the Oscar for Best Picture? Probably not.
But will Wonder Woman be nominated for the Oscar for Best Picture? Well, if this was like the old days (when the Academy nominated only 5 films for Best Picture), then I would say No. But in 2009 the Academy increased the number of films nominated for Best Picture to 10 (ironically because The Dark Knight was snubbed for a Best Picture nomination). So with 10 films being nominated for Best Picture, I would say YES, Wonder Woman will be nominated for the Oscar for Best Picture.
With more and more CBMs being produced, the comic-book movie genre has become a legitimate genre like sci-fi or westerns. Eventually the Academy is going to nominate a CBM for Best Picture. And Wonder Woman gives them a great opportunity to do that because Wonder Woman is more than just the usual CBM.
Wonder Woman is also a period piece movie that focuses on war, a subject that the Academy likes to nominate films for Best Picture. Moreover, Wonder Woman not only focuses on World War I (which hasn't gotten as much coverage in films as World War II) but also does an excellent job of conveying the horrors and brutality of the Great War. It has the main character leaving the safety of her home to go on a journey which she thinks is her destiny but turns into an enlightenment about morality and the nature of humanity. It also has another main character making the ultimate sacrifice and it delivers a powerful and positive message. Those are all themes that the Academy likes to nominate films for Best Picture. And it helps that Wonder Woman is the most-talked about movie of the year.
As for Patty Jenkins, I think she'll be nominated for the Oscar for Best Director just because of all the obstacles she had to overcome to make Wonder Woman. Wonder Woman is not only the first solo female superhero movie in over a decade but also the first $100+ million budget solo female superhero movie ever. And Patty Jenkins' only previous movie credit was an $8 million indie movie. On top of that, MCU let Patty Jenkins go because MCU dictator Kevin Feige wouldn't give her the creative freedom to make a better Thor: The Dark World. Despite all those obstacles and all the pressure (whether fairly or unfairly) of Wonder Woman being labeled as the movie that would either open or shut the door for future female-led superhero movies, Patty Jenkins delivered not only the best female-led superhero movie ever but also 1 of the best superhero movies ever.
So I think Wonder Woman will receive Oscar nominations for:
Best Picture
Best Director
Best Cinematography
Best Costume Design
Best Production Design |
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Post by Rey Kahuka on Jun 8, 2017 19:08:59 GMT
It's great but it's no BB or TDK. It can't be the 'best solo origin film ever' when so much of it was borrowed from CA: TFA. It's the best DCEU flick by a mile, though. Hopefully it shows WB how to make these movies from here on out.
True but I still think the praise is deserved. This is the first successful superhero flick with a female lead, the others have been complete failures. The success of this film virtually guarantees Hollywood will finally give a shot to female led CBMs of higher quality than we've seen in the past. It's an accomplishment no matter how you look at it.
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barkingbaphomet
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Post by barkingbaphomet on Jun 8, 2017 19:38:33 GMT
yeah.
but i don't mind it much when this happens to a movie that's actually good in the first place.
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Post by charzhino on Jun 8, 2017 19:45:09 GMT
People were saying the same thing about Oscar hype, best CBM since the TDK, etc when Logan came out earlier this year. I think the shock that DCEU actually made a good movie has overhyped it somewhat, but filtering all that out it still is a solid film. Only time will give it some perspective as theres too much hyperbole soon as a movie is released. In terms of pure origin stories, I think its up there in the top 3 but behind Batman Begins and X-Men First Class.
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jun 9, 2017 5:35:19 GMT
I don't know why WW is worrying you guys so much. One acclaimed DCEU movie can't topple the MCU's empire.
If anything it helps Marvel. Now the people will want to show up to Captain Marvel a little more.
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 9, 2017 6:05:37 GMT
I don't know why WW is worrying you guys so much. One acclaimed DCEU movie can't topple the MCU's empire. If anything it helps Marvel. Now the people will want to show up to Captain Marvel a little more. The reason why Wonder Woman is worrying all the MCU fans here so much is because Wonder Woman has now set an incredibly high bar for Captain Marvel. Movie watchers are now going to expect Captain Marvel to be as great as Wonder Woman so they're be extremely disappointed when Captain Marvel fails to reach that incredibly high bar set by Wonder Woman. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2017 7:42:10 GMT
just rolling another one out there... Is Wonder Woman overhyped? Don't get me wrong; WB knocked it out of the park with this film. It's a great film, and even the most staunch DCEU detractors would be hard-pressed to spin it any other way. What I found most impressive about the movie was its commitment to a cohesive tone and the unapologetic assertiveness of its leading lady. Wonder Woman has something most DCEU heroes lack, maturity. I wouldn't be surprised if she took the leadership role in JL from Superman and Batman (who are both too self-involved to lead anything in my opinion). All that said, comparisons to Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, Oscar contention, and "best solo origin film ever" comments are being thrown around like confetti... Is it really all that and a bag of chips? I'll step aside if it is because WB knows how to make a masterwork CBM. (I'm hoping Marvel matures to that level some day but, I'm in no rush. You need headroom to grow). When I saw Batman Begins for the first time, I was transported. Never before (and never again) had the hero's journey been captured in such a nuanced and engaging way. Bale's transformation from Bruce Wayne to Batman was astonishing. There was never a Bruce Wayne. He was always just a flimsy construct keeping an elemental force at bay until it was ready to emerge. Nolan conveys that deftly. I couldn't even analyze the film until much later after seeing it. I didn't feel that way about Wonder Woman. My biggest concern is for Jenkins. Hardcore DCEU fans are doing her a disservice by comparing her to iconic names in the genre like Nolan. It forces her to perform equally well, if not better on her next outing. If the barometer is not set accurately from the start, we're setting her up to underperform or, even worse, to fail her next time out. As a woman myself, I don't want to see that happen to an obviously gifted female director. And then again, there is always the possibilty that she IS the next Christopher Nolan. I guess we'll have to wait and see. Yes it's a little overhyped it's really good but it dosen't achieve that legendary status. Being the first good female SH has helped a lot in overlooking the things it didn't get right just yet. You compare with Nolan, and I think this is the first attempt at a CBM by a an awsome director, I expect great things from her and the Second WW, where she already knows what to expect and she will have a pile of money to correct the less than stellar CGI especially in the final fight wich was oh so bad. The 3rd act needs some serious work. So is it one of the best? Sure, why not, but only time will tell now. For me the test of time is the one thing you just can't rush. Now on with Justice League! let's see if the DCEU can maintain this high bar like the MCU has done until now. They proved that they can make a good movie, finally, can they make a good Movie Universe? Right now it's at a mixed (MOS), two awful (SS and BVS) and one Really Good (WW). |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2017 7:50:02 GMT
I don't know why WW is worrying you guys so much. One acclaimed DCEU movie can't topple the MCU's empire. If anything it helps Marvel. Now the people will want to show up to Captain Marvel a little more. The reason why Wonder Woman is worrying all the MCU fans here so much is because Wonder Woman has now set an incredibly high bar for Captain Marvel. Movie watchers are now going to expect Captain Marvel to be as great as Wonder Woman so they're be extremely disappointed when Captain Marvel fails to reach that incredibly high bar set by Wonder Woman. Why that particular one? Is it because it's a female lead? Are you saying WW can't be compared to the likes of Spidey or other male lead SHCBM? Are you saying that a female SH just has to be better than another female SHCBM, never mind the male ones? That's sexist, you PIG FUCKER. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jun 9, 2017 8:02:03 GMT
The reason why Wonder Woman is worrying all the MCU fans here so much is because Wonder Woman has now set an incredibly high bar for Captain Marvel. Movie watchers are now going to expect Captain Marvel to be as great as Wonder Woman so they're be extremely disappointed when Captain Marvel fails to reach that incredibly high bar set by Wonder Woman. Why that particular one? Is it because it's a female lead? Are you saying WW can't be compared to the likes of Spidey or other male lead SHCBM? Are you saying that a female SH just has to be better than another female SHCBM, never mind the male ones? That's sexist, you PIG FUCKER. (along with The Dark Knight and Logan) has an adjusted RT rating among the top 3 CBMs ever made so Wonder Woman has been compared to all the Spider-Man movies and all other male superhero CBMs and Wonder Woman is better than almost all of them (including all the MCU movies). Nevertheless, because Wonder Woman stars a female superhero and was directed by a female Director and is the first good female-led superhero movie, there will inevitably always be comparisons to Wonder Woman for any future female-led superhero movies. That's why there are so many articles every day about Wonder Woman approaching or breaking records for highest-grossing opening weekend BO by a female Director or highest-grossing domestic BO by a female Director or highest-grossing overall BO by a female Director. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2017 8:29:08 GMT
Why that particular one? Is it because it's a female lead? Are you saying WW can't be compared to the likes of Spidey or other male lead SHCBM? Are you saying that a female SH just has to be better than another female SHCBM, never mind the male ones? That's sexist, you PIG FUCKER. (along with The Dark Knight and Logan) has an adjusted RT rating among the top 3 CBMs ever made so Wonder Woman has been compared to all the Spider-Man movies and all other male superhero CBMs and Wonder Woman is better than almost all of them (including all the MCU movies). Nevertheless, because Wonder Woman stars a female superhero and was directed by a female Director and is the first good female-led superhero movie, there will inevitably always be comparisons to Wonder Woman for any future female-led superhero movies. That's why there are so many articles every day about Wonder Woman approaching or breaking records for highest-grossing opening weekend BO by a female Director or highest-grossing domestic BO by a female Director or highest-grossing overall BO by a female Director. Have you seen GOTG? Well you are in it, DRAX. Try to catch some stuff that goes over your head... |
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Post by chatterer on Jun 9, 2017 15:49:30 GMT
No idea about Superman and Batman. She is definetley the alpha when it comes to the pairing with Aquaman and Cyborg.  |
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Post by barkingbaphomet on Jun 9, 2017 16:20:57 GMT
oh gods Cyborg looks like a Transformer  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2017 16:35:54 GMT
I'll let you know... I'm seeing it tonight!  |
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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on Jun 9, 2017 16:40:26 GMT
I'll let you know... I'm seeing it tonight! Hope you enjoy it! It's really good. SaveSave |
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Post by Skaathar on Jun 9, 2017 16:46:20 GMT
No idea about Superman and Batman. She is definetley the alpha when it comes to the pairing with Aquaman and Cyborg. I have a feeling that no one is going to be more alpha than Aquaman. My prediction is after the Aquaman movie comes out, WW and Aquaman will become the new faces of the DCEU, supplanting Superman and Batman. |
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Post by ThatGuy on Jun 9, 2017 17:27:21 GMT
No, it's 1 of the best superhero movies ever made and definitely better than any MCU movie. Okay... See this is what you guys do when you don't want the "rival" studios you don't want to like to be on top. You know the other movies are craptacular, so you push them like they are the best. Then when you actually get a good one, you forget about the other ones and push the actual good one. Even going so far as to say it should win a bunch of Oscars. Really? Is this how the game is played? I wouldn't be surprised if you were LukeLovesFilm's DC persona. |
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Post by seahawksraawk00 on Jun 9, 2017 23:53:23 GMT
I don't know why WW is worrying you guys so much. One acclaimed DCEU movie can't topple the MCU's empire. If anything it helps Marvel. Now the people will want to show up to Captain Marvel a little more. The reason why Wonder Woman is worrying all the MCU fans here so much is because Wonder Woman has now set an incredibly high bar for Captain Marvel. Movie watchers are now going to expect Captain Marvel to be as great as Wonder Woman so they're be extremely disappointed when Captain Marvel fails to reach that incredibly high bar set by Wonder Woman. Dude, Marvel isn't going to have a problem with Captain Marvel because Wonder Woman is doing good. If anything, it probably boost's Marvel confidence in doing a female-lead superhero film. Why should Captain Marvel try to exceed Wonder Woman. They'll do there own thing. And I would say Marvel takes risks as well. Netflix did Jessica Jones. Can you honestly say you knew who Jessica Jones was before it even announced they were doing a show for her?? I know I didn't. I know its not a movie, but it is a Marvel female-lead. Seriously, all you're doing on here is being a pretentious jerkoff, especially by going on the MCU boards on here and saying user's opinions are wrong because they're Marvel fans. Seriously, grow the fuck up |
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Post by Atom(ica) Discord on Jun 10, 2017 0:20:55 GMT
The reason why Wonder Woman is worrying all the MCU fans here so much is because Wonder Woman has now set an incredibly high bar for Captain Marvel. Movie watchers are now going to expect Captain Marvel to be as great as Wonder Woman so they're be extremely disappointed when Captain Marvel fails to reach that incredibly high bar set by Wonder Woman. Dude, Marvel isn't going to have a problem with Captain Marvel because Wonder Woman is doing good. If anything, it probably boost's Marvel confidence in doing a female-lead superhero film. Why should Captain Marvel try to exceed Wonder Woman. They'll do there own thing. And I would say Marvel takes risks as well. Netflix did Jessica Jones. Can you honestly say you knew who Jessica Jones was before it even announced they were doing a show for her?? I know I didn't. I know its not a movie, but it is a Marvel female-lead. Seriously, all you're doing on here is being a pretentious jerkoff, especially by going on the MCU boards on here and saying user's opinions are wrong because they're Marvel fans. Seriously, grow the fuck upDon't be hard on him. The so-called DC-Fan can't imagine the Marvel/DC relationship in anything other than an adversarial context. He's quite limited that way. He is the jilted lover who feels scorned by an old ex who hardly even remembers ever being in a relationship with him. There's nothing pretentious about the wizard of fandom lies. DC-Fan is coarse and completely unrefined. His world is one of trivial fantasies and petty rivalries. In the face of climate change, duplicitous politicians, mobile devices that glow and demand your attention ceaselessly, global instability and deep uncertainty about the future - DC-Fan believe that somehow, people are "worried" about Wonder Woman. It's best to let his psychosis play out unhampered by little things like reality. SaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSaveSave |
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