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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 20:51:33 GMT
Sorry, just no.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 20:53:18 GMT
I'm sure you have some reason other than sexism to oppose the new Doctor.
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 20:59:08 GMT
I'm sure you have some reason other than sexism to oppose the new Doctor. What a surprisingly predictable response. I have always been opposed to gender and race swapping of main and central characters. I would say the same had the Doctor been female for 50 years.
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Post by gadreel on Jul 16, 2017 21:01:57 GMT
I'm sure you have some reason other than sexism to oppose the new Doctor. What a surprisingly predictable response. I have always been opposed to gender and race swapping of main and central characters. I would say the same had the Doctor been female for 50 years. Except that the doctor changes form frequently, and it is canon that timelords can regene as either gender, so there is no swapping of the main character.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 21:05:19 GMT
I'm sure you have some reason other than sexism to oppose the new Doctor. What a surprisingly predictable response. I have always been opposed to gender and race swapping of main and central characters. I would say the same had the Doctor been female for 50 years. So, sexism with a willful admission that you would have also responded with racism had the new doctor been Paterson Joseph or Richard Ayoade and with both sexism and racism had Michaela Coel been chosen. Okay then, I'm glad that's settled.
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 21:07:07 GMT
What a surprisingly predictable response. I have always been opposed to gender and race swapping of main and central characters. I would say the same had the Doctor been female for 50 years. Except that the doctor changes form frequently, and it is canon that timelords can regene as either gender, so there is no swapping of the main character. That is a cop out. Canonically, The Doctor is over 1300 years old, has had 13 forms, was born male but suddenly now becomes female. Story wise it makes no sense.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 21:10:50 GMT
Except that the doctor changes form frequently, and it is canon that timelords can regene as either gender, so there is no swapping of the main character. That is a cop out. Canonically, The Doctor is over 1300 years old, has had 13 forms, was born male but suddenly now becomes female. Story wise it makes no sense. It's already been established that within Timelord society it does make sense. Timelords changing gender when regenerating was even mentioned in the classic series.
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 21:12:41 GMT
What a surprisingly predictable response. I have always been opposed to gender and race swapping of main and central characters. I would say the same had the Doctor been female for 50 years. So, sexism with a willful admission that you would have also responded with racism had the new doctor been Paterson Joseph or Richard Ayoade and with both sexism and racism had Michaela Coel been chosen. Okay then, I'm glad that's settled. Very well done. Are the women who don't like the gender swap also sexist? Internalised misogyny? Or is it only sexist when men do it? If I objected to Blade being rebooted with Chris Evans, would that also make me racist? If a black guy objected would he be racist? Were the people who objected to Tilda Swinton being cast as The Ancient one both sexist and racist? Your labels impress me not.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 21:17:30 GMT
So, sexism with a willful admission that you would have also responded with racism had the new doctor been Paterson Joseph or Richard Ayoade and with both sexism and racism had Michaela Coel been chosen. Okay then, I'm glad that's settled. Very well done. Are the women who don't like the gender swap also sexist? Internalised misogyny? Or is it only sexist when men do it? If I objected to Blade being rebooted with Chris Evans, would that also make me racist? If a black guy objected would he be racist? Were the people who objected to Tilda Swinton being cast as The Ancient one both sexist and racist? Your labels impress me not. Of course it doesn't impress you, like all racists and sexists you're immune to reality and only see things the way you want to see them. You can't even comprehend the difference between historically privileged groups and historically marginalized ones.
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Post by gadreel on Jul 16, 2017 21:19:20 GMT
Except that the doctor changes form frequently, and it is canon that timelords can regene as either gender, so there is no swapping of the main character. That is a cop out. Canonically, The Doctor is over 1300 years old, has had 13 forms, was born male but suddenly now becomes female. Story wise it makes no sense. It's not a cop out at all, the Timelords can regenerate to any gender they desire, the only thing to be shocked about is that this has not happened earlier. And you can't critique the story until you have seen it, meaning until the new doctor is debuted you won't know how they write her in
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 21:22:30 GMT
Very well done. Are the women who don't like the gender swap also sexist? Internalised misogyny? Or is it only sexist when men do it? If I objected to Blade being rebooted with Chris Evans, would that also make me racist? If a black guy objected would he be racist? Were the people who objected to Tilda Swinton being cast as The Ancient one both sexist and racist? Your labels impress me not. Of course it doesn't impress you, like all racists and sexists you're immune to reality and only see things the way you want to see them. You can't even comprehend the difference between historically privileged groups and historically marginalized ones. So not wanting a female character to be replaced by a male one and vice versa. And not wanting a black character to be replaced by a white one and vise versa, makes me both sexist and racist. Absolutely brilliant, Cash, just fantastic. So lets see if I can figure out how not to be racist. I can want a white character to be replaced, but not a black one. I am not allowed to treat the characters equally, I have to give more respect to the history of the black character. You lot are insane. Question, if The Doctor had been a black women for 50 years and I objected to her being recast as a white man, would you call me a racist sexist?
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Post by Edward-Elizabeth-Hitler on Jul 16, 2017 21:34:16 GMT
Lol. Surely you stopped watching 2 series ago when the master came back as a woman?
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 21:34:59 GMT
Of course it doesn't impress you, like all racists and sexists you're immune to reality and only see things the way you want to see them. You can't even comprehend the difference between historically privileged groups and historically marginalized ones. So not wanting a female character to be replaced by a male one and vice versa. And not wanting a black character to be replaced by a white one and vise versa, makes me both sexist and racist. Absolutely brilliant, Cash, just fantastic. So lets see if I can figure out how not to be racist. I can want a white character to be replaced, but not a black one. I am not allowed to treat the characters equally, I have to give more respect to the history of the black character. You lot are insane. Question, if The Doctor had been a black women for 50 years and I objected to her being recast as a white man, would you call me a racist sexist? Ignoring history and claiming you are in favor of equality - keep it up, man. That's revealing as fuck. You're no different than the idiots on the Doctor Who board who constantly complain that new companion Bill mentions her homosexuality in every episode but had no problem with Amy's extremely overt heterosexuality in every episode. Like i said, you are simply incapable of understanding the difference between privileged and marginalized groups and actually believe it's equality for them to be treated the same so long as it's your definition of "same". I'm not going to bother trying to convince you differently because I already know it's a waste of time, but I will thoroughly enjoy you continuing to exhibit more bigotry while being totally oblivious to the fact that's exactly what you're doing. Jodie Whittaker may end up being my least favorite Doctor or she could end up being my favorite (although unseating Ecclestone would be a tall order) but whether she ranks high or low will be in no way related to the fact that she's a woman. I consider Rory a better companion than Martha but it has nothing to do with him being a white male and her being a black female. You have a history of finding it difficult to discuss most topics without some form of bigotry shining through while you are completely bewildered how anybody could find anything bigoted about your obvious bigotry. EDIT: You also frame the entire discussion incorrectly by habit. It has nothing to do with wanting a character to be replaced by another character of any race, sex, sexuality, whatever...it's about not caring as long as the actor can do the job correctly. That's what will ultimately be the decision maker for whether non-sexists like Whittaker's portrayal of the Doctor. Sexists have already decided they're against it before she's even filmed one scene.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 21:41:08 GMT
Lol. Surely you stopped watching 2 series ago when the master came back as a woman? He must have really lost his shit in Hell Bent when a white male Time Lord General regenerated and became a black female.
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PanLeo
Sophomore
@saoradh
Posts: 919
Likes: 53
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Post by PanLeo on Jul 16, 2017 21:53:58 GMT
I guess it will be really weird anD I am not a fan of the idea but your reaction is over the top.
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 22:25:22 GMT
So not wanting a female character to be replaced by a male one and vice versa. And not wanting a black character to be replaced by a white one and vise versa, makes me both sexist and racist. Absolutely brilliant, Cash, just fantastic. So lets see if I can figure out how not to be racist. I can want a white character to be replaced, but not a black one. I am not allowed to treat the characters equally, I have to give more respect to the history of the black character. You lot are insane. Question, if The Doctor had been a black women for 50 years and I objected to her being recast as a white man, would you call me a racist sexist? Ignoring history and claiming you are in favor of equality - keep it up, man. That's revealing as fuck. You're no different than the idiots on the Doctor Who board who constantly complain that new companion Bill mentions her homosexuality in every episode but had no problem with Amy's extremely overt heterosexuality in every episode. Like i said, you are simply incapable of understanding the difference between privileged and marginalized groups and actually believe it's equality for them to be treated the same so long as it's your definition of "same". I'm not going to bother trying to convince you differently because I already know it's a waste of time, but I will thoroughly enjoy you continuing to exhibit more bigotry while being totally oblivious to the fact that's exactly what you're doing. Jodie Whittaker may end up being my least favorite Doctor or she could end up being my favorite (although unseating Ecclestone would be a tall order) but whether she ranks high or low will be in no way related to the fact that she's a woman. I consider Rory a better companion than Martha but it has nothing to do with him being a white male and her being a black female. You have a history of finding it difficult to discuss most topics without some form of bigotry shining through while you are completely bewildered how anybody could find anything bigoted about your obvious bigotry. EDIT: You also frame the entire discussion incorrectly by habit. It has nothing to do with wanting a character to be replaced by another character of any race, sex, sexuality, whatever...it's about not caring as long as the actor can do the job correctly. That's what will ultimately be the decision maker for whether non-sexists like Whittaker's portrayal of the Doctor. Sexists have already decided they're against it before she's even filmed one scene. Your nations history isn't the same as my nations history. What part of British history am I ignoring? Yes, very telling that you seem unable to distinguish between different nations with different histories, different demographics and different social dynamics. Ah, the privilege bullshit again. No, I'm not interested in your social justice approach to equality. I'll stick with my approach of treating people as I find them and not assuming I'm better than others based on melanin levels. When I was growing up, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air was one of my favourite shows. If you suggested rebooting that with a white family I would kick and scream. Being black was an essential part of those characters, from Carlton being "not black enough" to Uncle Phil being an "Uncle Tom" to Hilary being "too pale" to the family losing their shit when Vivien's sister married a white guy. But I guess that no show could ever do the reverse and have a white character who's backstory is based on growing up in a white community, thus would have to fundamentally change if you changed the race or gender. But If I did complain about a Fresh Prince reboot, you wouldn't call me racist. Because you're a bigot, you think non whites are somehow less than others. That they cannot have anything of their own and it must be given to them by whitey. I'll stick to respecting characters and works based on their merits and defend them regardless of race or gender, you carry on protecting those helpless, agency less, non white males. While calling me racist.
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Post by johnblutarsky on Jul 16, 2017 22:44:23 GMT
...the Timelords can regenerate to any gender they desire... Hmmm. To me, it always seemed that the regeneration was a random roll of the dice. I didn't think The Doctor could purposely choose young, old, male, female, ginger, not ginger, etc.
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Post by theoncomingstorm on Jul 16, 2017 22:46:32 GMT
Ignoring history and claiming you are in favor of equality - keep it up, man. That's revealing as fuck. You're no different than the idiots on the Doctor Who board who constantly complain that new companion Bill mentions her homosexuality in every episode but had no problem with Amy's extremely overt heterosexuality in every episode. Like i said, you are simply incapable of understanding the difference between privileged and marginalized groups and actually believe it's equality for them to be treated the same so long as it's your definition of "same". I'm not going to bother trying to convince you differently because I already know it's a waste of time, but I will thoroughly enjoy you continuing to exhibit more bigotry while being totally oblivious to the fact that's exactly what you're doing. Jodie Whittaker may end up being my least favorite Doctor or she could end up being my favorite (although unseating Ecclestone would be a tall order) but whether she ranks high or low will be in no way related to the fact that she's a woman. I consider Rory a better companion than Martha but it has nothing to do with him being a white male and her being a black female. You have a history of finding it difficult to discuss most topics without some form of bigotry shining through while you are completely bewildered how anybody could find anything bigoted about your obvious bigotry. EDIT: You also frame the entire discussion incorrectly by habit. It has nothing to do with wanting a character to be replaced by another character of any race, sex, sexuality, whatever...it's about not caring as long as the actor can do the job correctly. That's what will ultimately be the decision maker for whether non-sexists like Whittaker's portrayal of the Doctor. Sexists have already decided they're against it before she's even filmed one scene. Your nations history isn't the same as my nations history. What part of British history am I ignoring? Yes, very telling that you seem unable to distinguish between different nations with different histories, different demographics and different social dynamics. Ah, the privilege bullshit again. No, I'm not interested in your social justice approach to equality. I'll stick with my approach of treating people as I find them and not assuming I'm better than others based on melanin levels. When I was growing up, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air was one of my favourite shows. If you suggested rebooting that with a white family I would kick and scream. Being black was an essential part of those characters, from Carlton being "not black enough" to Uncle Phil being an "Uncle Tom" to Hilary being "too pale" to the family losing their shit when Vivien's sister married a white guy. But I guess that no show could ever do the reverse and have a white character who's backstory is based on growing up in a white community, thus would have to fundamentally change if you changed the race or gender. But If I did complain about a Fresh Prince reboot, you wouldn't call me racist. Because you're a bigot, you think non whites are somehow less than others. That they cannot have anything of their own and it must be given to them by whitey. I'll stick to respecting characters and works based on their merits and defend them regardless of race or gender, you carry on protecting those helpless, agency less, non white males. While calling me racist. Good luck with that man. I'm sure it will be convincing to the other MRA and the "I'm not racist because I like comedies about black people" types.
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Post by thorshairspray on Jul 16, 2017 22:51:10 GMT
Your nations history isn't the same as my nations history. What part of British history am I ignoring? Yes, very telling that you seem unable to distinguish between different nations with different histories, different demographics and different social dynamics. Ah, the privilege bullshit again. No, I'm not interested in your social justice approach to equality. I'll stick with my approach of treating people as I find them and not assuming I'm better than others based on melanin levels. When I was growing up, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air was one of my favourite shows. If you suggested rebooting that with a white family I would kick and scream. Being black was an essential part of those characters, from Carlton being "not black enough" to Uncle Phil being an "Uncle Tom" to Hilary being "too pale" to the family losing their shit when Vivien's sister married a white guy. But I guess that no show could ever do the reverse and have a white character who's backstory is based on growing up in a white community, thus would have to fundamentally change if you changed the race or gender. But If I did complain about a Fresh Prince reboot, you wouldn't call me racist. Because you're a bigot, you think non whites are somehow less than others. That they cannot have anything of their own and it must be given to them by whitey. I'll stick to respecting characters and works based on their merits and defend them regardless of race or gender, you carry on protecting those helpless, agency less, non white males. While calling me racist. Good luck with that man. I'm sure it will be convincing to the other MRA and the "I'm not racist because I like comedies about black people" types. Oh, MRA now? Brilliant and nice strawman. Keep up that bigotry of low expectations.
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The Lost One
Junior Member
@lostkiera
Posts: 2,695
Likes: 1,331
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Post by The Lost One on Jul 16, 2017 22:52:39 GMT
When I was growing up, The Fresh Prince of Bel Air was one of my favourite shows. If you suggested rebooting that with a white family I would kick and scream. Being black was an essential part of those characters, from Carlton being "not black enough" to Uncle Phil being an "Uncle Tom" to Hilary being "too pale" to the family losing their shit when Vivien's sister married a white guy. But as you say the characters of the Fresh Prince being black was integral to the show. I don't think the Doctor's gender has ever been that important. S/he's just happened to be male in his/her past incarnations.
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