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Post by _ on Jul 24, 2017 21:47:02 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 22:46:13 GMT
That still doesn't sound lightened enough to avert the psychological effects I just mentioned. I don't disagree. But I think the one big fight might not be in view of the public, so at least he doesn't have to deal with the public fallout. The internal strife? I can't say, but if you watch the SDCC Trailer, Batman says "Superman inspired people to be the best versions of themselves." (Or something like that) and that was in NO WAY shown in either of the Superman films...so either that is something they are establishing in JL (some sort of news montage with people doing acts of kindness in Supe's name or something.) OR, they are just retconning and hoping we don't notice...which potentially helps with the psychological problems. WB does sound like the kind of company that'd assume their audience is stupid with only the memory of a goldfish. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 23:31:30 GMT
Exactly.
They didn't earn it. It carried zero emotion weight and was completely wasted. It's a prime example of how bad the writing for DC has been and there are numerous examples that have contributed to the poor reception of the entire brand.
I agree that Quicksilver's death in AoU carried zero emotion weight and was completely wasted. It's a prime example of how bad the writing for AoU was and there are numerous examples that have contributed to the poor reception of that film. Are all DC fans are stupid as you? Your attempts at trying to twist our issues with the death of Superman by bringing up Quicksilver just fail, because of the huge difference in prestige and importance the two characters have. Superman is... Superman. He's the Big Blue Boyscout, THE SUPERHERO. He's been the face of the band since the 30s, our grandparents/great grandparents were young, and survived through the decades pretty well. He's practically one of DC's mascots and the first hero introduced in the DCEU, therefore one of its frontrunners. Quicksilver is just a member of an ensemble, and... that's about it. He has neither Superman's status nor his importance to his universe. Killing off Quicksilver in a film where he was just a supporting player, anyway, is in no way equivalent to killing off Superman in just his second appearance in a cinematic universe that's being built off a film he was the star of. Troll smarter next time. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jul 24, 2017 23:47:38 GMT
After BvS made the controversial choice to kill Superman, not many people were on board with the direction of the franchise. I thought that while the choice was surprisingly ballsy, it also didn't really earn it. Not to mention that now they can't really use the Death of Superman story again. I believe that the way they bring back Superman will dictate how well Justice League is received. If it's inspiring and shocking, then it could truly lift the whole movie. If they botch it, then the whole movie may be ruined. I hope it's a kick-ass, inspiring scene that makes us all remember why we fell in love with the character to begin with as a kid. 100% agree. Unfortunately, he will return as a villain at first. I'm purposely trying to stay out of the loop on all of this, but are we sure that this leak about an evil Superman isn't just Bizarro? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2017 23:50:29 GMT
100% agree. Unfortunately, he will return as a villain at first. I'm purposely trying to stay out of the loop on all of this, but are we sure that this leak about an evil Superman isn't just Bizarro? Its part of the character lore, dude. That's how we know its coming. And no one likes Bizarro, anyway. Nobody would be stupid enough to uuuu... Oh, right, Snyder's dumb enough to use Bizarro. Okay, never mind. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jul 24, 2017 23:58:24 GMT
I'm purposely trying to stay out of the loop on all of this, but are we sure that this leak about an evil Superman isn't just Bizarro? Its part of the character lore, dude. That's how we know its coming. And no one likes Bizarro, anyway. Nobody would be stupid enough to uuuu... Oh, right, Snyder's dumb enough to use Bizarro. Okay, never mind. If it's part of the lore then what's the issue? I just don't think you like the character, which is fine, but I don't get why you try to ruin it for everyone else. And Bizarro Superman can work if it's done well. It's a simple yet effective premise if it's handled right. "But Snyder and WB will never tell any story well. They're dumb." There you go. I saved you the trouble of replying. |
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Post by _ on Jul 25, 2017 0:00:39 GMT
I agree that Quicksilver's death in AoU carried zero emotion(al) weight and was completely wasted. It's a prime example of how bad the writing for AoU was and there are numerous examples that have contributed to the poor reception of that film. "Are all DC fans are stupid as you?" I never said I was a DC fan you illiterate fucking retard. "Quicksilver is just a member of an ensemble, and... that's about it." I already agreed with you that it carried zero emotion(al) weight, was completely wasted, and was bad writing, moron.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 0:03:20 GMT
"Are all DC fans are stupid as you?" I never said I was a DC fan you illiterate fucking retard. "Quicksilver is just a member of an ensemble, and... that's about it." I already agreed with you that it carried zero emotion(al) weight, was completely wasted, and was bad writing, moron. Learn to format a reply correctly, moron. Your use of the laughing face Smiley falls flat on its ass because of you replying INSIDE of the quote. You're definitely a DCEU fan. You're just too stupid not to be. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 0:10:19 GMT
Learn to format a reply correctly, moron. Your use of the laughing face Smiley falls flat on its ass because of you replying INSIDE of the quote. You're definitely a DCEU fan. You're just too stupid not to be. Fuck you cocksucking faggot. Awww... Did I hurt your wittle feewing, baby? Need me to kiss it better? |
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Post by Larcen26 on Jul 25, 2017 15:14:54 GMT
100% agree. Unfortunately, he will return as a villain at first. I'm purposely trying to stay out of the loop on all of this, but are we sure that this leak about an evil Superman isn't just Bizarro? I don't think there's a leak... It's mainly an assumption based on Snyder's history mixed with Superman lore. Like I said above, it seems like having Steppenwolf revive Superman as a weapon fits better into the overall narrative. The other two options are: 1. Batman digs him up and tries to bring him back. This doesn't seem likely given how he acted at the end of BvS. He seemed content to let him Rest in Peace. Though the image from the SDCC trailer shows him looking at a hologram of Supes, and I could see that moment be the one where he decides to do it, either out of guilt or out of knowing they will need him to stop Steppenwolf. Though Bruce could go to Lex to find out how he made Doomsday to use as a basis. That gives Lex something to do in the film. 2. The Codex just fixes him and he comes back. This seems possible given the whole "floating dirt" thing. But I have no idea how they fix how completely "Deus Ex Machina" it is. "Hey look, Superman's here!" But the Sun is so important, I don't see how it works with him buried. And a possible third: 3. A hybrid of the two: My thought for this is that Lois brings Bruce (and maybe Diana) to the fortress, they can get the information about the Codex there and maybe then they dig him up and leave him in the sun for a while. Another version of this is that maybe Abin Sur shows up and gives them information on Kryptonians. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 15:34:25 GMT
Its part of the character lore, dude. That's how we know its coming. And no one likes Bizarro, anyway. Nobody would be stupid enough to uuuu... Oh, right, Snyder's dumb enough to use Bizarro. Okay, never mind. If it's part of the lore then what's the issue? I just don't think you like the character, which is fine, but I don't get why you try to ruin it for everyone else. And Bizarro Superman can work if it's done well. It's a simple yet effective premise if it's handled right. "But Snyder and WB will never tell any story well. They're dumb." There you go. I saved you the trouble of replying. I adore the real Superman. Not this cold, distant Pseudoman Snyder stuck us with. I wanted to have a cinematic Superman for my generation, and I still don't have one between Singer and Snyder. The Superman of my generation is the Bruce Timm's animated Superman, because its becoming increasingly clear that no one who actually makes movies knows how to do Superman well. |
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Post by Larcen26 on Jul 25, 2017 15:46:58 GMT
If it's part of the lore then what's the issue? I just don't think you like the character, which is fine, but I don't get why you try to ruin it for everyone else. And Bizarro Superman can work if it's done well. It's a simple yet effective premise if it's handled right. "But Snyder and WB will never tell any story well. They're dumb." There you go. I saved you the trouble of replying. I adore the real Superman. Not this cold, distant Pseudoman Snyder stuck us with. I wanted to have a cinematic Superman for my generation, and I still don't have one between Singer and Snyder. The Superman of my generation is the Bruce Timm's animated Superman, because its becoming increasingly clear that no one who actually makes movies knows how to do Superman well. It's because of his reputation as "The Big Blue Boy Scout" Captain America is 1,000 times more of a Boy Scout than Superman is, and yet never gets saddled with that moniker like it is a bad thing. It's not cool to like Superman. For the record, I am not opposed to the concept they are using for Superman...one who is finding his place in an alien world. One who is a little more distant, I'm cool with that as a version of his Origin story. The problem is that they never show him being heroic. Not a single scene in either film shows him saving anyone (Other than Lois) in the Superman suit. He has one shot of flying into frame with a girl from a fire, but nothing of him actually saving her...just implying he did...it's far more important to Snyder for the people to be shown worshiping him. The most "Superman" moment in either film is the fantastic Oil Rig sequence...which is before he becomes Superman. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 15:59:54 GMT
I adore the real Superman. Not this cold, distant Pseudoman Snyder stuck us with. I wanted to have a cinematic Superman for my generation, and I still don't have one between Singer and Snyder. The Superman of my generation is the Bruce Timm's animated Superman, because its becoming increasingly clear that no one who actually makes movies knows how to do Superman well. It's because of his reputation as "The Big Blue Boy Scout" Captain America is 1,000 times more of a Boy Scout than Superman is, and yet never gets saddled with that moniker like it is a bad thing. It's not cool to like Superman. For the record, I am not opposed to the concept they are using for Superman...one who is finding his place in an alien world. One who is a little more distant, I'm cool with that as a version of his Origin story. The problem is that they never show him being heroic. Not a single scene in either film shows him saving anyone (Other than Lois) in the Superman suit. He has one shot of flying into frame with a girl from a fire, but nothing of him actually saving her...just implying he did...it's far more important to Snyder for the people to be shown worshiping him. The most "Superman" moment in either film is the fantastic Oil Rig sequence...which is before he becomes Superman. It wasn't cool to like Captain America, either, until the MCU, and yet Marvel Studios made it cool to like him. WB/DC could have made it cool to like Superman as he's supposed to be if they were willing to try. Well, I AM opposed to this shit Pseudoman we got stuck with. He sucks. Superman isn't supposed to be cold, distant, or alien. He was raised in Kansas, and his mom and pop raised him right. That's why he's a hero who uses his powers responsibly. Bruce Timm made him a relatable, likeable character quite readily. Snyder has no excuse. |
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Post by DC-Fan on Jul 25, 2017 17:04:08 GMT
It's because of his reputation as "The Big Blue Boy Scout" Captain America is 1,000 times more of a Boy Scout than Superman is, and yet never gets saddled with that moniker like it is a bad thing. It's not cool to like Superman. For the record, I am not opposed to the concept they are using for Superman...one who is finding his place in an alien world. One who is a little more distant, I'm cool with that as a version of his Origin story. The problem is that they never show him being heroic. Not a single scene in either film shows him saving anyone (Other than Lois) in the Superman suit. He has one shot of flying into frame with a girl from a fire, but nothing of him actually saving her...just implying he did...it's far more important to Snyder for the people to be shown worshiping him. The most "Superman" moment in either film is the fantastic Oil Rig sequence...which is before he becomes Superman. It wasn't cool to like Captain America, either, until the MCU, and yet Marvel Studios made it cool to like him. Got news for you. It isn't cool to aid and abet a murderer to escape from the authorities. This isn't like the days of the Old West when outlaws were considered legends. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 17:06:47 GMT
It wasn't cool to like Captain America, either, until the MCU, and yet Marvel Studios made it cool to like him. Got news for you. It isn't cool to aid and abet a murderer to escape from the authorities. This isn't like the days of the Old West when outlaws were considered legends. What does the Batfleck have to do with this? |
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Post by sostie on Jul 25, 2017 18:13:12 GMT
It wasn't cool to like Captain America, either, until the MCU, and yet Marvel Studios made it cool to like him. Got news for you. It isn't cool to aid and abet a murderer to escape from the authorities. This isn't like the days of the Old West when outlaws were considered legends. However it is cool to have a murdering government official form a team made up of of hardened criminals and have them do her bidding. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 18:18:47 GMT
Got news for you. It isn't cool to aid and abet a murderer to escape from the authorities. This isn't like the days of the Old West when outlaws were considered legends. However it is cool to have a murdering government official form a team made up of of hardened criminals and have them do her bidding. And a demon witch that gets loose and murders a whole city full of innocents. |
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Post by sdrew13163 on Jul 25, 2017 23:19:09 GMT
If it's part of the lore then what's the issue? I just don't think you like the character, which is fine, but I don't get why you try to ruin it for everyone else. And Bizarro Superman can work if it's done well. It's a simple yet effective premise if it's handled right. "But Snyder and WB will never tell any story well. They're dumb." There you go. I saved you the trouble of replying. I adore the real Superman. Not this cold, distant Pseudoman Snyder stuck us with. I wanted to have a cinematic Superman for my generation, and I still don't have one between Singer and Snyder. The Superman of my generation is the Bruce Timm's animated Superman, because its becoming increasingly clear that no one who actually makes movies knows how to do Superman well. I like the new Superman approach enough to be interested for the future. I don't know if it was the right way to go, but I also think they've added a layer of complexity that wasn't there previously. It's an experiment that I can admire for ambition. As for the Bruce Timm Justice League, I love it as well. Somehow he portrayed every character absolutely perfectly and he portrayed the team dynamic better than anything ever, other than maybe The Avengers in 2012. The Donner movies are great. They are both classics. Yet if they were released today, they would flop hard. I wouldn't want it that way, but the audience is just different now. That's why WB decided to shake up Superman, for better or worse. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2017 23:22:48 GMT
I adore the real Superman. Not this cold, distant Pseudoman Snyder stuck us with. I wanted to have a cinematic Superman for my generation, and I still don't have one between Singer and Snyder. The Superman of my generation is the Bruce Timm's animated Superman, because its becoming increasingly clear that no one who actually makes movies knows how to do Superman well. I like the new Superman approach enough to be interested for the future. I don't know if it was the right way to go, but I also think they've added a layer of complexity that wasn't there previously. It's an experiment that I can admire for ambition. As for the Bruce Timm Justice League, I love it as well. Somehow he portrayed every character absolutely perfectly and he portrayed the team dynamic better than anything ever, other than maybe The Avengers in 2012. The Donner movies are great. They are both classics. Yet if they were released today, they would flop hard. I wouldn't want it that way, but the audience is just different now. That's why WB decided to shake up Superman, for better or worse. No, they added more angst. That is not the same thing as complexity. Bruce Timm's Superman had ten times the depth of Snyder's Pseudoman. What ambition? They were just copying Nolan's Dark Knight trilogy? There was no experimenting around. They thought they had a sure thing. I'll say it again: if Marvel can make Captain America cool, WB/DC can make Superman, as he's intended to be, cool as well. I'm not budging. |
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Post by thisguy4000 on Jul 25, 2017 23:42:12 GMT
I don't think there's a leak... It's mainly an assumption based on Snyder's history mixed with Superman lore. Like I said above, it seems like having Steppenwolf revive Superman as a weapon fits better into the overall narrative. The other two options are: 1. Batman digs him up and tries to bring him back. This doesn't seem likely given how he acted at the end of BvS. He seemed content to let him Rest in Peace. Though the image from the SDCC trailer shows him looking at a hologram of Supes, and I could see that moment be the one where he decides to do it, either out of guilt or out of knowing they will need him to stop Steppenwolf. Though Bruce could go to Lex to find out how he made Doomsday to use as a basis. That gives Lex something to do in the film. 2. The Codex just fixes him and he comes back. This seems possible given the whole "floating dirt" thing. But I have no idea how they fix how completely "Deus Ex Machina" it is. "Hey look, Superman's here!" But the Sun is so important, I don't see how it works with him buried. And a possible third: 3. A hybrid of the two: My thought for this is that Lois brings Bruce (and maybe Diana) to the fortress, they can get the information about the Codex there and maybe then they dig him up and leave him in the sun for a while. Another version of this is that maybe Abin Sur shows up and gives them information on Kryptonians. The leak was from someone on Reddit who apparently saw a trailer that had Superman stopping Bruce in the Batmobile in the midst of a battle. The poster said that Superman had a beard and red eyes, with an evil-looking grin. Again, just because it wasn't in this most recent trailer doesn't mean that it won't be in the movie. I just happen to think it's fake. The latest trailer gave me the impression that Superman won't actually start off evil in the film. Of course, that's assuming that Superman is the one Alfred is talking to. |
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